Type of Solder - Can It Make a Difference to the Sound?

[cpsmusic]

Hi,

Just having a chat with a very respected mix engineer who is adamant that the type of solder used in mixing consoles (and other audio hardware) can make a difference to the sound. I pointed out that I didn't think it would. And I don't see how it can.

Is this idea right up there with other "audiophile nonsense" like special AC and speaker cables?

Is it possibly marketing spin put out by manufacturers when they changed from say leaded to lead-free solder, so that they could say that the new products were somehow better?

Cheers,

Chris

 

[Whoops]

Yes it's Nonsense.
It's like putting some stone crystals on top of your speakers because it will make them sound better.

The change from leaded to lead-free solder it was an imposed change by law for environmental reasons. Lead is not good for the environment or for our health.
But it was actually, and still is, great for solder.

 

[user 37518]

Quick answer: No

 

[JohnRoberts]

The short answer is no... for a good laugh ask him to explain what it sounds like?

As the old saying goes a phool and his money is soon parted.

JR

 

[user 37518]

for a good laugh ask him to explain what it sounds like?

I would expect the typical terms like "upfront", "resolving", "character", "musical", etc...

 

[cpsmusic]

I would expect the typical terms like "upfront", "resolving", "character", "musical", etc...

Yes, and "depth", etc. I think he also subscribes to the idea that class A amps are better than other types (because, hey, they got an "A" so they must be better).

 

[Brian Roth]

In my current "universe" I am doing tech work on a system originally built by a famous person who had grammy awards. It had to use only solid core wire and other vooodo.

All I can say is use 63.37 "eutectic" solder because of the superior properties in assembly of circuits, Nothing to do with Magic Audio,,,,it just works better when doing the "lead slinging" with the iron.

Bri

 

[cpsmusic]

63.37 "eutectic" solder sounds better already!

 

[Brian Roth]

Unlike standard 60/40 solder, eutectic solder (comes in different alloys) typically has a lower melting temperature. The BIG advantage is eutectic "clicks" from molten to solid in a very narrow temp range without a "pasty" temp range.

Been happily using eutectic 63/37 for decades.

Bri

 

[cpsmusic]

Unlike standard 60/40 solder, eutectic solder (comes in different alloys) typically has a lower melting temperature. The BIG advantage is eutectic "clicks" from molten to solid in a very narrow temp range without a "pasty" temp range.

Been happily using eutectic 63/37 for decades.

Bri

But if it "clicks" surely that's a bad thing

 

[PermO]

I think he also subscribes to the idea that class A amps are better than other types

Shure all amps sound the same and all amps can drive all speakers...

On paper...

Maybe put your calculator away for a bit and use your ears for a while.

How many amps have you build ?

 

[cpsmusic]

Shure all amps sound the same and all amps can drive all speakers...

On paper...

Maybe put your calculator away for a bit and use your ears for a while.

How many amps have you build ?

I think you misunderstood my point - he seemed to think that class A is better than, say, AB, not for any technical reason but because A is better than B!

 

[PermO]

Yes you are right, I did.

Someone should invent class Z technology

As for the solder goes, don't mix, for a new build you could use anything, but if you work on an old device it's best to stick with the old 60/40 stuff, the old stuff sets slow, the new stuff sets fast, if you mix the two in a puddle you get weird joints.
So there might be a technical reason clients ask to use a specific solder type.

 

[user 37518]

Someone should invent class Z technology

We are almost up to the point of running out of letters for classes, not all of them are used in audio though...

 

[PermO]

Oh wow, there's so many topologys to amplify "a thing" allready ?

 

[user 37518]

Oh wow, there's so many topologys to amplify "a thing" allready ?

Offcially, these are the ones I know:

Class A
Class B
Class B Continuous
Class AB
Class C
Class D
Class E
Class F
Class F Continuous
Class F Inverted
Class G
Class H
Class J
Class J Continuous
Class S
Class T
Class XD

But there are a lot of manufacturers that change a resistor value and name their amplifiers as being of a new class, so there are many more

 

[PermO]

Interesting, thanks, I've been reading up on some of them.

A friend of mine figured out a completely new topology, he's got the patent secured and is still developing this technology further so he won't make anything public yet.

He is a GDIY member.

 

[user 37518]

Interesting, thanks, I've been reading up on some of them.

A friend of mine figured out a completely new topology, he's got the patent secured and is still developing this technology further so he won't make anything public yet.

He is a GDIY member.

Nice!

For audio, I honestly do not know how much better than Class D in terms of efficiency can be achieved, I've seen Class D amps with 120W using GaN FETs and no heatsink in a small PCB, amazing! Class D also allows a lot of integrated solutions, there are some fully integrated class D chips out there that do not need a heatsink or even an inductor, they are cheap and small.

Class A is extremely in-efficient but still reigns supreme when it comes to low distortion, class G and H seem to be a good compromise between efficiency and distortion. Not sure if we need more classes....

 

[PermO]

Class D is indeed pretty amazing in what it can do in a small package with allmost no heat dissapation, but somehow the sound of those amps never convinced me to buy one.
There's some really nice ones out there, but those are expensive.
But I guess much has happened since I last tested one.

For my studio setup I build my own 2x 10W class A mosfet amp with balanced inputs, and for my hifi a 2x50W PP UL tubeamp.

I have this rule that only one can be on

 

[pucho812]

Solder most definitely makes a difference and impacts the sound. Ever use a mic pre or other unit that has parts on it but is not soldered? It doesn't work very well.
Jokes aside When ever I hear people talk that kind of thing, I just say o.k. and walk away. there is no point to getting into an argument. I had an engineer tell me that when you copy digital files from one machine to another, you get generation loss. Mind you this is just a straight copy of .wav file on machine A going over to Machine B. no change in sample rate, no change bit depth, no conversion to a different format. just a straight copy of a file from one to the other. He went on to explain that a "insert famous engineer" here and himself had done a test where they copied the same file 10 times and when they were done, you couldn't hear the reverb any more because there was generation loss. Generation loss is real in analog and with tape, if it were real in digital then computers wouldn't work as they should. But anyway no matter, the same thing was done, I just said o.k. and walked off. I am not about to get into arguments with people who think they know they are right but do not know enough about a subject to know they are incorrect. There is no point to it.