Neve 1290 build completed!!

[madriaanse]

So the shootout was:
1 original 1073 handpicked from the BCM10 vs. 8 x BAE 1073 reissues vs. 2 x EZ1290s
Nothing scientific, just a 57 direct pumped through the mains doing vocal tests.
It was my friend, another engineer and myself, all the picks were unanimous.
The original, handpicked 1073 won.
EZ1290s got an easy second place (even with the trimmers in circuit)...
Needless to say I got the gig to build 2 four channel racks for the studio.

Cheers!!

Hi Stephen,

Thanks for doing that shootout! That's very interesting. I know Neve went through several different parts selections; it would be neat to know what's inside the unit that won. (carbon or metal film resistors, what caps, etc.) Is there any way we could get some very hi-res, close-up pictures of the inside of that module (especially BA183/BA283)? Based on those we could perhaps devise an alternate BOM for those who want a different (or improved) flavor of Neve. Doing the shootout without the trimpot in place would be of interest as well, but I don't want to get too gearslutzy about it. I really appreciate your efforts doing the shootout!

Many Thanks!!

m.

 

[Bluzzi]

Unless it was a full blind test and levels were matched there could be influences out of tester's control (I said could) no?

The 1290s make an SM57 like a $500 mike!

Glad you go the gig for the build.

Jim

 

[stitch-o]

Yesyes, I know 'double-blind and gagged in an anechoic chamber'...  ;D
For the credit of my friend who hosted the shootout, he has recorded MORE than his share of Neves
(Longview Farms, Hit Factory Staff, etc, etc).
We just set all the gain knobs identically, direct in with nothing else in the chain and, for a couple hours, patched back and forth
between units. Very unscientific, but, it still was revealing!
and got me the gig!  8)

I can ask my friend if I can crack open his 'nice' Neve and take some snapshots.
I am curious as well....

Bluzzi: methinks your 'Neve' eq with this and the line in card would make a VERY nice channel.
How goes it?

 

[Bluzzi]

I was wondering about that. I find evaluating gets confusing when everything sounds good. It sounds like that was the case. I'm sure they are all great preamps and very useful in one way or another especially at the price of a EZ1290!

As soon as I test the 1084 I'll contact Madriaanse (hi there!). Just waiting on a few last parts and the case. Don't want to do a hijack so I'll say no more here.

Jim

 

[stitch-o]

I was wondering about that. I find evaluating gets confusing when everything sounds good. It sounds like that was the case. I'm sure they are all great preamps and very useful in one way or another especially at the price of a EZ1290!

As soon as I test the 1084 I'll contact Madriaanse (hi there!). Just waiting on a few last parts and the case. Don't want to do a hijack so I'll say no more here.

Jim

Tho it was unscientific, and yes all sounded good, there was something more present and pronounced in the high-mids
on the EZ1290 that the BAEs did not have. Could have been the 1073 as a full circuit vs just the preamp of the EZ1290?
I dunno.
Again, all sounded good. EZ1290s played very nice with the other kids.

RE Neve eq: 1084s...holy moly! (as my son would say)

 

[Bluzzi]

The EZ1290 is exactly whats there in the amp sections (schematic wise). So its probably component and XFR differences.

Jim

 

[Whoops]

Hi everyone,

I'm about to drill out a case to rack up two channels of this great project and I'd be grateful if those with experience could have a look over my planned layout, pictured below:

My concern is the close proximity of the PSU transformer to the right EZ1290 PCB. This PCB has ended up over there as a result of my attempts to get the audio transformers as far away as possible from the mains trafo. (The gap to the right of each EZ1290 PCB is necessary for phase/pad/phantom/impedance switches and output trims.)

I have no experience with polystyrene caps. Does anyone know if they, or anything else on that PCB, will be particularly susceptible to EMI?

Cheers for any help!

Matthew

Hi Matthew,
I know that people here prefer external PSU, and I respect that, it has all the reasons to be better.

But to be honest I prefer to have all my PSU's inside the rack case, it's one less thing to carry, and less stuff on the floor.

This is a picture of the layout of my 1290 build, I should say that I don't have any noise, it's quite clean actually,
so it worked for me.

 

[kambo]

my layout is pretty much the same as Whoops's layout... no noise/no problem at all; even at max gain....

 

[Whoops]

Matthew,
how about this Layout?

I re-organized the layout in your picture, for one I think would work nicely.

 

[MatthewF]

Thanks for all the suggestions re: chassis layout.

Whoops, thanks for taking the time to post the potential improvements. Since reading the comments regarding the benefits of externally mounted PSU components I've come around to the idea of an external PSU. My main concern with an internal PSU is the proximity of the audio transformers to the mains transformer. Its good to hear this wasn't, however, a problem in your build Whoops.

I'll think this one over and let you know what I end up with...

Matthew

 

[kazper]

You may want to wait till your front panel shows up till you drill the holes of the PCB's....

 

[deuce42]

The EZ1290 is exactly whats there in the amp sections (schematic wise). So its probably component and XFR differences.

Jim

This sounds logical to me. So can someone help me understand which particular sections of the circuit would be most impacted by component changes? My experience to date has been that cap changes in the signal path do have quite distinct sound "signatures" but I am very keen to hear from someone with real knowledge (at least better than mine) about their opinions.

Cheers

 

[stitch-o]

The one thing I did was use NOS vintage RCA 2N3055s.
That and matched, vintage transistors all around is probably a good start.
I did notice, in my build, I used radial Nichicons for many of the EL positions.
The originals, I believe, use the siemens (blue) axials.
Do these have an impact on the pres sonics?
I do not know exactly...

 

[mitsos]

There are many threads on Neve circuit component choices..  Use old motorola 2N3055, or new ON Semi, but NOT new ST.  Check JLM's circuit page for what caps go where. Should use Tants where marked tant (if you want to be as close as possible), NOT lytics as some people like, but then again, those who use lytics in those places say they like the highs better with lytics instead of tants.  The rest of the lytics should likely be those axial Vishay/BC.  Resistors could be carbons if you wanna get real vintage, but metal films are what most people use nowadays. Carnhill trafos mostly, but Cinemags/sowters are cleaner is the general consensus.

 

[mitsos]

Use old motorola 2N3055, or new ON Semi, but NOT new ST

what's wrong with those ST's

Probably nothing, but it was the only brand 2N3055 that people talked bad about, so since there are other options, why risk it?
Toshibas should also be good.

http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=4249.0
http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=13058.0

 

[pedroplanet]

I used New ST's on mine... and my 1290 sound great.

for eletros, used panasonics fm, fc and some elnas.
silver mica on 100pf and 220pf, all others caps are styroflex.

Now I'm lazy to "Upgrade" the 2n3055, and probably there would be not much improvement...(i think)

 

[desol]

I used New ST's on mine... and my 1290 sound great.

for eletros, used panasonics fm, fc and some elnas.
silver mica on 100pf and 220pf, all others caps are styroflex.

Now I'm lazy to "Upgrade" the 2n3055, and probably there would be not much improvement...(i think)

Well, as far as i know...the sound of a Neve has alot to do with distortion values. So, by using older crappier parts and the right transformers...you will get the right distortion. So in effect, an improvement is counter to what one actually wants in a Neve. Closer to the old style distortion would be more accurate. I guess this would be an improvement.  :

 

[stitch-o]

THE CRACKLE IS BACK!!!
Goddamn.
And of course it was when a client was borrowing them.
I know it is mine own fault.  :'(

My first instinct from here: I never beefed up the heatsinks in the PS.
I think that is the problem as the last time I powered it down, the PS enclosure was warm to the touch.
BUT its only the left channel...right channel is fine.
Do you think:
Could this be the PS or do I still have a cold solder point somewhere in the left channel?

I get to the bottom of these one way or another...

Also, RE Stitch's lil Neve shootout: So, I was out at the studio where we shot out the Neve's, talking with my friend.
I mentioned this thread and the great response he gave regarding our shootout.
He admitted the cherry Original, Handpicked, Vintage Neve module wasn't so vintage.
It was, if of any consequence, handpicked between more than a dozen repros and A/B'd against his friends
Original 1073. Of which it sounded "as good", so say they.
Convoluted but more accurate, which I can appreciate but sucks ass none the less.
I hate being mis-informed.

Many apologies for passing alone that false information, even tho I had no knowledge of this before. (see sig)

This all came up when I asked to take pictures of the gutz, but since it turned out to be vintage "Averil", I neglected.

Sorry folks.

This, however, does not mean these don't sound GREAT!

Which they do...


When they don't crackle...



fuk

 

[snipsnip]

i never resolved my crackle either as I have moved house and am snowed under with messier diy at the moment!

However, I did order some little PCB's from fivefish that fit on the input transformer. Im then either going to to use a molex header or screw terminal to attach my input wiring, as this is where I believe the problem to be (as I have my voltage regs heatsinked to psu case).

If I ever find time to do it I'll let you know how I get on (wont be for a long time though!).

 

[kambo]

i had a crackle once, while i was playing around with some ba283 cards...
i founded a hair of cable on output tranie was shorting...
double checking soldering/cabling with magnified glass might help...