DIY M50 capsule

[kingkorg]

Unfortunately showing as currently unavailable.

Bummer.

The original listing was "Plastic round ball lever Knob M8 x 40mm 2 pcs". If you google that, you'll get some results. Most of them have now metal thread, mine were all plastic.

 

[k brown]

https://www.amazon.com/uxcell-Black-Plastic-Diameter-Threaded/dp/B00N41AAOI

 

[k brown]

Post #55 updated with additional info.

 

[k brown]

Post #52 edited to include a quote from Tony Faulkner about altering cardioids to subcardioid by blocking some of the housing's side vents.

 

[kingkorg]

Important to note the diaphragm tension has nothing to do with the pattern. Using higher tension for omni is for other reasons, and all of the capsules of this type i have ever disassembled suffer from over tightened diaphragm anyways, which makes them perfect for this use. Cardioid tho suffers from low end loss.

 

[k brown]

Important to note the diaphragm tension has nothing to do with the pattern. Using higher tension for omni is for other reasons, and all of the capsules of this type i have ever disassembled suffer from over tightened diaphragm anyways, which makes them perfect for this use. Cardioid tho suffers from low end loss.

I wonder if a difference in diaphragm tension is one of the reasons the Behringer B-5s that I swapped-in diaphragms from Rode NT-45Os now have a 'beefier' bottom; one of the things that surpised Tony Faulkner about the Rodes were their weight at the bottom, that he said actually reminded him of an M 50!

The difference in richness between the 'RB' (Rode/Behringer) capsule and a stock one is quite remarkable. Unfortunately, I don't have a working stock NT-45O to compare to.

I imagine the over-tightened diaphragms are a compromise mfgrs make so that they can use the same diaphragm in cards and omnis, and just figure the weakened bottom in the cards will help with proximity, since most of the market is people doing close-micing.

 

[kingkorg]

I wonder if a difference in diaphragm tension is one of the reasons the Behringer B-5s that I swapped-in diaphragms from Rode NT-45Os now have a 'beefier' bottom; one of the things that surpised Tony Faulkner about the Rodes were their weight at the bottom, that he said actually reminded him of an M 50!

Very likely, because on this type of capsule the low end pretty much depends just on the diaphragm tension. My savage method is to stretch these by "massaging" them in circular motion with a qtip. Don't recommend this to anyone who isn't ready to destroy the capsule. I check the resonant frequency by blowing against them under about 45° angle. Yup, very savage.

Also, my favorite nt3 capsule is the one i used for my live vocal performances for about 10 years, 4 days a week on average. Taking plosives for 10 years give it about 5db more at 50hz compared to brand new capsules of the same type.

 

[kingkorg]

If backplate shape is of concern (not sure how important it is in omni) this Oktava MKE-2 capsule could be the way to go

 

[k brown]

If backplate shape is of concern (not sure how important it is in omni) this Oktava MKE-2 capsule could be the way to go

Interesting; wasn't aware of those. Rather sophisticated design for a budget electret.

 

[bremusound]

Looks quite familiar…
(Photo taken from coutant.org)

 

[Timjag]

I appreciate your comment greatly Mihobro! Reminded me of life in the 90s and what equipment you actually got to use that wasn’t on the service bench, I can remember stacks of old nice kit that didn’t work.

There’s stuff built on these pages far finer than many things used on even top recordings back then but it was an industry then and you had to get on with it, now it’s purest/hobbyist pursuit.

I do enjoy the nerdiness here but boy have things changed x

 

[k brown]

Your experiments are interesting. The years I spent on the scoring stage bring to mind a few things.
First, Neumann made a FET version of the M50, it was called the TLM150 and we used them on the boy's chorus in "An Interveiw with a Vampire" among others as a M50 substitute but, we preferred to use one of the maybe two sets of M50 tubes that were available for hire in Manhattan during the 90's.. But most M50's were tube electronics only.
Except....
I remember when Decca came in. (I think it was John Locke at the helm) Their engineers had grown tired of servicing the tubes, so they had converted (some say butchered) their famous M50s' by swapping out the tubes for FET circuits and still made many fine orchestral recordings, (I think this was in the 90's) and including some of the early 24bit 192K recordings.
M50's used a nickel plated capsule, not gold, as well a perspex (something like lucite) plastic sphere.
When coupled with an appropriate preamp, like an Avalon M5, a good acoustic space, and the best studio musicians, it was an integral part of a very sweet, familiar orchestral sound that was so warm and pleasing, Which everyone grew up with in film and orchestral recordings. Ben Hur, Lawrence of Arabia, Raiders of the Lost Ark, Star Wars. etc warm, very warm compared to the cold sterile first generation digital recordings.

Minor correction: nickel was only one of four materials used for the M 50 capsule; there were three version of the capsule over the years. The first was PVC, then aluminum, which quickly changed to nickel, the last version used Mylar (essentially same capsule as KM 83).

http://www.saturn-sound.com/Curio's/neumann's kk50 capsule assembly.htm

 

[Migs 31]

Your experiments are interesting. The years I spent on the scoring stage bring to mind a few things.
First, Neumann made a FET version of the M50, it was called the TLM150 and we used them on the boy's chorus in "An Interveiw with a Vampire" among others as a M50 substitute but, we preferred to use one of the maybe two sets of M50 tubes that were available for hire in Manhattan during the 90's.. But most M50's were tube electronics only.
Except....
I remember when Decca came in. (I think it was John Locke at the helm) Their engineers had grown tired of servicing the tubes, so they had converted (some say butchered) their famous M50s' by swapping out the tubes for FET circuits and still made many fine orchestral recordings, (I think this was in the 90's) and including some of the early 24bit 192K recordings.
M50's used a nickel plated capsule, not gold, as well a perspex (something like lucite) plastic sphere.
When coupled with an appropriate preamp, like an Avalon M5, a good acoustic space, and the best studio musicians, it was an integral part of a very sweet, familiar orchestral sound that was so warm and pleasing, Which everyone grew up with in film and orchestral recordings. Ben Hur, Lawrence of Arabia, Raiders of the Lost Ark, Star Wars. etc warm, very warm compared to the cold sterile first generation digital recordings.

Thanks for sharing your recollection of the 90's scoring stage work.
I just came back from Italy, worked with Medit Orchestra & also Sinfonica di SanRemo.
Interesting stuff, steep learning curve and travelling/eating a lot ...

You wrote: "First, Neumann made a FET version of the M50, it was called the TLM150 and we used them on the boy's chorus in "An Interveiw with a Vampire" among others as a M50 substitute but, we preferred to use one of the maybe two sets of M50 tubes that were available for hire in Manhattan during the 90's.. But most M50's were tube electronics only."

Do you remember: was it Decca Tree or "simple" Stereo pair configuration on those recordings?
Your input and contribution here is really appreciated.
Thanks.

M

 

[k brown]

Thanks for sharing your recollection of the 90's scoring stage work.
I just came back from Italy, worked with Medit Orchestra & also Sinfonica di SanRemo.
Interesting stuff, steep learning curve and travelling/eating a lot ...

You wrote: "First, Neumann made a FET version of the M50, it was called the TLM150 and we used them on the boy's chorus in "An Interveiw with a Vampire" among others as a M50 substitute but, we preferred to use one of the maybe two sets of M50 tubes that were available for hire in Manhattan during the 90's.. But most M50's were tube electronics only."

Do you remember: was it Decca Tree or "simple" Stereo pair configuration on those recordings?
Your input and contribution here is really appreciated.
Thanks.

M

Bit scrambled here; there was/is no "TLM 150", just TLM 50 and M 150; both are transformerless, and the large transformer in the M 50 was a big part of it's sound (same one was used in the M 49).

The TLM 50 is a FET mic, the M 150 a tube mic.

 

[Migs 31]

Bit scrambled here; there was/is no "TLM 150", just TLM 50 and M 150; both are transformerless, and the large transformer in the M 50 was a big part of it's sound (same one was used in the M 49).

The TLM 50 is a FET mic, the M 150 a tube mic.

Yes I thought so, as I quoted him, but like I said it is HIS RECOLLECTION of the 90’s. My recollection of the 90’s includes Hi Tops (hair) a beautyfull Shinead O’Connor singing (without a veil) Nothing Compares 2U on TV, DAT machines, Alesis 3630 & ADAT!!!

Memory is a soft muscle
Thanks for correcting his memories.

I still wonder what technique was used to record that “boys chorus” and other great Symphonic Orchestral arrangements at the time with M50’s?

M

 

[lp1000]

40mm ball arrived today, so here's an update.

Hey, the capsule looks great.
I only came across your article now, August 2024. The link doesn't work on ali anymore. Do you know if the capsule is still in production or where to get it? I would like to get the M50 with this capsule.

 

[k brown]

Hey, the capsule looks great.
I only came across your article now, August 2024. The link doesn't work on ali anymore. Do you know if the capsule is still in production or where to get it? I would like to get the M50 with this capsule.

Sold under several different names; all the same as this:
https://www.amazon.com/TAKSTAR-Inst...23270333&sprefix=takstar+cm-60,aps,250&sr=8-1

 

[kingkorg]

Hey, the capsule looks great.
I only came across your article now, August 2024. The link doesn't work on ali anymore. Do you know if the capsule is still in production or where to get it? I would like to get the M50 with this capsule.

You did read the whole article. It's a diy project, you need to build it using existing components.

 

[lp1000]

Influenced . . .
Project in progress for a Decca tree: fet-version of the M50 idea. UTM transformer.

View attachment 122763

the capsule in the sphere looks original.
Is that your work (the sphere and the embedded capsule)?
or did you buy it as a whole somewhere? Can you share the name of the shop or a link? I would like to get one with the AC701 lamp.

 

[lp1000]

Sold under several different names; all the same as this:
https://www.amazon.com/TAKSTAR-Instrument-Microphone-Professional-Gold-Plated/dp/B0C58ZVXHQ/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1EPTYQX8JZFJS&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.cHgNlsbuFDxCK4s6nsFRHw.gFNGBi0TF6LP93eFjuXUS2c2gOTp0ViF-5XofRKK1Uk&dib_tag=se&keywords=takstar+cm-60&qid=1723270333&sprefix=takstar+cm-60,aps,250&sr=8-1

Thanks for the message. I'll give it a try.
I made some U47 and M49, why not try M50, I still have some analogue AC701 tube.