TC Electronic problems...

[JohnX]

Well, occasionally one of these supplies was just...dead. I may still have a few of these kicking around...I can check next week. If I revive one, I'll let you know.

I tend to assume that all of these things are salvageable, but I don’t have the skill set to complete an accurate diagnosis.

I would absolutely celebrate if you do find one, but I’m not going to get my hopes up just yet. Thanks in advance.

 

[JohnX]

As much as I love my DIY journey, I am so much at the beginning of it that I think I’m going to need someone to help me with this. I don’t think that diagnosing/troubleshooting/rebuilding a dead power supply falls into the category of an ideal noob project. I can already tell you that this will just end up sitting in a box for another 20 years.

As I’ve mentioned earlier, I don’t really know what I’m doing yet. Building a passive DI and passive color boxes is very simple compared to this.

@Khron - If I were to reach out to someone in this group to help with this repair, should I create a different thread somewhere else? I think I saw a “for hire” thread.

 

[fazer]

Mine also had a blown IC on the daughter board. You can check the IC with an ohm meter. It will show low ohms (.1 to .3 or so ) when it dies between various pins indicating it’s shorted out. You need a solder sucker to remove it without destroying the pc daughter board.

 

[MidnightArrakis]

I replaced the capacitor this morning and unfortunately, I’m still not getting any power to the device.

[I’m still not getting any power to the device] -- Have you tried taking the AC-power cord and then inserting it into a working wall-outlet? That should be your first step!!! (HEY!!! I'm kidding!!!).....

I don't believe I have seen anywhere in this thread whether or not you have and/or use any test equipment like a basic "Voltmeter". If you don't, buy one!!! They're cheap these days and you can even find them at Home Depot and Lowe's since Radio Shack no longer exists.

If you do have one or after you have bought one.....start-off just doing the most basic of troubleshooting procedures by setting your voltmeter to "AC - Volts" on probably the "200 VAC" scale and probe the wires where the AC-cord enters into the chassis. GOT VOLTS??? If so, then follow that until you get to the input of the power-supply. If not, then you've got a defective AC-power cord.

From there, probe whatever wires or PCB-tracks are along the way. Do you have AC-voltage at the input of the transformer or power-supply? If so, it's a start. If not, then something along the way is defective.

After the power-supply, set your voltmeter to "DC - Volts" maybe around the "50 VDC" scale. GOT VOLTS? If so, then the power-supply works. Is your reading within an acceptable range? If not, then you've got a defective power-supply.

From there, simply just use the same basic "Yes/No" logic. Somewhere along the way, you'll have a voltage-reading on one side of a component and not on the other side. VOILA!!! YA FOUND THE PROBLEM!!! YAY!!!.....

Or.....ship the unit off to a TC Electronic repair shop and just resign yourself of having to pay the cost of the repair!!!

And, now.....here's a link to another forum where the members of this forum are discussing -- THE EXACT SAME ISSUE -- that you are having and apparently, one member has traced the problem down to one part as is detailed here:

Originally Posted by poker909

... There is one IC on that board who's number I did not write down, but it is a 6pin and neither Digi-Key or Mouser knew what that was, so it may be proprietary for this unit...

Quick google search says it's an opto-isolator:

http://www.vishay.com/docs/83886/83886.pdf

That going bad would probably take the unit down, which is actually what it's supposed to do (it's some kind of current overprotection), though I don't know what would cause it to do that. That's actually for the CNY17F; yours is a CNY17G, which appears to be the same, just higher current or something. The F version is in fact a 23 cent part at Mouser, so you could try it.

Here's the link for the entire thread:

https://gearspace.com/board/so-much...-electronic-fireworx-dead-power-supplies.html

And.....here's the schematic of the Fireworx power-supply:



Here's a link that might help you out as a source of the probable problem:

https://gearspace.com/board/showthread.php?p=3980142



After much research, patience and a lot of luck, I managed to narrow the fault down to a single capacitor and a resistor in the primary section of the power supply. This repair cost approx. $2 for the cap and 98-cents for the resistor. Having said that, I do need to add the advice I was given by a qualified electrical engineer:

The power supplies in these units are known as SMPS or Switch Mode Power Supplies. Unlike linear power supplies, SMPS have the potential to retain high voltages (up to 400v) for a considerable length of time after being disconnected from the mains power source. It is safer to buy a replacement than risk your life tampering with these circuits if you are unsure and are unable to safely perform the troubleshooting and repair procedures.

There is some interesting reading here if you have the time. It could save your life.

--- Sci.Electronics FAQ: Repair: SMPS Repair
http://www.repairfaq.org/REPAIR/F_SwitcherPS.html

>>> GOOD LUCK!!! <<<

/

 

[JohnX]

[I’m still not getting any power to the device] -- Have you tried taking the AC-power cord and then inserting it into a working wall-outlet? That should be your first step!!! (HEY!!! I'm kidding!!!).....

Thanks so much for all of those great suggestions. I’m guessing you did not see my most recent comment.

I don’t think that my diagnostic skills have reached any sort of point where I could accomplish all of what you have described in less than a year. The extent of my abilities so far has been building passive direct boxes and passive transformer color boxes & a few fun things from kits.
What my DIY journey has not really covered yet is diagnosis and troubleshooting.
As much as this could be a great experience in that area, I would certainly learn more from someone who actually knew what they were doing, which is the exact opposite of who I am.

I can predict a standard type of outcome if I do this myself. I will invariably damage something while I am removing chips or something smaller. That will immediately make everything worse, but I will not know how much worse until much later. Although your approach does seem like the most rational & sensible, another consideration is that my experience with my voltmeter is crude and 90% of the time I realize that I have it set incorrectly. We’re not really on speaking terms yet.

Unfortunately, I also truly don’t have the time for this particular device as a “priority project” & I don’t wish for it to spend another 15 years in storage or worse.

In my previous recent comment, I had mentioned that I would be looking for someone to help complete this diagnosis and asked if I should be posting that request as a separate thread elsewhere. Is that what I should do?

 

[OmskInfo]

Hi all. Looking for some help here with my dead TC Finalizer. Give power to the rear, but absolutely no activity on the front panel. Soft power button doesn't blink, nothing comes on. Figured this was a dead power supply as this seems a common issue. However, instead of trying to hunt down the bad parts on the PSU (as there are many parts), I inserted a new power supply: An XP Power ECM40UT33 which provides two +5VDC outs, plus a +15VDC and -15VDC. I've connected these outputs to the same lines as on the original—the only difference here is that the purple SB-VCC line has no connection to the new PSU since the new PSU doesn't have any standby mode (this new PSU will just provide the full power as soon as mains voltage is applied).

When I DON'T have the PSU connected to the Finalizer main board, I'm able to read the correct voltages on the various output pins of the PSU. However, when I then connect the PSU to the Finalizer main board, not only does the Finalizer not turn on, but the voltages I measure from the PSU are now way lower. The +5VDC lines only register about +0.05VDC, and the +/-15VDC lines only measure about +/-5VDC.

Does anyone have any clue as to why this might be happening? It's almost like something on the main board is shorting the power supply (though nothing smokes, smells, or overheats). This is really bizarre, and I love my Finalizer!

Any advice is appreciated.

 

[gyraf]

not enough power in your replacement supply?

 

[OmskInfo]

I figured out the issue: one of the heat sinks was touching the metal cage around the PSU, and thus was conducting to the housing. When I unmounted the PSU from the Finalizer, it powered on. So I had to file down a portion of the cage and cover it all in electrical tape so there wouldn’t be any shorts to the heat sinks. Now works fine.

 

[Andy Jackson]

I bought a TDK Lamda MTW15-51515. It fits in nicely into the M2000, and the unit runs fine...but...it runs VERY hot, and generates an INSANE amount of heat when running for 30 mins. The M2000 unit specs do say it should be running at <20W, however the TDK is around 15W (max 17.5W). I'm wondering if the M2000 is pushing the TDK close to or over the max, hence the heat? Has anyone else experienced this issue? Could this be a byproduct of tying the power good lines to the 5V rail, to start the supply/unit?

I've bought a MeanWell RT50C to try, and I'll run it externally. It's rated 50W, so well above the stated 20W or less. Lets see what happens...I'll pop back later, and let you know how this one works out.

 

[Rob Flinn]

I've bought a MeanWell RT50C to try, and I'll run it externally. It's rated 50W, so well above the stated 20W or less. Lets see what happens...I'll pop back later, and let you know how this one works out.

Hi Andy, can I ask how you got on the the RT50C supply ? I'm thinking of using one for something else.

 

[Andy Jackson]

Hi Andy, can I ask how you got on the the RT50C supply ? I'm thinking of using one for something else.

Hullo Rob, I haven't recieved it yet (still waiting on RS UK to get it to me - back ordered apparently) however rest assured when it arrives, I'll let you know what's what.

 

[Andy Jackson]

Hi Andy, can I ask how you got on the the RT50C supply ? I'm thinking of using one for something else.

Hi Rob!

So the PSU arrived, I've fitted it, and I'm currently soak testing it to see how warm it gets. So far, I've been running +4bBu pink noise into, and out of the unit for the past four hours, and the PSU is not even warm (which is a result). The TDK one could have fried a steak at this point.

It's all a bit Heath Robinson at the moment, with the PSU linked with some Wago connectors, but I'll probably use a 5 pin DIN as the link between the unit and the PSU (a-la Novation Nova). It's a pity it's all external, BUT at least it's no cause for concern now, and I can resume using it in the studio. Hurrah!

 

[Rob Flinn]

Hi Rob!

So the PSU arrived, I've fitted it, and I'm currently soak testing it to see how warm it gets. So far, I've been running +4bBu pink noise into, and out of the unit for the past four hours, and the PSU is not even warm (which is a result). The TDK one could have fried a steak at this point.

It's all a bit Heath Robinson at the moment, with the PSU linked with some Wago connectors, but I'll probably use a 5 pin DIN as the link between the unit and the PSU (a-la Novation Nova). It's a pity it's all external, BUT at least it's no cause for concern now, and I can resume using it in the studio. Hurrah!

Thanks for the update Andy, I think I will get one and see if it will work with this behringer ada8000 I have on the bench at the moment.