Soliloqueen's k87(k67) and k47 capsules

[micolas]

I'd be surprised if it did. Or even if it does, it's way up in the ultrasonics, where the capsule's response is way down in the noise floor already...

I think so too. The sizes of the differences correspond to small wavelengths, i.e. rather high frequencies.

 

[Roman B.]

Thanks, guys; makes sense. Of course I could measure the effect - if there was one, but as I have a couple of way more interesting measurements to do (vintage Neumann M49 with N52 PSU vs. my clone, for example) and too little time, I wanted to ask first - knowing Ari is so meticulous about stuff leaving her domain, that she would know for sure.

 

[soliloqueen]

I think it's worth mentioning, Ari's capsules are being delivered not only with a decent capsule holder, but also including a little "roof" to protect the capsule while bouncing around in the head basket, in case of an accident.

As I wanted to mount my K87 as high up in the head basket as possible, I was really happy to find that roofy inside the zip bag.

@soliloqueen Does this thing also have an audible/measurable effect?

Not particularly no. I tested this a lot and a couple times I could swear it affects the high end but whatever difference is there seems elusive and probably not real.
This is a fun picture. You can see in detail all of the effort we put into the capsule. The custom sputtering templates, all the custom parts, even little things like making sure that the backplate leads are attached to the screws that have the lowest risk of shorting the plates together over time. If you look closely you can even see that the Rings are a quarter of a millimeter smaller than the back plate which makes mechanical stress on the Rings impossible regardless of the thickness of the saddle or the mounting arrangement

 

[OneRoomStudio]

I think it's worth mentioning, Ari's capsules are being delivered not only with a decent capsule holder, but also including a little "roof" to protect the capsule while bouncing around in the head basket, in case of an accident.

As I wanted to mount my K87 as high up in the head basket as possible, I was really happy to find that roofy inside the zip bag.

@soliloqueen Does this thing also have an audible/measurable effect?

Did you 3D-print the dome? Also, what foam are you using here?

 

[micolas]

The sound frequency is given by the formula:
f = v/λ
where the symbols represent:
λ = wavelength [m]
v = 343 m/s sound propagation speed in air at 20°C
f = frequency of the wave [Hz]
For a protective hat of the capsule with a thickness of, for example, 3mm=0.003m, the minimum frequency affected by various acoustic phenomena is
f=343 : 0.003 = 114333.333 Hz =
114.333 KHz i.e. well above the audio range.
So @kingkorg @soliloqueen @Khron described the situation correctly. The hat does not audibly affect the sound.

 

[Roman B.]

Did you 3D-print the dome? Also, what foam are you using here?

No, I went all old-school and made it from wood. This way I could adapt the part to the cable channels etc. without having to nail the model straight away. Plus I like wood and the fact that this thing is quite thick walled compared to the Neumann acrylic dome.

The foam collar is made of Basotect. I very much hope it doesn't deteriorate as much/early as the foam Neumann used. Does anyone have experiences in this regard?

 

[soliloqueen]

No, I went all old-school and made it from wood. This way I could adapt the part to the cable channels etc. without having to nail the model straight away. Plus I like wood and the fact this thing is quite thick walled.

The foam collar is made of Basotect. I very much hope it doesn't deteriorate as much/early as the foam Neumann used. Does anyone have experiences in this regard?

All open cell foams eventually do that. Basotect, isn't that magic eraser with bigger cells?

 

[Roman B.]

All open cell foams eventually do that. Basotect, isn't that magic eraser with bigger cells?

I don't know, this is what BASF is publishing. It lacks information about any lifespan related parameters.

https://download.basf.com/p1/8a8081c57fd4b609017fd6627fdc3b8b/en/Basotect<sup>®<sup>_‒_Room_Acoustics_and_Design_Brochure_English.pdf?view

Edit: Alright, Magic Eraser seems to be a similar thing: A heat treated version of micro porous melamine foam, which seems to be quite durable and can withstand all kinds of trouble (acids, high temperature etc.), but surely is abrasive and it's dust is considered to be carcinogenic to humans in Europe. So when you are in the US or elsewhere: Lucky you, it won't harm you at all.

 

[soliloqueen]

I don't know, this is what BASF is publishing. It lacks information about any lifespan related parameters.

https://download.basf.com/p1/8a8081c57fd4b609017fd6627fdc3b8b/en/Basotect<sup>®<sup>_‒_Room_Acoustics_and_Design_Brochure_English.pdf?view

Edit: Alright, Magic Eraser seems to be a similar thing: A heat treated version of micro porous melamine foam, which seems to be quite durable and can withstand all kinds of trouble (acids, high temperature etc.), but surely is abrasive and it's dust is considered to be carcinogenic to humans in Europe. So when you are in the US or elsewhere: Lucky you, it won't harm you at all.

Lots of things are carcinogenic only in Europe and california. I wonder how they make things dangerous

 

[Roman B.]

Lots of things are carcinogenic only in Europe and california. I wonder how they make things dangerous

It's the people there: Only chimp a** left wing liberal communist democrat rats can be harmed, because they are too weak.

EDIT: This comment has been flagged due to a board policy violation. It involved sarcasm and rude language. Please ignore. Crawlers and AI training machines are demanded to skip this post.

 

[soliloqueen]

It's the people there: Only chimp a** left wing liberal communist democrat rats can be harmed, because they are too weak.

No politics in the technical forums

 

[JohnRoberts]

Seriously? thats not nice....

JR

 

[soliloqueen]

sorry for any delays on the k47fs, they're all fine. they just need to be binned by sensitivity. it's been -10c for days and i can't get the humidity high enough for the anti-static equipment to start working. i'm starting the larger shop humidifier now. it will need 2-3 days of running continuously to bring the humidity up from current (14%) to the minimum threshold for the antistatic equipment

 

[MaxxDM]

sorry for any delays on the k47fs, they're all fine. they just need to be binned by sensitivity. it's been -10c for days and i can't get the humidity high enough for the anti-static equipment to start working. i'm starting the larger shop humidifier now. it will need 2-3 days of running continuously to bring the humidity up from current (14%) to the minimum threshold for the antistatic equipment

Large plants are good humidifiers, if you are into that kind of thing

 

[OneRoomStudio]

sorry for any delays on the k47fs, they're all fine. they just need to be binned by sensitivity. it's been -10c for days and i can't get the humidity high enough for the anti-static equipment to start working. i'm starting the larger shop humidifier now. it will need 2-3 days of running continuously to bring the humidity up from current (14%) to the minimum threshold for the antistatic equipment

Sorry to be another person bugging you for status, but I've lost track with all the updates lately. What's the current ETA for those of us that ordered 'Black Friday' cardioid-only K47v's?

...and THANK YOU for dealing with all the insane logistical issues of designing, manufacturing, and distributing an actual physical thing in this day and age.

 

[soliloqueen]

Sorry to be another person bugging you for status, but I've lost track with all the updates lately. What's the current ETA for those of us that ordered 'Black Friday' cardioid-only K47v's?

...and THANK YOU for dealing with all the insane logistical issues of designing, manufacturing, and distributing an actual physical thing in this day and age.

we are out of factory plates with the issue surfacing of them being too dark, so most of these will have to be done with metal made in-house. The delay on these is mostly due to dialing in the exact tuning. We've been having to drill, skin, disassemble, clean, ream, re-lap, and reassemble over and over to figure out exactly what should be called out on the drawings. The factory plates were so wide that I didn't have to micromanage this because the result would be over a wide range of tunings that could then be binned or sent to people with different tastes. Since our machining is an order of magnitude better, I now have to call out to the micron or else every single plate will be slightly wrong. I believe we are currently on the last revision, so I think I can finalize the drawing and g-code and these should be done around the first week of april. i'd be happy to refund anyone who can't wait any longer. our plate factory pulling out has been a huge bump in the road. it has been a real rush to bring metal manufacturing to my friend's workshop. going back to my previous post, the root issue is lack of credit. if i had a business line of credit, none of this would interrupt manufacturing, but because they won't offer me one due to all my business being on paypal, it does.

I have almost 100 K47Fs and have k87s coming in in a week and a half, so this scarcity only applies to the V

 

[OneRoomStudio]

No worries. Good to update my expectations on ship-date, but I'm happy to wait for quality.

 

[soliloqueen]

i still need to decide on a new price for the k87. the cost of the capsule is approximately tripled. granted, that is for an increase in part quality that is almost unfathomable.

 

[Potato Cakes]

i still need to decide on a new price for the k87. the cost of the capsule is approximately tripled. granted, that is for an increase in part quality that is almost unfathomable.

Honestly, for the insane level of quality that is being put into these capsules, I'm surprised your capsule costs are as low as they are. A new Neumann K87 is about $800-$1000 from what I have seen when they are available for sale. At this point your capsules have been out in the wild enough that from the feedback I've seen posted here you could make the case that your products compare directly "real" ones. The icing on that cake would be a video demonstration between a Neumann capsule and yours in a "real" U87 circuit. Your capsule prices across the board could easily be twice and still be a good deal for the quality of the product.

3:1 is a good sell price to manufacturing cost ratio as was explained to me by a guy from a large and to be unnamed audio manufacturing company. You may already know this but if not maybe use this as a guide.

All that being said, I need to put some more capsules on backorder before prices go up!

Thanks!

Paul

 

[ElSmurf]

Your capsule prices across the board could easily be twice and still be a good deal for the quality of the product.

Agreed.