Brexit

[abbey road d enfer]

it's been decades since I drank draught bier in Germany, but I seem to recall some specifications about how much head (foam) was on every serving. To avoid ever having to discard bier they engineered some extra turbulence into the taps, inadvertently making it all but impossible to fill a glass with one pull. As a consequence we would see half filled glasses sitting behind the bar waiting for the too frothy head to subside, so they could finish filling. When the bar got busy they would fill pitchers to reduce pour times.

 
JR

PS: This may have been a quirk of one small hotel bar outside Frankfurt.

I would think it's the case everywhere in Europe, except in the british(?) islands.
Here, foam is the reason why people want draft, not bottles.

 

[ruffrecords]

err...yes.

"Mr Shrimpton told Judge John Morgan, that Euro legislation allowed weights to be displayed in both metric and imperial, but the day would come when imperial would be outlawed."

- it was just his lawyer - and some years past - making a claim about something that might (but didn't) happen in the future.
And since it seems any move to compulsion (to drop alternative units alongside metric) was dropped in 2009 it seems bizarre to give that as a justification for voting to leave in 2016.

You may well be right. The thing is I am generally positive guy so,  although over the years there have been thousands of instances of unnecessary EU interference in Britain, I am not the sort of guy that writes them all down or commits dozens to memory just so that when someone says 'give me one good reason to leave the EU'  I have a list as long as your arm to quote.

Cheers

Ian

 

[JohnRoberts]

I would think it's the case everywhere in Europe, except in the british(?) islands.
Here, foam is the reason why people want draft, not bottles.

I can't speak for what other people like about draft beer (probably price), but having a head of foam is generally evidence of pouring into a clean glass, and fresh well carbonated (not flat) beer. Flat beer has an undesirable, different mouth feel than fresh beer.

JR

 

[Matt Nolan]

Us Brits are funny folk. We like our beer warm (well, room temperature or a shade below) and flat, and usually quite dark of colour. Even better if it has been hand pumped from a wooden barrel rather than pushed by gas pressurisation out of a metal keg.

Some of us do enjoy a lighter and more carbonated style which, in one pub I used to frequent, was affectionately referred to as "Eurofizz".

It's probably best that I don't recount the British Ale drinker's opinion of American beers ;-)

(really, I jest - your cutting edge micro-brews lead the world and, in places where it gets considerably hotter than here, there is a lot to be said for a colder and lighter concoction)

 

[JohnRoberts]

Us Brits are funny folk.

Last century I sampled many pulls in local brit pubs... while traveling around the country with one of our local reps.

We like our beer warm (well, room temperature or a shade below) and flat,

Not exactly my experience. I saw more room temperature bier consumed in Germany back in 1970... I even kept my flip-top bier bottles stashed along the outside edge of our (army) tent and the September weather kept it pretty drinkable. Curiously the German bars catering to US soldiers chilled the bier and provided the locals with immersion heaters to warm up the bier. 

and usually quite dark of colour.

I am a fan of proper stouts and made sport of trying out new black and tan combinations in every new pub we visited. (I also found decent local stouts in Australia).

Even better if it has been hand pumped from a wooden barrel rather than pushed by gas pressurisation out of a metal keg.

As I recall it was "pulled", kind of lifted out with lever-scoop arrangement. The bar maid(?) pulled on the long handle-lever that rotated around a pivot point, raising a portion of fresh bier up that then the spilled out into a glass/mug as it tilted outward. 

Some of us do enjoy a lighter and more carbonated style which, in one pub I used to frequent, was affectionately referred to as "Eurofizz".

I am aware of any number of beer variants in the UK, bitter, lager, ale, pilsner (pils may not be brit, pilsner is a German thing). Then there'e session beers that aren't really a different type but lower alcohol version suitable for drinking over extended periods (sessions).

It's probably best that I don't recount the British Ale drinker's opinion of American beers ;-)

I recall the real ale drinkers holding lager "louts" in low regard.

(really, I jest - your cutting edge micro-brews lead the world and, in places where it gets considerably hotter than here, there is a lot to be said for a colder and lighter concoction)

Since I brew my own, I find most other beers inferior (because they are). My primary criticism of US microbrews are that they are generally over-hopped to impress inexperienced beer drinkers. Some don't suck like the mass market piss-water. 

JR

PS: The old joke about Brits drinking warm beer was because their refrigerators were designed by the same engineers who designed Lucas electrical systems used in the Brit sports cars. :-(

 

[Winston OBoogie]

Us Brits are funny folk. We like our beer warm (well, room temperature or a shade below) and flat, and usually quite dark of colour. Even better if it has been hand pumped from a wooden barrel rather than pushed by gas pressurisation out of a metal keg.

Haha, yep 
After 20+ years as a Brit living in the U.S.  I converted and crossed over the aisle.  I like my ale cold these days, which tends to limit the pubs I can drink ale in now that I'm back in the UK. 

The only pint I've been happy to drink at room temperature in recent times has been Guinness when in Dublin.
But I think of Guinness as being more of a meal than a pint so maybe that doesn't count?

 

[Matador]

Not exactly my experience. I saw more room temperature bier consumed in Germany back in 1970...

You'd get into some trouble saying that in Germany.   Last time I was living there it was patiently explained to me that most German beers (at least in Bavaria) are bottom-fermenting lagers, that were traditionally fermented underground where the temperature is pretty constant at about 50 degrees.  Hence the serving temperature would be close, between 50 and 55 degrees F:  pretty well split between American 'cold' (between 36 and 40 F) and British 'room' (65-70F).  Northern Germany might be different?

(pils may not be brit, pilsner is a German thing).

Now you are in trouble with the Czech Republic.

 

[Matt Nolan]

I recall the real ale drinkers holding lager "louts" in low regard. Since I brew my own, I find most other beers inferior (because they are). My primary criticism of US microbrews are that they are generally over-hopped to impress inexperienced beer drinkers.

1000% agree. It is actually hard to find a non-over-hopped example, but when you do, the good ones can be excellent.

I must confess, I was overplaying some stereotypes for comic effect in my post. You can get good beer and bad beer almost everywhere. I'm more interested in variety than I am in being a purist.

[quote author=JohnRoberts]PS: The old joke about Brits drinking warm beer was because their refrigerators were designed by the same engineers who designed Lucas electrical systems used in the Brit sports cars. :-(
[/quote] ;D

Cheers!

 

[JohnRoberts]

You'd get into some trouble saying that in Germany.   Last time I was living there it was patiently explained to me that most German beers (at least in Bavaria) are bottom-fermenting lagers, that were traditionally fermented underground where the temperature is pretty constant at about 50 degrees.  Hence the serving temperature would be close, between 50 and 55 degrees F:  pretty well split between American 'cold' (between 36 and 40 F) and British 'room' (65-70F).  Northern Germany might be different?
Now you are in trouble with the Czech Republic.

Indeed German beers are mostly lagers but reportedly the Weiss biers are top fermenting , and pilsners bottom fermenting. Doesn't matter to me I am not a fan of either.

Speaking of lagers and temperature while cold temperatures are recommended there is a variant lager called "steam beer" that is fermented at warmer temps. Reportedly during the California gold rush, miners lacked air conditioning but still wanted their beer. There is a modern brand (Anchor Steam) brewed using that warmer temp strategy (I am not a fan of anchor steam either, but they have an audience). 

JR

 

[Tubetec]

Guinness here in Ireland comes in two varieties ,
The Guinness Draught from the tap , its viscous , not gassy , has the thick creamy head and needs first and second pulls by the barman to get the required finish, its served chilled  . Then theres the Guinness Extra Stout , that comes in a bottle , its more like black beer than porter , its fizzy , has a more frothy head than the Draught variety and is usually served at room temp. Of course Irish pubs the world over serve the 'black stuff' in the time honoured way , 3/4 er's on the first pour then once its had a minute or two to settle the correct amount of head is topped off , the Guinness tap has two modes  , pull for main pour then push the tap to get the head .

My guess is most UK pubs just do a standard one pour method for Draught Guinness if they have it , then again if you went up Killburn or other places ex-pat Irish tend to congregate  you have to wait the extra couple of minutes in the time honoured tradition , real stout men have the timing down to a fine art , a nod and a wink to your friendly barkeeper before the previous pint is gone ensures continuity , thing is even with the two pour method the pint itself isnt ready to drink without at least another few minutes settling time , so your always one step ahead of the lager drinker . 
Being a Corkonian I'd highly recommend trying the other two locally made black beers , Murphys and Beamish
,less bitter than the Dubliner , were a bit more friendly/easy going in the far south also 

Now back to the topic at hand , Scotland goes to the polls soon , she may well be on the road out of the union by the looks , thats a definate plus for an all Ireland island , however that wont sit well with Ulster unionists. The other thing is its only a matter of time before Irish nationalists in the north are in the driving seat , Boris doesnt rely on Ulster Unionism to keep the balance of power either, unlike many previous Tory governments . The focus of working class loyalist paramilitary anger could very easily shift into self destruction , you cant simply wash your hands of 800 years of involvement in 'plantagenitism' if there even is such a word .

I personally prefer to refer to us as Irish , English ,Scottish and Welsh  ,each unique, yet with a shared history .

 

[JohnRoberts]

I've been able to find Guinness in bottles in bars in Hong Kong (last century), and I've found Guinness draught on tap in MS... Then there's the canned Guinness draught with a bubble machine (gizmo) inside to help make foam. AFAIK the bottled extra stout has slightly higher alcohol content.

JR

[edit- why would I try to tell an irishman about the mother's milk of Dublin /edit].

 

[topcat]

I personally prefer to refer to us as Irish , English ,Scottish and Welsh, each unique, yet with a shared history .

Excellent, I love the mix too, in the last 100 years my unremarkable family has English, Irish, African American, Dutch, and Scottish streams, all with rich histories and traditions. 

But Europe.... Great people and places, I was very keen on a closer relationship when we joined the Common Market but was happy that we left EUROPE.  Mea Culpa, the Comissioners that the Brits provided were often 5th rate political appointees that were the subject of much satire (e.g. the Peter Mandleson comments in early 90's Private Eye magazine were very funny), so we didn't contribute to formation of a sparkling leadership team......and we argued about almost everything else.  It would be great to get along as peoples after all there is not much racial purity in Europe if you look back over the last couple of milllenia.
Stout....Hook Norton Brewery make a fantastic Double Stout...and they do a great brewery tour too.....Anyone know of a drinkable gluten free stout?


tc

 

[JohnRoberts]

Anyone know of a drinkable gluten free stout?


tc

I can't imagine brewing a decent beer without using barley (with gluten), but rice and corn based beers are reportedly gluten free.

American Budweiser is made from rice and while it is debatable about whether that is drinkable, bud has an audience. You can probably guess my opinion.

JR

 

[Newmarket]

Guinness here in Ireland comes in two varieties ,
The Guinness Draught from the tap , its viscous , not gassy , has the thick creamy head and needs first and second pulls by the barman to get the required finish, its served chilled  . Then theres the Guinness Extra Stout , that comes in a bottle , its more like black beer than porter , its fizzy , has a more frothy head than the Draught variety and is usually served at room temp. Of course Irish pubs the world over serve the 'black stuff' in the time honoured way , 3/4 er's on the first pour then once its had a minute or two to settle the correct amount of head is topped off , the Guinness tap has two modes  , pull for main pour then push the tap to get the head .

My guess is most UK pubs just do a standard one pour method for Draught Guinness if they have it , then again if you went up Killburn or other places ex-pat Irish tend to congregate  you have to wait the extra couple of minutes in the time honoured tradition , real stout men have the timing down to a fine art , a nod and a wink to your friendly barkeeper before the previous pint is gone ensures continuity , thing is even with the two pour method the pint itself isnt ready to drink without at least another few minutes settling time , so your always one step ahead of the lager drinker . 
Being a Corkonian I'd highly recommend trying the other two locally made black beers , Murphys and Beamish
,less bitter than the Dubliner , were a bit more friendly/easy going in the far south also 

Now back to the topic at hand , Scotland goes to the polls soon , she may well be on the road out of the union by the looks ,

Murphys over Guinness definitely. But Guinness marketing and distribution is dominant in Britain.
On the politics - yes the 'Conservative and Unionist'party seem to be playing fast and loose with 'the Union' as Scottish Government elections loom while Ireland burns.

 

[cyrano]

American Budweiser is made from rice and while it is debatable about whether that is drinkable, bud has an audience. You can probably guess my opinion.

Our local big commercial brewery is using soybeans...

They had to, as they sold five breweries to the Chinese and part of the payment was X ton of soybeans over Y years. They'd planned on selling the beans, but shortly after the price tanked.

 

[topcat]

I can't imagine brewing a decent beer without using barley (with gluten), but rice and corn based beers are reportedly gluten free.

American Budweiser is made from rice and while it is debatable about whether that is drinkable, bud has an audience. You can probably guess my opinion.

JR

Thanks.... As a recently diagnose coeliac I was hoping that one of the boards beer experts would have come accross a decent GF beer....There are some promising processes in play such as the use of enzyms to remove the gluten from a barley brew....but the output...is sadly closer to the fizzy larger end of the market.
tc

 

[Matt Nolan]

Thanks.... As a recently diagnose coeliac I was hoping that one of the boards beer experts would have come accross a decent GF beer....There are some promising processes in play such as the use of enzyms to remove the gluten from a barley brew....but the output...is sadly closer to the fizzy larger end of the market.
tc

I read that there is a GF variant of Nastro Azzuro coming out. Still fizzy lager though...
There are these:
https://vinepair.com/buy-this-booze/the-10-best-gluten-free-beers/

Or you could try eating sauerkraut and other fermented foodstuffs more and then try drinking gluten-including beers again and see how you fare. I believe there is some evidence that they can help your digestion of gluten.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Thanks.... As a recently diagnose coeliac I was hoping that one of the boards beer experts would have come accross a decent GF beer....There are some promising processes in play such as the use of enzyms to remove the gluten from a barley brew....but the output...is sadly closer to the fizzy larger end of the market.
tc

I am not a gluten-free beer expert... Good Luck.

JR

 

[topcat]

I read that there is a GF variant of Nastro Azzuro coming out. Still fizzy lager though...
There are these:
https://vinepair.com/buy-this-booze/the-10-best-gluten-free-beers/

Or you could try eating sauerkraut and other fermented foodstuffs more and then try drinking gluten-including beers again and see how you fare. I believe there is some evidence that they can help your digestion of gluten.

Thanks Matt, I will try the 10 best GF beers!...
Sadly, I'm technically allergic to gluten so am very wary of consumming any so probably won't experiment with the brewed foods.
Cheerstc

 

[ruffrecords]

I suspect a lot of the belief that Brits like warm beer originated in WW2 when the Americans came over here. In those days the beer was warm, not necessarily because we liked it that way, but because domestic refrigerators were unheard of in those days. The only place you could get beer was a pub and none them had refrigerators. It wasn't until we moved to Peterborough in 1957 that we had our first fridge. And where we lived before that, we were the first house in our street to have an indoor toilet fitted.

Cheers

Ian