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I got a letter this month from Anthem Blue Cross telling me they are dropping my current plan as of the end of this year.This, of course, due to A CA.  My agent followed up with a letter showing me what Anthem would be offering next:  Higher deductible, less coverage and a forty percent increase in premiums. Plus, it looks like I can no longer utilize the Health Care Practice and doctors that I have gone to for over twelve years.
If I want coverage anywhere near what I have now it will cost me double what I am currently paying, to over a thousand dollars a month.
Just who is this affordable care supposed to be affordable for?
WTF  :mad:
 
This is unfortunate timing for the politicians who voted for this, just before mid-terms, but pretty predictable. The insurance companies now have some actual experience to set rates based on with what kind of new customers they have attracted. Another factor is the generosity of the government's promise to compensate insurance companies for losses, may be in question with a new congress. Simultaneously the health care industry has adjusted for the new normal. In fact they started adjusting before the legislation even passed to maximize return from the new system (like doctors quitting private practice to join larger corporate hospital groups).

I take no pleasure from doing an "I told you so" dance. I am hugely disappointed that now years after we first addressed this we are on this lousy trajectory that will be even harder (impossible?) to turn around and get onto the right track. It wasn't right before but now seems even worse from my perspective. It used to be corrupted by big insurance, now insurance is in bed with the bigger government.  Hopefully the American version of government health services can be somehow better but the veterans administration version of that seems like a bad omen.

Hopefully after November the gridlock in congress (senate) can be overcome, but it still stands to be seen if our current president will act like former President Clinton did and work with an opposition congress to get stuff accomplished, or veto bills and turn to his pen and phone like he has threatened (executive orders).

Interesting times and I hope everybody stays well so this is only a cost irritation and doesn't affect forum member's individual health.

JR 
 
This is an interesting cartoon read:

http://boingboing.net/2014/10/29/obamacare-what-it-is-what-it.html

debate and contrast...
 
I prefer to demonstrate that thoughtful discussion is not only possible but preferable. often that will bore the trolls away who want a fight.

====
I quote posts out of habit, to prevent the evidence from changing and making my replies seem like non-sequiturs. (oh well,, now I look like the partisan hack).

JR.


 
JohnRoberts said:
I prefer to demonstrate that thoughtful discussion is not only possible but preferable. often that will bore the trolls away who want a fight.

====
I quote posts out of habit, to prevent the evidence from changing and making my replies seem like non-sequiturs. (oh well,, now I look like the partisan hack).

JR.

No worries John.  I have no issues with differing political views.  I just wanted to remove the racial slur in his commentary.  I didn't catch it myself until the second read.
 
Ethan said:
JohnRoberts said:
I prefer to demonstrate that thoughtful discussion is not only possible but preferable. often that will bore the trolls away who want a fight.

====
I quote posts out of habit, to prevent the evidence from changing and making my replies seem like non-sequiturs. (oh well,, now I look like the partisan hack).

JR.

No worries John.  I have no issues with differing political views.  I just wanted to remove the racial slur in his commentary.  I didn't catch it myself until the second read.
I didn't catch the racial slur either, 

I deleted my answer because it no longer makes much sense, those partisan rants are not my personal agenda.

vote early and often...

JR
 
I checked the Freelancers Union and they are simply offering the pot-metal exchange plans from Empire BCBS.  Every plan has the exact same coverage, the only differences are deductibles and premiums.  There is no Major Medical option.  Every citizen gets the same free birth control prescriptions, stated on their card, but guys cannot get their fair share of The Pill, and chicks cannot get their free prostrate exam.  Of course!  It is good for city folks because they can get a free gatekeeper but people on Long Island have to co-pay a doc to see a specialist.

Paul, the entry to your plan now is $471 per month so you may be in for a hike-a-roonie at the end of your term. 

Two more of the specialists my wife and I see are dropping all insurance, because it has become so charlie foxtrot.  We regret but respect their decision.  I will fix, schpritz or solder extra widgets to go to them.

It is a pathetic mess.  The consequences, unintendended and not are only beginning. . .
Mike
 
Not that it really matters...Mine doubled and I get less coverage and a higher deductable.  The next step up was stupid expensive.
 
TheJames said:
Not that it really matters...Mine doubled and I get less coverage and a higher deductable.  The next step up was stupid expensive.
Yet, another unintended consequence of how the ACA was crafted and the insurance company efforts to control their costs means that  even if the low income participants get help with their insurance premiums, the co-pays and deductibles are high enough that many will be discouraged from pursuing treatment.

A great deal of money has changed hands, but those truly in need are not really getting more medical attention.

The worse this gets the more obvious the need to re-write this and attack the problem from other directions, but I still bemoan the years we have wasted on this (IMO) false start. Unfortunately this will not go away easily so it will fall upon future congresses to try to make a purse from a sow's ear with amendments and tweaks..

Good luck to us all... Note: I never claimed that this was simple, only that the law as proposed and then written would not work very well, if at all.

JR

 
Well my understanding is that vast swaths of the actual "law" remained unwritten, with the provision that they would be able to keep amending/writing it as they go...

Which is the grossest kind of BS I ever heard. How do you pass a "law" that they can change anytime they damn well please? It is meaningless; it's a "law" only in the sense that you have to follow whatever they come up with next, which is just a form of dictatorship.

And since when has government EVER repealed a major program...JR I think we are stuck with this! I pray I'm wrong!!!!
 
Phrazemaster said:
Well my understanding is that vast swaths of the actual "law" remained unwritten, with the provision that they would be able to keep amending/writing it as they go...
While I am not a fan of that legislation it was birthed pretty much "written", however it was not the product of bi-partisan amendments (when being crafted). The oft repeated quote from Nancy Pelosi was "we have to pass it so we can read it."  Not evidence of thoughtful deliberation. but written by staff with probable insurance industry influence.  It is not expected that legislation of this scale, injecting itself over 1/6 of the private sector economy be perfect as drafted, and there have already been a couple amendments to fix the most egregious errors.  Funding and the roll-out design has always been suspicious regarding long term viability, not to mention the numerous private interests offered exclusions by the executive. Literally changing the law by fiat.   

I do not think the democrats expected the strong push back from the voting public. They lost their super-majority in the Senate before they could pass the senate version so had to instead use a budget correction procedure called reconciliation to amend the house version with a simple senate majority. 

Which is the grossest kind of BS I ever heard. How do you pass a "law" that they can change anytime they damn well please? It is meaningless; it's a "law" only in the sense that you have to follow whatever they come up with next, which is just a form of dictatorship.
The ACA is pretty well fleshed out while there are probably some regulatory procedures that aren't finalized. The IRS is tasked with policing this so they are still ramping up that capability (oh boy my favorite branch of government... IRS). Instead of the law being amended there are valid criticisms of selective enforcement as the President decided which parts of the law to follow and which parts to ignore.  There are more court tests pending but the supreme court blinked the last time so I am not optimistic that it could be that simply corrected.

Not to mention how much the health care industry has already adapted for the new paradigm. All those private practice doctors who retired or sold out to larger hospital groups are gone forever. It will be even harder now to create more competition in the healthcare trenches to lower prices. The fix is in. 
And since when has government EVER repealed a major program...JR I think we are stuck with this! I pray I'm wrong!!!!

Your characterization of the ACA as being a moving target, more resembles the Dodd-Frank bill that basically set out goals and then tasked the regulatory bodies to write comprehensive (new) regulations. This uncertainty about unfinished and still changing regulations has been a proverbial axe hanging over the head of banking and business leaders for several years now preventing them from making firm plans for the future. 

I have written before about how the super low bank borrowing costs (inter bank rates) has been a license to print money for under-captialized banks and they have taken advantage of that in the years since the collapse to build up their balance sheets. Now years after the crisis and supposed wrong doing, the regulators are now suing the big banks extracting obscenely huge fines and settlements.  This very much looks like the government harvesting the very money that they pumped into those same balance sheets.  The banks could never pay those fines 6 years ago, so where did the money come from? This is going on in plain sight. If they truly wanted to punish them they could have been even more effective with much smaller fines several years ago.  Now this is just paying the price of doing business with the government as a partner.

Now to bring the housing collapse full circle Fannie and Freddie (still under government  conservatorship since 2008) are talking about relaxing mortgage standards again to pump up home sales. It is argued that  politicians have a short memory but come on, many homeowners still haven't recovered from the last time.  We must keep down payments at rational levels for future mortgage safety.

JR

PS: Not to get too inside politics but did anybody notice that Holder (in contempt of congress) just resigned and  the Justice department also did a massive document dump to congress related to "Fast and Furious", just in time for losing the senate? Yeah I know, probably just another coincidence.  ;D

PPS: Speaking of the supreme court and federal government over reach, the SCOTUS recently over ruled the feds charging a fisherman  using Sarbanes-Oxley. For those who don't remember that one after the Worldcom fraud the government made a federal crime of destroying evidence like shredding documents or disappearing emails (like the IRS?). The fishing boat captain managed to misplace some undersized grouper he caught.  :eek: He deserves a fine but not  20 years in some federal pen.  Government force is too easily abused.
 
TheJames said:
Not that it really matters...Mine doubled and I get less coverage and a higher deductable.  The next step up was stupid expensive.

Why doesn't it matter?  You just keep your head down, trap shut, and they won't jack it up anymore?  Good luck with that path, bruthuh.

The PPACA supporters here enjoy subsidies or corp/onion exemptions so it will be crickets from them into the near future.
Mike
 
It doesn't really matter in the context of this thread.  I'm just providing another data point for those keeping score on the "Affordable Care Act."

In the real world, I politically fight this and other big government agendas and supporters with $$ and votes, and actively promote individualism and self-reliance.

Don't misread my statement as apathy or defeat.
 
It is hard to not get discouraged after years of saying that this would not work the way they said it would.

It is now almost perverse to hear the healthcare consultant caught on multiple videos admitting that lack of transparency and misrepresenting the costs was key to getting this legislation passed.  The big lie about "taxing" medical devices and premium  health insurance plans is part of the deception. These taxes are obviously paid for by the consumers of health care with higher priced medical devices or paying more for plans.  DOH. 

I am more upset about who were the rooms full of people that he was telling it is OK to lie to voters? Is this some future ruling class being taught that deception is the correct path?

It was interesting for Nancy Pelosi to now claim she doesn't know who this consultant is, while several years ago she was touting studies from him to promote the ACA legislation. She is in her '70s now so perhaps cognitive decline is her excuse. I can't remember everything and I'm not as old as she is.  ;D

There is a great deal of political arm waving about repealing the ACA by a new republican controlled congress, but that may be premature. The ACA is already fraying around the edges from flawed design, and there is still an important decision that has not yet been settled by SCOTUS yet about legality of federal exchanges and subsidies to state exchanges. IF SCOTUS voids that key leg, the ACA will probably crumble under it's own weight.

I am not ready to do a happy dance because we are now several years further down the road, with the private heath care services industry further consolidated and even more in bed with the insurance company and government cronies. 

There are a few aspects of ACA that are worth preserving like protection for pre-existing conditions, but the elephant in that room, is how do you prevent people from only buying insurance after they are sick. In a free market you can't so there must be a cost for irresponsible public behavior born by the individual, while at the same time we can provide a safety net to help those most in trouble and a lot cheaper than this boondoggle.

Our healthcare system was far from ideal before, and IMO is even worse now (re: cost effectiveness), so good luck to probably the next administration who will be stuck with trying to fix this. The voters won't want to give up free stuff, so we will need to figure out how to reduce costs and actually pay for this.

An ugly irony is that poor people now with government subsidized health insurance plans can not afford the co-pays and high deductibles from the lowest bracket  health insurance plans, so often  still go without care. While they are counted among the winners.

I really miss the good old days when we could ignore politics between elections. It seems to be getting more bizarre by the day since this last mid-term. I really hope they will all take a breath in DC and return to doing the people's business instead of grinding their own political axes.

JR

PS About the only thing I really want the new republican senate to do is reinstate the 60 vote filibuster rule that Harry Reid just abandoned. The filibuster protects minority opinion from being overruled by simple majority (either majority).  We have seen what the abuse of one party rule can cause and I don't trust either party with a blank taxpayer check. 
 
The ACA continues to make news. Economics teaches us that actions can have unintended consequences. When the government picks winners and losers, there are losers duh....  The presidents recent DIY (pen and phone) immigration reform, has made it legal to hire a new group of formerly illegal immigrants (FII) , but does not require that they receive Obamacare coverage.  So the unintended (?) consequence of that exclusion is that employers will save thousands of dollars a year by hiring these FII instead of US citizens.  So not only do they replace American workers, the employers get an economic incentive for hiring them over US citizens. We'll see how this affects employment numbers over time but I expect it will hurt US citizens looking for work.

Note: I am not arguing that FII should get ACA benefits only saying that immigration reform needs to be done as a thoughtful process by the legislature to anticipate more of these unintended consequences. not just political grand standing to buy future votes,  I recently went back and read a summary of the last immigration reform legislation and we need to actually enforce that existing law, before writing a new one. All of these promises of amnesty before sealing the border  will just encourage more to come here illegally.  Allowing millions to break the law makes a mockery of our laws. If you don't like the laws amend them and/or write new ones.

======

Soon we will need to start thinking about what should replace the ACA. I doubt the people will easily give up all the free sh__ so we need a practical and transparent accounting of actual costs and how to pay for it.

The pre-existing condition clause is widely liked but the cost of that is glossed over by a pretense that expanding the coverage base will pay for it. The cost of covering pre-existing condition is estimated to cost us as much as $100B a year... Trying to pay for this with medical device taxes or taxes on premium healthcare plans is like trying to pay for auto insurance by taxing car parts and tires.  Some of that lack of transparency Gruber bragged about, and the SCOTUS correctly called this legislation a tax.

While it seem wrong that individuals should be exposed to going bankrupt due to a medical problem, it is not viable to allow them to wait until sick to buy insurance. That is the same as letting people buy collision insurance after they crash their car.

So there needs to be some kind of safety net for indigent who can not pay for their care, but we need to lose the smoke and mirrors pretending to pay for this.

I expect ACA to continue on the current trajectory, missing enrollment targets, et al... The SCOTUS will have another review of it soon, and I suspect more challenges could follow.

Now we need to start working on a thoughtful bi-partisan plan that is transparent and financially sound. We are wealthy nation so can afford the $100B nut for pre-existing conditions is we so choose, just lets drag it all out into the sunshine and understand what we are doing.

Interesting times... We still need to figure out real ways to reduce cost of healthcare, not the legislator's version of funny math. Many if us predicted this would fail even without the President granting so many exclusions (that reduce the much need revenue to pay for this boondoggle). 

JR

PS:  Now I have nostalgia for the good old days when politics stopped at least momentarily after elections.  8)
 
another year and the slow deterioration continues.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/unitedhealth-cuts-guidance-evaluating-its-insurance-exchange-segment-1447933310?alg=y

United Health says that they are not willing to continue losing money into 2017.  They report their loss for this year is about $700M

It seems like about half the 14 state exchanges have gone belly up despite significant federal support.

Some argue that this was a the plan all along, so we are back to what now?

It was clear that the math didn't work a few years ago.. 

JR
 
The goal all along was to crash the system forcing single payer.

I don't think there is any evidence of this.
I've said this before, but it bears repeating.
The goal was to prohibit insurance companies picking and choosing who they allow on insurance plans - to maximize their profit, regardless of how it left working Americans. Preexisting conditions, dropping someone when they get sick,  genetic testing, etc... etc.. the health insurance companies were doing more and more of this, and people were becoming locked in their jobs, locked out of health insurance, and more and more financially destroyed. Many personal bankruptcies due to medical bills .
Once the rules of the ACA were outlined (insurers cannot pick and choose, other than based on age / sex/ smoking status) there had to be a way to make the system work without everyone avoiding insurance until they got sick, then signing up. The ACA tried this by a mandate - and no, it is not perfect - unfortunately we have a political climate of absolute opposition right now that makes any potential for improvement unlikely.  Addressing the high cost of health care is important and necessary, but difficult.
 
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