The real attack on Democracy.

[cyrano]

Another thing. When the funding of the Wuhan lab was revoked in 2020, the US entity that transferred the money (EcoHealth), had a problem. So their funding was reinstated in 2023, but they couldn't fund any research in China. Logical, no? Well, they could also not fund any research with animals, according to the WaPo.

NIH resumed funding for EcoHealth in May 2023, but the grant now stipulates that the organization may not conduct research in China or with animals.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2023/07/19/coronavirus-origin-wuhan-lab-us-funding/

I find that quite hilarious...

It also shows EcoHealth is just an empty shell, used to isolate some from their responsibility. Or do you think they exclusively finance plant virus research?

 

[JohnRoberts]

Another thing. When the funding of the Wuhan lab was revoked in 2020, the US entity that transferred the money (EcoHealth), had a problem. So their funding was reinstated in 2023, but they couldn't fund any research in China. Logical, no? Well, they could also not fund any research with animals, according to the WaPo.

this is a pretty old topic well discussed here. I think it was during the Obama administration when supporting GOF research was originally prohibited by US government.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2023/07/19/coronavirus-origin-wuhan-lab-us-funding/

I find that quite hilarious...

It also shows EcoHealth is just an empty shell, used to isolate some from their responsibility. Or do you think they exclusively finance plant virus research?

I didn't click but have been following this circular mess for years. It is not funny.

Sen Rand Paul has been pursuing Dr Fauci to get straight answers for years. I don't feel lucky (about this particular pursuit).

JR

 

[sodderboy]

I think they are finally admitting to naughty-naughty in Wuhan to obfuscate what is going on in labs in The Ukraine.
FDS? I think that the "Top Doc", who lied about government research, funneled grey $$ towards it, kinda made-up a bunch of crap like social distances, vax safety, etc. needs to be held accountable for perjury and the deliberate infraction of International Treaties. Gubment employees are just as big eff-ups as people in the private sector, but seem to be above the laws that are clamped on the plebians. This is not a government of the people but one against the people.

Mike

 

[cyrano]

so that is supposed to make it ok...

So it's only OK if others do it? I'm not allowed to joke?

China has not exactly been open to helping international groups research the origins of COVID. I know that i (we) don't know all the answers.

The Wuhan lab in China was very open about their research before they got US funds. I suppose that, just like the labs in Ukraine, they weren't allowed by their financial masters to report about it...

You might have the idea that the CCP controls everything at all times in China. That's false. That's why corruption is so wide spread and succeeds to keep on going for a long time in China. The CCP surely knew about the US funding. But that's about it. The CCP doesn't mess with science. Remember that Chinese geneticist who produced custom twin babies? It wasn't until the (western) press reported about it that the CCP became aware.

I think the CCP is afraid of science. They surely don't understand it and they fear they might kill the next greatest invention ever if they interfere.

So you think scientists are corruptible but politicians and government officials are not ?

Whatever gave you that idea?

I just think most scientists are way easier to corrupt than politicians. It's not their thing to suspect someone trying to corrupt them, while politicians should always be on the lookout for it.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

The ONLY non-Chinese researcher ever connected to the Wuhan lab, was Danielle Anderson, born in Australia, currently residing in Singapore. Below is a list of her research papers:

https://scholar.google.com/citations?user=Qx_-72oAAAAJ&hl=en

Wrong. Ralph Baric and his team at UNC were identified early in 2020. Find better sources of information.

 

[cyrano]

I think they are finally admitting to naughty-naughty in Wuhan to obfuscate what is going on in labs in The Ukraine.
FDS? I think that the "Top Doc", who lied about government research, funneled grey $$ towards it, kinda made-up a bunch of crap like social distances, vax safety, etc. needs to be held accountable for perjury and the deliberate infraction of International Treaties. Gubment employees are just as big eff-ups as people in the private sector, but seem to be above the laws that are clamped on the plebians. This is not a government of the people but one against the people.

Mike

In Italy, a geologist who predicted an earth quake, got sued for causing disruption. So he shut up. A few years later, he was sued again, for not speaking out...

When COVID started, we didn't know what would work and what not. So, some measures were wrong. Would you like to pick what to do next time?

And, sure, some have made a boatload of money. Isn't that what capitalists are supposed to do? It's funny, but Russia had no problems with COVID. Is that because most of Russia has a colder climate? Or do you think the Russians just have a better immune system?

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Someone needed to take decisions. We were relatively fortunate that for once, politicians relied on scientists.

These decisions were made by career bureaucrats and political appointees, not scientists. Many of the scientists were silenced early on if you recall.

From what I could observe locally, most fraudsters were caught pretty fast. And afaict, it's only Pfizer that has been in the crosshair. Scientists are usually easy to corrupt as they depend on a lot of goodwill to finance their projects. And most of them aren't used to keep their eyes open for scams and blackmail opportunities.

Please. The corruption of big science has been ongoing for decades. And regulatory capture is real.

I've been looking for other customers of the Wuhan lab. There aren't any, besides China and the USA. And the Chinese ones complain about having to wait. Mainly the biologist who first introduced samples from bats. And she had so many samples, she wasn't even hoping to have all of them studied. She also needed to stay quiet, after a few remarks about the dangers of GOF research and the minute progress of science it delivered.

Not sure what point you're trying to make. The research happened, illegal or not.

Then there was that report from India, suggesting COVID 19 showed signs of GOF research. That report quickly vanished from the net. Without any comments from peers.

And yet you think scientists are making the decisions...

It is a "no go" zone for most researchers these days, as it isn't beneficial to their careers. Just some older, retired virologists dare to comment on it, but they are getting ignored.

Huh. I wonder who's making sure these voices are ignored.

China seems like an unusual choice,

They had bat coronavirus researchers and plenty of new bat viruses to study from other provinces. Not hard to understand.

 

[Matador]

So it's only OK if others do it? I'm not allowed to joke?

 

[jabe]

TIL the director of the NIAID has the power to force each state to enact a separate and unique lockdown, and an army of soldiers to hold down unwilling citizens as they get jabbed.

I'm not sure I understand your point. Is this something you're ok with?

Not sure I understand your point. In the US each state enacted their own lockdown, not the federal government let alone the NIAID. But you called Fauci

A civil servant who was given enough power to enforce government lockdowns

You also claimed he personally was

forcing vaccinations on millions

And now you're asking me if I'm ok with things that didn't happen.

 

[fallout]

Not sure I understand your point. In the US each state enacted their own lockdown, not the federal government let alone the NIAID. But you called Fauci

Fauci was the point person on all things Covid in the US.

You also claimed he personally was

He was personally responsible for recommending lockdowns. Funny enough he did try to wipe his hands of it but it was his recommendation.

“I gave a public-health recommendation that echoed the CDC’s recommendation, and people made a decision based on that. But I never criticized the people who had to make the decisions one way or the other.”

And now you're asking me if I'm ok with things that didn't happen.

Yes. Unless you were living under a rock, millions were forced to get vaccinated if they wanted to keep there jobs due to his 'recommendations'.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Fauci was the point person on all things Covid in the US.

He was personally responsible for recommending lockdowns. Funny enough he did try to wipe his hands of it but it was his recommendation.

“I gave a public-health recommendation that echoed the CDC’s recommendation, and people made a decision based on that. But I never criticized the people who had to make the decisions one way or the other.”

Yes. Unless you were living under a rock, millions were forced to get vaccinated if they wanted to keep there jobs due to his 'recommendations'.

Pepperidge Farms remembers and so do I. The authoritarian jakelegs were everywhere with their carping "follow The Science" and Fauci claiming the mantle of The Science for himself. Vaccine passports, lock downs, extended lock downs, mandatory testing, quarantines when traveling (even within the US, e.g. Hawaii), mask mandates, school closures, and family members languishing alone in nursing homes and hospitals. How many died with no family members to comfort them in their final days, hours, moments? You're damn skippy I remember. ALL of it.

 

[jabe]

He was personally responsible for recommending lockdowns.

So... recommending, not forcing.

millions were forced to get vaccinated if they wanted to keep there jobs

So... their employers forced them.

But somehow lockdowns and vaccinations happened all over the entire world because of the recommendations of one man.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

So... recommending, not forcing.

Yeah, pretend not to know how power is abused. Or are you really that naïve?

So... their employers forced them.

Because the Fed government defined "fed contractors" to include anyone who worked for a private company that was paid in any way by federal programs. Like any medical facility that accepts Medicaid. Or private firms that worked in any way on a fed contract. Like my Dad's employer that did infrastructure planning and design from county level to some federal level road projects (interstate highway related). No, not just the people directly funded by fed money, EVERYONE who worked at the company including janitors. Try to be more realustic in your assessment of what actually happened. Thousands were forced to decide between medical tyranny and paying their bills. For no valid reason at all.

But somehow lockdowns and vaccinations happened all over the entire world because of the recommendations of one man.

Many other countries followed the US lead or had worse institutional tyrants of their own (Aus, NZ, Canada, among others).

Gaslighting doesn't work.

 

[hodad]

Russians just have a better immune system

I think they're better at lying about stuff.

*******This thread had gone so long without being utterly contaminated by the Covid conspiracists. That's all gone now. I thought they had their own freaking thread--a thread I purposely avoid because of their insanity.

 

[hodad]

What a shocker. A right wing news outlet gets caught in yet another Trump-related lie:

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/04/29/nyregion/trump-hush-money-trial-witness-cohen.html

 

[fallout]

So... recommending, not forcing.


So... their employers forced them.

But somehow lockdowns and vaccinations happened all over the entire world because of the recommendations of one man.

 

[Matador]

I thought they had their own freaking thread--a thread I purposely avoid because of their insanity.

This is what happens when you rely only on natural immunity.

 

[jabe]

*******This thread had gone so long without being utterly contaminated by the Covid conspiracists. That's all gone now. I thought they had their own freaking thread--a thread I purposely avoid because of their insanity.

Conspiracy theorists aren't happy keeping to themselves, their whole motivation is to act superior to the sheeple. (Okay, they're never  happy, but you know what I mean.)

 

[fallout]

I’m curious what you think is a conspiracy?

 

[cyrano]

I think they're better at lying about stuff.

Not sure there.

*******This thread had gone so long without being utterly contaminated by the Covid conspiracists. That's all gone now. I thought they had their own freaking thread--a thread I purposely avoid because of their insanity.

Point taken. I'll shut up now.