"Western Electric" considering expanding US tube operations; seeks input

[AusTex64]

Are you sure that were actually real JJ's?

..reason for asking is 1) that JJ did a lot of rebranding of NOS tubes to enhance perceived production quality (!) - I have a stash of nos tesla ecc88's rebranded as JJ 6922.. and 2) that every new-production ECC88-type tube from JJ I have tried since has been a significant disappointment in either emission, gain, or lifespan.. I'd love them being able to actually make this right, but I haven't seen it happening. And don't get me started on the "quality" of their 6386..

/Jakob E.

To my knowledge the 6922’s I tested were made by JJ. They were purchased a few months ago. I just bought 26 more yesterday. So I’ll test them upon arrival and let you guys know what I find.

Having said all this, the JJ 6922 is the only Noval 9 pin tube from JJ I have been satisfied with. The other types I‘ve tried either tested badly or didn’t sound good to me.

 

[AusTex64]

Well I stand corrected. This is from Reverb.com today:

<Western Electric has been making high-end hi-fi stereo tubes for years. After the recent news that Russian-made tubes would not be allowed to ship out of the country, Western Electric polled the musical instruments industry, asking if they should get into guitar tube manufacturing. After the "overwhelming response," Western Electric told Guitar.com that it would look to expand to common tube types like 12AX7s. While US labor costs are higher, Western Electric says it will effort to make new tubes available for an affordable price: "Our plan is not to take advantage and charge an absurd premium for new tubes.">

 

[beatnik]

EHX website says the situation is resolved for now - the Russian factory is resuming deliveries, albeit with increased tariff.

Wonder if this will change Western Electric plans

 

[Ricardus]

EHX website says the situation is resolved for now - the Russian factory is resuming deliveries, albeit with increased tariff.

Wonder if this will change Western Electric plans

Don't these sanctions prevent doing business with Russian entities completely?

 

[Ricardus]

My friend Mike came through for me big time. He gave me 2 sets of 2 matched tubes from JAN and Sovtek. He's been sitting on them for 20 years, so he figured he might as well give them to someone who will use them.

 

[brucega]

The WE office is about 2 miles from where I live, the plant a half mile past that. The owner made money in real estate and other things, and badgered the WE patent holders until they sold him the rights. He has most of the original tools for the 300B, but modern techniques and tools have improved the tube, i.e., higher vacuum, tighter tolerances. It noe has a 40 watt plate rating and a 5 yr warranty.

While training new employees, they have some former employees working there as well.

They have the space, and it is clean.

I know someone in Nashville who bought at least one pair of the 300Bs and says they best the other brands (mostly Chinese I think).

Trying to get an interview and pics, which I will post on the Klipsch firums (I'm a Klipschead...)

 

[Brian Roth]

Bruce....interesting report! Will they allow "ordinary folks" like us to tour the factory? I'd be fascinated to see the processes.

Now....where did all the RCA, GE, Sylvania, etc. manufacturing equipment go??

Bri

 

[soapfoot]

Bruce....interesting report! Will they allow "ordinary folks" like us to tour the factory? I'd be fascinated to see the processes.

Now....where did all the RCA, GE, Sylvania, etc. manufacturing equipment go??

Bri

Memory is imperfect, but I seem to remember Oliver Archut saying that most of the old Telefunken equipment was dismantled and sold as scrap. I think he was speaking specifically of the tooling that did the welds on the steel tubes like the VF14M, EF12, etc.

I'd wager that most of the US tube equipment probably met a similar fate.

I do seem to recall that Aspen Pittman once acquired some of the old GE tooling, though I'm not sure specifically which or what ever became of it.

 

[Brian Roth]

I recall hearing about Aspen ramping up tube production years ago, but Alas....he's RIP.

Bri

 

[dougsta]

Some interesting videos of the actual production line including the original tooling at the new Georgia WE plant on youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/c/WesternElectric
The 300B they make is based off the original tooling, internal "secret sauce" documents and even some of the original employees.
They provide a 5 year warranty, the famous WE 300B's were built to last, 50000 hour life, they usually outlast the buyer.
Nice to see they provide an individual plate curves test sheet for each with a serial number too.
They don't claim audiophoolery bullshit, no creamy mids or soaring highs, just the best in quality 300B you can buy.

So, high end hifi deep pockets crowd, tick, not a high volume market though.

What's next, they have been making the 300B for a few years, Is there a market for a new product?
Logically the next tube is the ECC81 that they use in their high end integrated amp (taking pre-orders, base model $15000, $1000 option for nickel finish, $1000 for 4Ω OT adapter).
They have original WE equipment, once the noval base line is setup, a lot of options to sell ECC83 etc, interesting they use the ECC81 designation, marketing at the long plate/getter shape crowd where a premium can be demanded. Add in the plate test curves and matching and use of the original tooling means there should be a marketing ejaculate campaign aimed at the audiophools. A KT66/KT88 range fit right in here too.
Depending on how long the current shortage lasts the largest market is the guitar amp crowd, low hanging fruit cork sniffers will pony up the premium prices 1st.
The idea of a Made in USA 7025/ECC83 types in a custom shop hand wired Fender amp for $100/tube and maybe a range of 5881/6L6GC/KT66 output pair could float, add in the boutique amp crowd too. These would be sourced from 'binning' from the high-end audio line.

I'd say with a fair wind things are looking good.

Be nice if they could repair tubes too, I dropped this 1958 box plate mil spec ECC83 last week, cracked base, lost vacuum, getter oxidised

Doug.

 

[brucega]

There's a single person electronics repair shop in the WE office building. He has a large area full of tape decks and receivers, some exotic, some not. It belongs to the owner of WE.

I took my 2A3 monoblock in to have him go over them (one had a leaky/failing coupling cap). When I went to pick them up, he had them hooked up to some $150k German speakers. I thought my beater Klipsch La Scalas sounded as good or better.

The tech said my amps were within 1/2db of each other... I doubt he told Whitener about them. I've since sold them, replaced with a modified Crown D-45.

He had a 2 inch Studer deck over in a side storeroom. Kind of an interesting place to hang out.

Charles Whitener, Western Electric CEO, is also one of the people behind TubeDepot.com, based in Memphis. He stated five years ago that he would like to produce other tubes.

 

[scott2000]

Fascinating!

 

[Mr. Moscode]

FWIW, WE invented electrical recording in 1924. That ended playing into a huge horn to wiggle the cutting head and allowed the string bass to replace the tuba.

FWIW

 

[JohnRoberts]

FWIW, WE invented electrical recording in 1924. That ended playing into a huge horn to wiggle the cutting head and allowed the string bass to replace the tuba.

FWIW

My dad worked for WE and then at Vitaphone (the joint venture between Warner Brothers and WE).

JR

 

[Mr. Moscode]

You're a national treasure! Dyed in the wool. Verified bona fides.

I enjoy your comments.

 

[JohnRoberts]

My dad died in the 1950s before I was old enough to ask him smart questions. He took his young son into work with him one saturday. He was a recording engineer for RCA in NYC. The day I visited his technicians were melting wax onto microscope slides so they could review the grooves made by record cutting heads using a microscope.
===
I have some of his old notebooks from his WE days.

JR

 

[Ricardus]

My dad died in the 1950s before I was old enough to ask him smart questions. He took his young son into work with him one saturday. He was a recording engineer for RCA in NYC. The day I visited his technicians were melting wax onto microscope slides so they could review the grooves made by record cutting heads using a microscope.
===
I have some of his old notebooks from his WE days.

JR

Wow. That's super cool.

 

[Mr. Moscode]

My dad died in the 1950s before I was old enough to ask him smart questions. He took his young son into work with him one saturday. He was a recording engineer for RCA in NYC. The day I visited his technicians were melting wax onto microscope slides so they could review the grooves made by record cutting heads using a microscope.
===
I have some of his old notebooks from his WE days.

JR

I'm sorry your dad died so early. But he left his imprint on you for sure.

The RCA Studios in midtown? There's so music history in that place! I was there for a recording session by Chesky Records that used some of my equipment on a Red Rodney jazz recording. It was the 2nd to the last recording there. Wynton Marsalis got the last one.

The walls were moveable baffles to focus the sound with big curved panels that hung at the ceiling. The NY Philharmonic under Toscanini was recorded there, later under Bernstein. What a grand room it was!! There's a YT vid of Leonard conducting a small group recording of West Side Story in the 80s where you can see the studio and the control room to some extent.

I remember being in the main room for a rehearsal before a take then entering the control room to hear it on their speakers and thinking we're lucky if we capture 10% of the sound.

After RCA the IRS took over the space. What a kick in the stomach just thinking about it.

 

[JohnRoberts]

I'm sorry your dad died so early. But he left his imprint on you for sure.

RIP

The RCA Studios in midtown? There's so music history in that place! I was there for a recording session by Chesky Records that used some of my equipment on a Red Rodney jazz recording. It was the 2nd to the last recording there. Wynton Marsalis got the last one.

Yes I think. The main thing I remember about the place was a huge life sized "nipper" statue in the reception area.

The walls were moveable baffles to focus the sound with big curved panels that hung at the ceiling. The NY Philharmonic under Toscanini was recorded there, later under Bernstein. What a grand room it was!! There's a YT vid of Leonard conducting a small group recording of West Side Story in the 80s where you can see the studio and the control room to some extent.

As kid I remember my dad bringing home lacquers. Sometimes he would cut short takes like music from popular TV shows that we kids found entertaining to play on the record player. I recall years ago coming across a lacquer outtake of Toscanini cursing out some symphony orchestra when they blew a take. I lost track of that years ago and suspect someone might have been interested it. Despite a rigorous search I never found it. As kids we would use the old lacquer discs like frisbees to throw around the yard. I suspect the aluminum discs could do some real damage if one of us got hit.
===
I joke that my mother and father were way cooler than me. My dad recorded talent like Harry Belafonte, and Perry Como for RCA records. I recall a case of wine under the family Christmas tree, a gift from Perry Como.

In the 1930s my dad was sent over to England to do sound for the film recording of King Edward's coronation.

My mom was a red neck farm girl from NC who modeled naked for a mannequin maker in NYC. Dad was a radio ham and played drums in a jazz band (nothing serious, I recall seeing YMCA gigs noted on his old drum head).

I remember being in the main room for a rehearsal before a take then entering the control room to hear it on their speakers and thinking we're lucky if we capture 10% of the sound.

My father left behind a stash of RCA open reel recordings, lots of classical music, mostly mono.

After RCA the IRS took over the space. What a kick in the stomach just thinking about it.

Things change...

JR

 

[Gavin Pursinger]

What aGreat legacy...you must certainly be proud of them
Thx for sharing