Metallica Ride the Lighting compressor on guitar tracks?

[Bo Deadly]

Flemming comment about the use of studio EQ on the loop of the Mesa amps on Master of Puppets

Yup. At 24:30 describes using studio EQ on Boogie insert b/c "need to scoop out some of that mid-range".

He also mentions notes about those EQ settings which are still on Flemming Rasmussen's website:

ht tp://www.fwrproduction.com/FWR_Produktion/Notes_1.html

Here's a sample about guitar EQ on Battery:

Looks like two EQs involved somehow. One is some kind of slider type thing. The other looks an "Aphex" with concentric knobs.

 

[rachansky]

Looks like the "slider thing" is the stock EQ on some of the older mesa models. My .50 cal + has one anyway and I can get damn close to that tone with that amp. Interesting to see that recall sheet for the studio, gonna try to duplicate this later thanks for sharing!

 

[12afael]

yep that is the IIc+ or IIc++ graphic EQ. I´m lucky to have those two amps on loan here. the IIc+ sound great but when you try the IIc++ the IIc+ sound like a toy. I´m impressed how close you can get to that tone with the JCM800 and some eq.

 

[12afael]

I´m missing the correct cabinet. it seems it was a G12 65 that is a more hifi speaker. the closest I have is a cream back I think.

 

[Matador]

That is super close!

I purchased a damaged 2C (not plus) at an estate sale that someone had gutted the preamp and glued in tons of crap with silicon glue. I gutted the chassis and am in the process of redoing the PCB's (as best I can) to restore it and also add in the 2C+ changes.

I've yet to find a source which explains exactly what the "++" mod is, and how it changes the architecture of the amp.

 

[12afael]

I have this amps well documented but I think they change a lot too. Specially on the clean channel path there are some inconsistencies. Does that 2C have the graphic eq?

 

[Matador]

 

[12afael]

That is a coliseum version. Nice. Are you going to build a 2c+ or 2c++? Let me know if you need some help.

 

[Matador]

Here is the schematic I'm going from for the 2C+:

http://sites.google.com/site/danoampstuff/mesa/Mesa_MK2C+_SLOCLONE_v2.pdf
According to this:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1ieTnMLeSiNDoXu_9Or0ky2RIDwbLAcUQ
The ++ mod is (with #2 having most of the effect):

1) Adding a 3.3M+10pF bypass around the lead section (I think this should allow more bleed of the lead channel into the clean channel when the lead is disengaged) - it might also reduce popping when switching.
2) Adding a 15uF cathode bypass on V2B (would probably account for the gain increase on both the clean and lead channels)
3) A 330K resistor is added to the input of the lead channel, which should cut the signal leading into the lead channel gain stages slightly

 

[12afael]

There is some different values on this particular c++ I will write them tomorrow in case you want to try them.

 

[Matador]

There is some different values on this particular c++ I will write them tomorrow in case you want to try them.

Please! That would be outstanding!

I really wish there were clear pics available of a depopulated RP11A preamp board, as then I might be able to recreate the circuit with exact PCB's. However with so few remaining nobody is willing to do such a surgery.

 

[12afael]

I think I found some PCB layout of it. I will take a look tomorrow.

 

[12afael]

Using your second link as reference. from my notes for C++:
- no resistor from tonestack to gain pot.
- no C10
- in parallel to R10 there is 3.3M in serie with a ceramic cap marked 181k so I suppose it is 180p.
- no c11
- .47u in parallel to R16
- R21 = 1M
- no c27
- c29 = 20u
- R29 is a 15k with a 150k in parallel near the relay.
- 330k in parallel to 1M pot for Lead Drive.

This amp have a second master control and footswitch labeled "Solo" in the back I think that was made in the factory when the mod was applied.

many of this mods were done considering the simulclass output transformer. probably you have a different transformer so you might have to mod the circuit a bit.

I might be doing a reverse engineering on a broken IIC+ simulclass OT but that will take some time. I need to finish the transformer winding machine first.

 

[gnarmageddon]

Sorry to resuscitate an older thread here, but Michael Wagner mixed their follow-up and FWIW, he used the B&B/Aphex cx-1 and eqf-2 a lot for guitars (not just on MOP). I need to dig up the link to that interview, I think it was TapeOp... but anyways. I use the CX-1 compressor a lot. I've got three and am constantly hunting for more. It's a rare sighting, but you can usually find one in VGC with the Jensen JT-115 output transformer for around $2-300.

They are not what anyone would consider "subtle". They're pure attitude compressors. Take whatever super-clean vca comp you're thinking of when I say "transparent" - Focusrite Red? Shadow Hills? GML 2030? Sure. The CX-1 is their drunk half-brother who just can't get his life together, shows up to the family Thanksgiving drunk with his pregnant stripper girlfriend, and does key bumps in the bathroom between dinner and dessert.

IOW, I love them.

 

[EthanSpaulding]

I might be doing a reverse engineering on a broken IIC+ simulclass OT but that will take some time. I need to finish the transformer winding machine first.

When you do, verify against this reverse. I have wound this transformer with great results. The second time, I added a 16 ohm winding in the middle so it can drive Marshall cabs.

 

[12afael]

Wow thanks! Where did you get it? You did the reverse engineering? I will post my findings when I open this transformer.

 

[EthanSpaulding]

I did not reverse it. There is at least one thread on sloclone forum about this output transformer and various C+, C++ details. Of note are the placement of the reverb in the signal chain and the connection of the EL34's to the 1.7k primary tap and 6l6's to the 2.2k. Worth a read over there. There is even chassis details and single sided pcb transfer there that I used to cut and bang myself a chassis together with, so I may get back in on that project.

 

[EthanSpaulding]

I´m missing the correct cabinet. it seems it was a G12 65 that is a more hifi speaker. the closest I have is a cream back I think.

Killer playing 12afael. Really inspiring! I own a jcm800 slant 4x12 with March '82 Celestion g12-65's. I would describe the tone as tight and resonant. kinda makes you palm mute everything because its so lovely.

 

[12afael]

I have in my bench a IIc+ and IIc++. the IIc+ have a replaced transformer the original was burnt. I think it is one of the primaries. Anyway we measured the primary impedance and was way off. I don't recall at the moment but was on the opposite side of the acceptable impedance for 4 6L6. When you compare the power amp with the original it is like coming home. IIc+ is great but when you try the IIc++ then you know what is really good.

I should have seen that thread as I have been searching info for a long time but I will have to revisit it if I miss that file.

I hope someday I will cross path with one of those cabs. I have a small collection of amps but cabs are too big and loud to start collecting them... For now...

 

[12afael]

I found an interesting thread about the amplifier used. James describe it as a french made Marshall. probably it was for the canadian market and was sold on the scandinavian market for a while.

https://www.rig-talk.com/forum/threads/hetfield-the-ride-the-lightning-amp-was-a.220746/