797 audio SD capsules on Takstar CM60 body ?

[SoundsOfJill]

Hi everyone,

I guess this is my first post, but I couldn't find the answer in previous topics. I've seen all kinds of capsules being put on the CM60 body with more or less success so I've been looking for 22mm capsules to do some experimenting of my own. I realized 797 audio do carry a selection (including omni capsules, which I am very interested in, for jecklin disc shenanigan purposes).

Before I jump the gun (like the mother superior I am I suppose), has anyone tried those capsules? If it's a lost cause I'd rather not go through the trouble of ordering them on my company account in the first place.
If not I'll give them a try and report back (not sure if I'm equipped to give meaningful measurements however).

Thanks for reading!

 

[mhelin]

Do these fit the bodies (assume you've already got the CM60 bodies)?
https://www.thomann.de/fi/se_electronics_se8_omni_stereo_capsule_set.htmIf not you can easily return them unlike 797 capsules.

 

[mhelin]

Also the Rode NT45-O capsules (103€) are supposed to fit into Thomann's SC140 bodies witch are 99€ pair I suppose (18mm capsules). There are also omni MXL 603 capsules available (at least from USA, expensive to ship and quite cheap).

 

[SoundsOfJill]

Do these fit the bodies (assume you've already got the CM60 bodies)?
https://www.thomann.de/fi/se_electronics_se8_omni_stereo_capsule_set.htmIf not you can easily return them unlike 797 capsules.

They might fit, but they're a bit above what I can spend on capsules for now. I was interested in 797 because I expect them to be under 50€ a piece easily, I'll have to inquire for a quote but from mechanical engineering knowledge (though limited) the manufacturing costs for them probably don't exceed 30€ .

Also the Rode NT45-O capsules (103€) are supposed to fit into Thomann's SC140 bodies witch are 99€ pair I suppose (18mm capsules). There are also omni MXL 603 capsules available (at least from USA, expensive to ship and quite cheap).

18mm won't fit, and the 603s I might look into but the I still have an extremely bitter taste from last time I ordered something from the US (on micparts). I owe customs fees to a collection company because fedEx's onlne payment platform was down. So yeah I'd like to avoid that as much as possible, even if it pains me to order an industrial sample from a company all the way in the PRC.

 

[Chrisfromthepast]

The stock capsules from the CM60 are pretty good. The capsule rolling game has been fun, but the cm60 is hard to improve upon. If you use as a donor body, every single component is useful for another project.
If you’re looking for a different sounding capsule, is this one too dull? When I find random used capsules they are usually very bright.
If you’re aimed at finding candidates for dissecting and analyzing, thats much easier to source.

 

[SoundsOfJill]

The stock capsules from the CM60 are pretty good. The capsule rolling game has been fun, but the cm60 is hard to improve upon. If you use as a donor body, every single component is useful for another project.
If you’re looking for a different sounding capsule, is this one too dull? When I find random used capsules they are usually very bright.
If you’re aimed at finding candidates for dissecting and analyzing, thats much easier to source.

I'm looking for omnidirectional capsules, I agree that the stock capsules are pretty good (crazy stupid good when you consider the price). But I'd like to experiment with omnis. I was thinking I could maybe tape the rear vents of the CM60 in a pinch but I'm not sure if that would be a great solution. Ii sometimes do that with my SM57 for fun and I've always had mixed results)

 

[RuudNL]

I was interested in 797 because I expect them to be under 50€ a piece easily,

I suppose that may be a bit too optimistic...

 

[Chrisfromthepast]

Guosheng will sometimes let his capsules go for a little bit under retail if you email directly, but MSRP is still 119. The 3u capsules are quite good.
And then if you have more time than cash, you might know of these:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004909999776.htmlI have plugged the backplate holes in these electrets before and the result is indeed omni. High end is attenuated alot.
The polarization voltage of a shoeps is opposite from the intrinsic polarity of the dielectric in this capsule, so I had better measurements when I disabled the capsule polarization circuit in the 603s this experimental capsule resides on.
I took the sweep but got busy and failed to update my 22mm thread lately. Thanks for reminding me to post a report.

 

[kingkorg]

They might fit, but they're a bit above what I can spend on capsules for now. I was interested in 797 because I expect them to be under 50€ a piece easily, I'll have to inquire for a quote but from mechanical engineering knowledge (though limited) the manufacturing costs for them probably don't exceed 30€ .

18mm won't fit, and the 603s I might look into but the I still have an extremely bitter taste from last time I ordered something from the US (on micparts). I owe customs fees to a collection company because fedEx's onlne payment platform was down. So yeah I'd like to avoid that as much as possible, even if it pains me to order an industrial sample from a company all the way in the PRC.

You can seal the holes on the plastic backplates of stock cm60, and you will get omni. That is the only difference in construction between cardioid and omni with these. I use epoxy. Just don't use too much, so that it doesn't go too deep and reach the holes on the brass backplate under.

 

[SoundsOfJill]

I suppose that may be a bit too optimistic...

mmmh good to know, I'll still give send an e-mail or two and see what they offer.

You can seal the holes on the plastic backplates of stock cm60, and you will get omni. That is the only difference in construction between cardioid and omni with these. I use epoxy. Just don't use too much, so that it doesn't go too deep and reach the holes on the brass backplate under.

huh.. that really hadn't occurred to me but.. yeah given the fact that CM60s are like 20€ a pop (if you're willing to skim aliexpres pages day after day).. that is the cheapest option. Thanks for the suggestion!

Guosheng will sometimes let his capsules go for a little bit under retail if you email directly, but MSRP is still 119. The 3u capsules are quite good.
And then if you have more time than cash, you might know of these:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004909999776.htmlI have plugged the backplate holes in these electrets before and the result is indeed omni. High end is attenuated alot.
The polarization voltage of a shoeps is opposite from the intrinsic polarity of the dielectric in this capsule, so I had better measurements when I disabled the capsule polarization circuit in the 603s this experimental capsule resides on.
I took the sweep but got busy and failed to update my 22mm thread lately. Thanks for reminding me to post a report.

More time than money is definitely where I'm at, I might order those to play around a bit. Thanks a lot!

 

[Khron]

The polarization voltage of a shoeps is opposite from the intrinsic polarity of the dielectric in this capsule, so I had better measurements when I disabled the capsule polarization circuit in the 603s this experimental capsule resides on.
I took the sweep but got busy and failed to update my 22mm thread lately. Thanks for reminding me to post a report.

Might reversing the diodes on the output of the oscillator (to get the opposite polarity voltage) be one solution for that?

 

[Chrisfromthepast]

Might reversing the diodes on the output of the oscillator (to get the opposite polarity voltage) be one solution for that?

Thats a great idea!

 

[Khron]

Seen that in the t.bone SC140 circuitry, but on the other hand, there's the negative side of Henry Spragens' "version" of the Schoeps oscillator.

https://audioimprov.com/AudioImprov/Mics/Entries/2015/12/20_Modding_a_BM-800_Mic.html

 

[Chrisfromthepast]

So, for clarity, d1 and d2 on this artist’s interpretation of the 603s schematic should be swapped in polarity.
In real life this looks like d5 and d6 on the three versions I’ve encountered. Is that right @Khron?
I’ll swap the surface mounts ones and try it out.

 

[Khron]

Not quite, actually.

You'll want to turn the surface mount D6 around, BUT the D5 you'll want to place with its anode (non-band-end) connected to D6's cathode (band end), and D5 cathode (band end) to ground.

And remove C11 - can't say for sure whether it may or may not screw with things if left in place.

 

[Chrisfromthepast]

https://audioimprov.com/AudioImprov...MXL_990_Zener_Swap_files/MXL603 Schematic.jpg
Ok, thanks, I can sort of imagine half of a bridge rectifier and how those swaps work.

 

[Khron]

Ok, thanks, I can sort of imagine half of a bridge rectifier and how those swaps work.

In the link you posted, the diodes aren't quite a "half rectifier bridge", but more of a voltage doubler arrangement.

In the link i posted, on capacitor and one diode are removed, and/but a diode is added between each (capacitor-coupled) output and ground.

 

[Chrisfromthepast]

Ok here we go with this test I hope its helpful for someone.

 

[Khron]

Did you measure the voltage "before" R12 (i think; "1004" marking, ie. 100 and 4 zeroes, so 1meg)?

Although you'll maybe only get mostly AC at that point... The "after R12" measurement would be skewed by the high value of R12, comparable to the standard-ish 1meg input impedance of most multimeters.

 

[Chrisfromthepast]

-31v with a normal multimeter probe in between r12 and r8
The takstar pol votlage is +47 at what appears to be the same junction.
My probes might be skewing the result idk.