Dangers of sharing stuff online...
- Thread starter kingkorg
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deleteduser
Active member
on the other side of the coin.... anything can be fixed, even this classic mic. Another side of the coin... There's a huge trend towards DIY, which I am obviously not against if I am typing on a forum called "Group DIY." the thing is though... People who are specialists, experienced in a certain discipline for a long time... you really can't go wrong just hiring them. You really cannot outperform them economically on a DIY basis. I've done electronics repairs and stuff for a long time now... Rhodes, Wurlitzer, Mixers... it would be hard for someone, who has even done excellent repairs on guitar amps or synths or whatever.... I mean it would be impossible to outperform me on these three things.... that said? There are rhodes and wurtlizer and mixer guys out there who are even more efficient and cost effective and better performance than me. Microphone repairs? Tube amp repairs? etc? All of this stuff is DIY'able. but like. if you think you're going to out build Warm Audio? I mean... forget about it. You know what I mean? I think with a lot of this DIY mentality; a lot of versatility has come into people's lives and we have all expanded our skillset. But man. I got a friend whose done so many wurlitzers and rhodes... if you think you're going to fix a rhodes or wurltizer half as good, for twice the money, in four times the time? youre out of your mind you're going to expend more for less result. And you know. He's fair. Like. Very fair prices.
like studio wiring . that's a good one. A lot of studio owners or whatever want to design their own wiring scheme and do their own console installs and all this.... like man. you're going to do it and redo it three times and five years later you're going to realize you should have just hired a wiring company to do it for literally beans bro correct the first time.... but people don't see it that way they just think oh its some simple little wires how hard could it be?
like studio wiring . that's a good one. A lot of studio owners or whatever want to design their own wiring scheme and do their own console installs and all this.... like man. you're going to do it and redo it three times and five years later you're going to realize you should have just hired a wiring company to do it for literally beans bro correct the first time.... but people don't see it that way they just think oh its some simple little wires how hard could it be?
While i do agree on most of what you said, when it comes to microphones Warm Audio is easily "out-buildeable", and not a great example of how mics should be built. Proven here many times before. On the other hand, there are many other great companies in Warm price range, or much less that would be difficult to beat.
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RuudNL
Well-known member
How about seeing your own design as a commercially produced product?
It's happened to me more than once...
It's happened to me more than once...
Yeah, me too! I contributed a couple of antenna design ideas to a product currently in production in Germany ... er ... um ... not that I made any money for it, but it is kinda fun just the same!
James
RuudNL
Well-known member
Isn't copying the greatest compliment you can receive?
I used to own a guitar pedal company (now defunct). My designs were all original (not clones of Tube Screamers and Big Muffs like most companies). It took me many months to design those circuits, and within weeks of releasing them, there were posts on diyeffectspedals.com of people reverse-engineering the circuit. I thought, "That's fine - it's DIY. I love DIY." Then someone produced a kit...then people started selling assembled kits on eBay...then people started selling clones on eBay.
I don't know if that can be avoided. Do I wish it didn't happen? Yes. Did it cut into my sales and contribute in some way to the demise of the business? Maybe. Do I regret designing and releasing the product? Nope.
I don't know if that can be avoided. Do I wish it didn't happen? Yes. Did it cut into my sales and contribute in some way to the demise of the business? Maybe. Do I regret designing and releasing the product? Nope.
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I feel you pain.
An small antenna manufacturer took my advice and potted a balun (impedance matching transformer) with black epoxy to 1) weatherproof the toroid, and 2) obscure how it is made. One must dissolve or chisel away the block of solid blackness to see what is is. No big deal, but one way to fight back!
James
Karma is going to get him...
rogs
Well-known member
When I was working, we used to adopt the 'bury it in resin' approach rather than trying to apply for patents on original ideas....
Problem with patents is that you need to publish what you're doing, to apply in the first place.
'That's a good idea' say the big boys, and promptly copy it, knowing full well you probably can't afford to sue them?
Scraping the numbers from ICs can also be quite useful, to help make reverse engineering just that bit more difficult!
When it comes to DIY, I just assume things get copied.... I'm usually flattered that anyone considers an idea useful!
I do put watermarks on schematics....You want to copy, you can at least draw it out again for yourself!
I know it's not that difficult to remove them - or copy the schematic - but it stops the blatant direct simple copy and the " look what I've designed" claims.
I've had problems with that locally in the past.... ( I knew who was doing it!)
Problem with patents is that you need to publish what you're doing, to apply in the first place.
'That's a good idea' say the big boys, and promptly copy it, knowing full well you probably can't afford to sue them?
Scraping the numbers from ICs can also be quite useful, to help make reverse engineering just that bit more difficult!
When it comes to DIY, I just assume things get copied.... I'm usually flattered that anyone considers an idea useful!
I do put watermarks on schematics....You want to copy, you can at least draw it out again for yourself!
I know it's not that difficult to remove them - or copy the schematic - but it stops the blatant direct simple copy and the " look what I've designed" claims.
I've had problems with that locally in the past.... ( I knew who was doing it!)
Some companies don’t publish everything as well making it a bit more of a challenge. For example, I’m the current custodian of scores of volumes of WE engineering information, engineers notes, transformer builds, right down to where the materials were sourced from etc, that was marked “ not for publication”. I’m keeping it that way forever, eventually I will destroy it all.
Too bad, I would love to avoid him
"... eventually I will destroy it all."
Oh golly, please don't do that. Is there a university engineering library nearby that you could donate to? The Internet Archive?
Is it really worthless?
Actually, I think it’s rather priceless. Engineers handwritten notes that discuss the very detail of the design, materials and even an eye opening insight as to how some of the WE input transformers were designed and built. Calculations etc…but they were never meant for publication…so…
Yes, but I'm sure the 'Not for Publication' was a corporate mandate for competitive reasons, not the wishes of engineers working in the lab. The WE that produced transformers is long gone, so why not honor the hard work of the people who designed and created innovative products, instead of tossing it in the trash. The choice is yours...
Cqwet Dbdfte
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2023
- Messages
- 621
The WE IP had economic value, which since have passed. You imply that you hold that IP and plan to destroy it, to protect economic interests of who?
That's like burning the library of Alexandria.
Historic information should not be destroyed. Much of the art of making things are not contained in patents, usually as little as possible is included. The secret of successful products are in manufacturing processes and sourcing of materials, quality controls etc etc.
Do not destroy the WE historic records, its like taking a crap on the people who sourced it.
You’re probably right. Never thought of it that way. Perhaps finding an institution as previously suggested would be the right path.
Glenn Wardle
Member
- Joined
- May 9, 2024
- Messages
- 14
Whilst I absolutely agree that seeing your designs blatantly copied can be soul destroying, I would hate for old 'precious knowledge' to be destroyed, particularly as there comes a point when it's value as 'engineers knowledge' surpasses its financial worth. Who would condone 'burning books' as the basis of good engineering practice?
One piece of ancient electronics I tried to find out about was the design of old uhf TV tuners - those that predated varicap diodes. Worked by a cam which moved tiny slotted vanes, they were wonderful works of art, designed and made without computers, with coils adjusted by pushing the windings apart with a screwdriver. I would love know how they were designed, but all that knowledge wasn't viewed as worth saving as it had no commercial value. Perhaps engineers have a 'different view', but I will look at well crafted schematic as both a work of art as much as a work of science.
One piece of ancient electronics I tried to find out about was the design of old uhf TV tuners - those that predated varicap diodes. Worked by a cam which moved tiny slotted vanes, they were wonderful works of art, designed and made without computers, with coils adjusted by pushing the windings apart with a screwdriver. I would love know how they were designed, but all that knowledge wasn't viewed as worth saving as it had no commercial value. Perhaps engineers have a 'different view', but I will look at well crafted schematic as both a work of art as much as a work of science.
All true words when approached as that. The thing that’s stuck in my gullet is that those who consider themselves very knowledgeable(and they probably are), have ridiculed me based on the little information they scraped up, while the original crafters in their own handwriting actually contradict that little bit of scraped up knowledge. Refused to pay attention or at least pursue intelligent conversation with me, so their eyes may be opened, instead have caused me to slam that door closed. Yes, maybe my prides a bit injured(poor me), or I’m done trying to deal with folks like that, I know it’s not fair to others though, but maybe the volumes should be lost forever then. After all, they’re ancient designs, probably irrelevant by today’s standards plus we’ve been fine all along without it. I haven’t made that decision to trash it all though.
brucega
Member
I imagine the present owner of WE would love to have it all. He has a 300B tube plant not 10 minutes from my house. He's wanting to ramp up some of the othe tubes as well, plus more common tubes used in guitar amps, etc.
He has hired some of the employees who worked for WE in the past. Interesting times.
He has hired some of the employees who worked for WE in the past. Interesting times.
