Studer 169 Question

[user 37518]

l

 

[cuelist]

I want to use a ballancer after the EQ which converts from -10dbu unbal. to +4dbu...

But all the circuitry you are showing and talking about is before the EQ - what's up?  ???

 

[1954U1]

Ohhh yeah i forgot to mention that, the fader is before the eq!, thats another reason why i want to keep the fader at 0 db, how ever i plan to take the output after the eq

A quick reply:
do you know that on your 169 input module you can re-arrange the path of your signal via the jumpers on the board?
[I mean, insert before eq or fader, after eq or fader, fader before eq, after eq.. all of that is documented in the official service-manual and in the addons.
if you want I can extract the significant pages and link them here]

 

[abbey road d enfer]

You can connect the negative pole of C26 to the positive pole of C34 and disconnect pretty much everything in between (essentially the fader and C31).

 

[1954U1]

A quick reply:
do you know that on your 169 input module you can re-arrange the path of your signal via the jumpers on the board?
[I mean, insert before eq or fader, after eq or fader, fader before eq, after eq.. all of that is documented in the official service-manual and in the addons.
if you want I can extract the significant pages and link them here]

Yes i have the manual, and yes i've checked the mods, as long as i can tell you can put the fader before or after the filter, but theres not any documentation explaining about placing the fader after the eq

Hi Dualflip,
in the Studer manual's page you are referring, the "filter" is indeed the EQ.

See here:
studer_169_269_input_schem.pdf
studer_169_269_fader_eq.pdf

They says:
- remove the links 32-34 and 30-42
- add links 30-36 and 34-42
- change blue [the insert plug] from 20 to 32

If you watch at the upper side of the schem, you'll see that, doing it, you'll connect the fader and Q7/IC1 stage _after_ the EQ section:

- at 42 [thanks to 34-42 link] you'll have no more the end of EQ section [link 30-42 removed], but the fader + Q7/IC1.

- thanks to 30-36 link, with S6 you'll have now the fader picking the signal pre or post-EQ [thus excluding it if pre].

- finally [or starting..], the beginning of EQ section [32] now have the signal directly from blue cable of the insert,
and no more from the output of IC1 via 34-32 [now removed] link.


P.S. here is the PCB layout, also if I think you have it already 
169_269_input_PCB.pdf

 

[inputoutput]

Been modding on my studer-desk several times, love it!, and have done anarchistic experiments with the EQs RC chains.   I've got some strips that sound good on bass and some strips that sound good on other instruments.  Be careful with the small Neutrik transformers. They distort easily when they get too much level.  But they do sound great, and even the distortion and clipping they produce sounds kinda musical...

good luck with the racking! keep us posted.

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Use as a linear amplifier, the LM301AN can be replaced with a 5534, at the condition of changing the compensation (RC for the 301, single C for the 5534).
Now I remember some designers used the 301 as comparators of sorts in the side-chain of compressors/gates/limiters. In this position, a TL071 might be a better choice, subject to experimentation.

 

[inputoutput]

I wouldn't change the 301s here.......: The strips sounds great, have great specs and a characteristic sound - with the 301!  swap all the caps first and clean the circuit by cutting out all the parts you don't need.

 

[1954U1]

I wouldn't change the 301s here.......: The strips sounds great, have great specs and a characteristic sound - with the 301!  swap all the caps first and clean the circuit by cutting out all the parts you don't need.

Which parts did you cleared out?, i already recapped it with panasonic fm, need to change the tantals thou.

All the signalling jumpers/wiring e.g..

About the opamps, exactly the same here as inputoutput said.
I was thinking, just after having bought the desk, about opamps replacement, 301 are old etcetc.

Then, I started to listen to the sound, and I like it.
not at all "hard" or "harsh" IMHO, like I've read somewhere.
[I've a Speck XtraMix, a Nicerizer 16, and the (a little weak, so to speak) TL-Audio M3 as summing/mixing boxes, for comparison]
And yes, you can have some nice distortion too, carefully using the input switches/pots attenuators.
End of the issue for me..

[maybe in the future I'll swap in some NE5534s, just for curiousity.]

P.S. watch out also for R1 and R2 50R trimmers:
measure the voltages after them,  you want the + and -  values to be symmetrical.

 

[1954U1]

Will do, thanks for the info man, btw as i said i posted a thread about the LM301 not long ago, you might remember it since you gave some very good tips, anyway for the other studer users here it is :
http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=35113.msg430113#msg430113

Ah yes the 301s in the EQ section!

Yes I think they're worth upgrading, or at least giving it a try..
[anyway, they're not so bad also with the 301s].
Its on my todo list.. can someone please exterminate it?  ;D

 

[guy_4]

Hi Inpoutoutput,

" Be careful with the small Neutrik transformers "
These are not Neutrik transformers.
Studer built all their transformers in-house.
They have patents on some transformers and circuits designs.
And I am not even sure that Neutrik had transformers on their catalog when Studer built their 169's....
Best,

Guy

 

[audiox]

These are not Neutrik transformers.

Studer 1.022.400.00  =  Neutrik NTM4
Studer 1.022.405.00  =  Neutrik NTL1

I don't remember who was the manufacturer in the 70's.

 

[guy_4]

Hi audiox,

From what components list do you get this information ?

On my 169 manual, page 4 of 5 of Input Unit schematic 1.169, dated 9.8.76,  I can read :

Pos No : T1    Part No 1.022.405.00    Value 1:1    Specification : LINE-TRAFO        MFR : ST
Pos No : T2    Part No 1.022.400.00    Value 1:4    Specification : MICRO-TRAFO    MFR : ST

and just below : ST = STUDER

" I don't remember who was the manufacturer in the 70's."

May be Studer ? 



Best,
Guy

 

[1954U1]

Yes there are these little paper stickers on top of the transformers:

They're also easy to slip away in some of my channels.. [too much saturation by previous owners?  ]
the line 405 sticker in the photo is reglued.

 

[audiox]

On my 169 manual, page 4 of 5 of Input Unit schematic 1.169, dated 9.8.76,  I can read :
Pos No : T1    Part No 1.022.405.00    Value 1:1    Specification : LINE-TRAFO        MFR : ST
Pos No : T2    Part No 1.022.400.00    Value 1:4    Specification : MICRO-TRAFO    MFR : ST
and just below : ST = STUDER

Marking "ST" (Studer) can mean at least three things:
1. Designed by Studer and manufactured by one of their subcontractors
2. Not designed by Studer and ordered from another manufacturer according to Studer specifications
3. Manufactured by Studer

It is quite common among gear manufacturers to have their own part numbers for components that are also available from other sources (directly from the component manufacturer). It is easy to understand why if you check the prices of some Studer spare parts...

From what components list do you get this information ?

I have some old documentation of these transformers.