The real attack on Democracy.

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What I find most interesting is when states enact I.d. Requirements to vote. The interesting part is how an Id is required for just about everything else in life yet some people object to such laws. Are they trying to say their base can’t get a state issued Id of some sort? Or do they think proof of who you are is a threat to democracy? It baffles the mind.
 
pucho812 said:
What I find most interesting is when states enact I.d. Requirements to vote. The interesting part is how an Id is required for just about everything else in life yet some people object to such laws. Are they trying to say their base can’t get a state issued Id of some sort? Or do they think proof of who you are is a threat to democracy? It baffles the mind.
Click to expand...

It seems the former:
https://www.businessinsider.com/voter-identification-requirements-in-each-state-2020-8?amp
 
Recording Engineer said:
Since voter-fraud is not really a problem, as experts on both sides agree, why such a massive-push for a non-problem?
Click to expand...
The "experts on both sides" are blatantly lying, you go figure the reasons. Sometimes it is literally pride, where these idiots refuse to admit there might be a problem.
A thorough comb through voter roles in states shows how much of a problem it is.
Look at what they found in the state that elected the half-there festerman to the US senate- over 150,000 invalid registrations, and they have to publish the roles for a few years. How many of them voted in the last few elections?
Again in PA, the USPS finally released, a YEAR after the finding, that, yeah, a truck delivered sealed mail-in ballots, tens of thousands of them, to two locations in PA, delivered from Bethpage NY. All new NY residents voting where they used to live, right? NO, because there was zero paperwork for the mass delivery, AND they still cannot find the trailer. "At this point what difference does it make?!?" Shrillary Clinton.
Voter fraud is a HUGE problem, and it blantantly ignored by almost all election officials, you go figure the reasons. There is a current verification system, ERIC, that is anything but. Red states are dropping ERIC because they are only a facade of verification, leaving thousands of invalid names on the roles.
As far as the OP, every state has their own laws regarding ballot initiatives. CA does what it pleases when it ignores ballot initiatives. The gist of the article is that the feds have to "get in there" and enforce one size fits all laws which is unconstitutional. Whenever folks are talking "Democracy! Democracy!" you should be looking for where your rights are being eroded, because they are, no matter how much melanin in your skin.
 
sodderboy said:
The "experts on both sides" are blatantly lying, you go figure the reasons. Sometimes it is literally pride, where these idiots refuse to admit there might be a problem.
A thorough comb through voter roles in states shows how much of a problem it is.
Look at what they found in the state that elected the half-there festerman to the US senate- over 150,000 invalid registrations, and they have to publish the roles for a few years. How many of them voted in the last few elections?
Again in PA, the USPS finally released, a YEAR after the finding, that, yeah, a truck delivered sealed mail-in ballots, tens of thousands of them, to two locations in PA, delivered from Bethpage NY. All new NY residents voting where they used to live, right? NO, because there was zero paperwork for the mass delivery, AND they still cannot find the trailer. "At this point what difference does it make?!?" Shrillary Clinton.
Voter fraud is a HUGE problem, and it blantantly ignored by almost all election officials, you go figure the reasons. There is a current verification system, ERIC, that is anything but. Red states are dropping ERIC because they are only a facade of verification, leaving thousands of invalid names on the roles.
As far as the OP, every state has their own laws regarding ballot initiatives. CA does what it pleases when it ignores ballot initiatives. The gist of the article is that the feds have to "get in there" and enforce one size fits all laws which is unconstitutional. Whenever folks are talking "Democracy! Democracy!" you should be looking for where your rights are being eroded, because they are, no matter how much melanin in your skin.
Click to expand...
two things can be true... A) that voter fraud exists, and B) that it is NOT statistically significant. ***

Likewise it is the business of politics to win elections which is accomplished by securing more votes for your guy, and less for the other guy. There are laws protecting citizen's voting rights.

These issues resemble two sides of the same coin and are flogged to stir up respective political bases to raise money. This election is shaping up to be a barn burner.. buckle up and strap in for the ride. ;)

JR

*** in my judgement suppression of embarrassing news (like hunter's laptop) immediately before elections could be statistically significant.
 
I think election officials ignore voter fraud because it’s job security. No different than politicians and pot holes, road crews and pot holes. If you bring it up and never fix it, you still have the task of fixing it.
They also seem to think that most fraud fits into margin if error catagory
 
sodderboy said:
Look at what they found in the state that elected the half-there festerman to the US senate- over 150,000 invalid registrations, and they have to publish the roles for a few years. How many of them voted in the last few elections?
Click to expand...

CLAIM: In the leadup to the midterm elections, some social media users are claiming ballots have been sent to hundreds of thousands of unverified voters in Pennsylvania.

But the claim is misleading. The ballots were sent to 255,000 people who were unverified at the time, but that's only because Pennsylvania allows voters to be verified at several different points in the voting process. Any ballots where a voter's identification hasn't been verified before the election won't be counted, officials said. The number of unverified voters shrunk while the verification process continued leading up to the election, and there were about 7,600 ballot applications still in need of verification as of Oct. 28.

Leigh Chapman, Pennsylvania’s acting secretary of state, wrote that the claim was “incorrect” in an Oct. 28 response to the Republicans' letter, saying it “reflects a misunderstanding of the law and data.” That number is dramatically less than the post claims because of the process laid out in state law. Pennsylvania requires anyone who applies for a mail-in or absentee ballot to supply proof of identification, such as a driver's license or the last four digits of a Social Security number, according to the Department of State.

But county election officials have to give a mail-in or absentee ballot to any registered voter who requests one, regardless of whether they provide proper identification at that time, said Amy Gulli, communications director for the Pennsylvania Department of State. The "vast majority of voters" provide identification at the time of their request, but if they don't, voters can still submit their identification until six days after the election, Gulli said. Chapman wrote that the department's guidance specifically directs counties not to count any ballots where a voter's identification hasn't been validated.
Click to expand...
 
A lot of “I think” and liar-calling to be had… Who’s to say what the truth is? Could be me, you, or the experts. What matters is what’s played out in court and that shows no wide-spread election-fraud, throwing elections. I think most in the game will focus on what wins elections, not what doesn’t; voter-fraud apparently doesn’t.
 
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The truth is that the State of Pennsylvania, in a settlement that THEY offered, had to remove over 150,000 "registered voters" from the system, and they have to publish their roles for at least four years following. NO state will open their roles 100% willingly, so they have to be forced. How many of those invalids voted in 2020? 2022? The SOS will have to be taken to court again to look at that.
That is the real battle now, making sure that the voter registrations are legit. PA is the first stop on a long ride.
The truth is that the Dominion machines in the State of Georgia are vulnerable on multiple levels because they are networked, and the SOS will do nothing about it before the 2024.
Just two of many examples.
All this "ID validation five days after" "ballot healing" and "Election Month" are all exploitable and are exploited.
When a state's Electoral College votes are decided with less than 20,000 votes, fraud is a VERY important tool in influencing elections.
Just imagine if "folks" could go over the registration roles in Oregon and Washington states, where mail-in has been the norm for years. Hoo-boy!
ERIC and Dominion have to be cancelled in the courts, case by case.
I'll agree to Election Month and 100% mail-in/internet voting if there are citizen-verified registration roles and a block-chain registration system. There are just too many foxes on too many levels.
Mike
 
sodderboy said:
The truth is that the State of Pennsylvania, in a settlement that THEY offered, had to remove over 150,000 "registered voters" from the system, and they have to publish their roles for at least four years following. NO state will open their roles 100% willingly, so they have to be forced. How many of those invalids voted in 2020? 2022? The SOS will have to be taken to court again to look at that.
That is the real battle now, making sure that the voter registrations are legit. PA is the first stop on a long ride.
The truth is that the Dominion machines in the State of Georgia are vulnerable on multiple levels because they are networked, and the SOS will do nothing about it before the 2024.
Just two of many examples.
All this "ID validation five days after" "ballot healing" and "Election Month" are all exploitable and are exploited.
When a state's Electoral College votes are decided with less than 20,000 votes, fraud is a VERY important tool in influencing elections.
Just imagine if "folks" could go over the registration roles in Oregon and Washington states, where mail-in has been the norm for years. Hoo-boy!
ERIC and Dominion have to be cancelled in the courts, case by case.
I'll agree to Election Month and 100% mail-in/internet voting if there are citizen-verified registration roles and a block-chain registration system. There are just too many foxes on too many levels.
Mike
Click to expand...
It is important to inspire confidence in vote integrity.

JR
 
The manufacturer of your voting machines just invested in an independent security review...

The reviewer didn't even get the software or hardware to test. An open letter from people in the security field was released, demanding to withdraw the report as "not scientific".

Less than a month ago, some serious flaws were detected, again. These have not been patched yet. There's no money to do that and the govt feels it shouldn't pay for patching, as "It isn't their problem".

Why would anyone waste their time trying to defraud the system through humans, yielding one single vote every time if it can be done remotely in less than two minutes and yield any number of votes?

And that's not the worst. The worst part is Americans don't seem to care. Or is the matter too complicated?

This has been reported many times in the last 20 years. Nothing has changed. Oh, wait, something has changed: the manufacturer changed it's name several times...

And now that manufacturer is facing bankruptcy, pulling in a Spanish company they bought that will go under too.
 
sodderboy said:
The truth is that the State of Pennsylvania, in a settlement that THEY offered, had to remove over 150,000 "registered voters" from the system, and they have to publish their roles for at least four years following. NO state will open their roles 100% willingly, so they have to be forced. How many of those invalids voted in 2020? 2022? The SOS will have to be taken to court again to look at that.
That is the real battle now, making sure that the voter registrations are legit. PA is the first stop on a long ride.
The truth is that the Dominion machines in the State of Georgia are vulnerable on multiple levels because they are networked, and the SOS will do nothing about it before the 2024.
Just two of many examples.
All this "ID validation five days after" "ballot healing" and "Election Month" are all exploitable and are exploited.
When a state's Electoral College votes are decided with less than 20,000 votes, fraud is a VERY important tool in influencing elections.
Just imagine if "folks" could go over the registration roles in Oregon and Washington states, where mail-in has been the norm for years. Hoo-boy!
ERIC and Dominion have to be cancelled in the courts, case by case.
I'll agree to Election Month and 100% mail-in/internet voting if there are citizen-verified registration roles and a block-chain registration system. There are just too many foxes on too many levels.
Mike
Click to expand...
https://www.lwv.org/newsroom/press-...ates-prevail-pennsylvania-voter-purge-lawsuit
https://www.politicspa.com/federal-suit-over-pa-voter-rolls-settled/121305/
 
cyrano said:
The manufacturer of your voting machines just invested in an independent security review...

The reviewer didn't even get the software or hardware to test. An open letter from people in the security field was released, demanding to withdraw the report as "not scientific".
Click to expand...

Links, please.

cyrano said:
Less than a month ago, some serious flaws were detected, again. These have not been patched yet. There's no money to do that and the govt feels it shouldn't pay for patching, as "It isn't their problem".
Click to expand...
We're too busy giving our taxes away to foreign conflicts and those coming here illegally to worry about that.

cyrano said:
Why would anyone waste their time trying to defraud the system through humans, yielding one single vote every time if it can be done remotely in less than two minutes and yield any number of votes?
Click to expand...

Vote harvesting at nursing homes and by other means is also "useful" and can be done by those not technically saavy.

cyrano said:
And that's not the worst. The worst part is Americans don't seem to care. Or is the matter too complicated?
Click to expand...

Plenty of us care.

cyrano said:
This has been reported many times in the last 20 years. Nothing has changed. Oh, wait, something has changed: the manufacturer changed it's name several times...
Click to expand...

That has changed as has the attitude of "Democrats" toward these problems. Remember the 2000 and 2004 elections when all of the left was (rightfully) inflamed about Diebold and crappy voting system technology that was being used in more and more precincts? I do. Now the BS tech is unavoidable. But Democrats now scream "most secure election ever" when the flaws are apparent.

cyrano said:
And now that manufacturer is facing bankruptcy, pulling in a Spanish company they bought that will go under too.
Click to expand...
Links?
 
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cyrano said:
And that's not the worst. The worst part is Americans don't seem to care. Or is the matter too complicated?
Click to expand...
It is complicated for sure.
There are those who care, those who don’t care, those who care when they are told to care, those who ignore because they are told to, those who think it’s not a big deal because it’s not enough to tip the scale and any combination of those based on importance of the election. For example they may not care at a local level but care at a national level and Vice versa.
 

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