Tube PT2399 delay as an add-on for a tube spring reverb?

GroupDIY Audio Forum

Help Support GroupDIY Audio Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

rock soderstrom

Tour de France
Joined
Oct 14, 2009
Messages
3,576
Location
Berlin
Hi guys, I know one or two OP amps can do this better, but I'll ask anyway. I have a tube spring reverb that I would like to add an integrated delay to. At the moment I'm using a DIY Wampler Faux Echo external pedal for it, sounds good, I've changed a few things.

I would like to use this schematic for my tube mod. I've made a rough sketch, would that work?

B+ and H+ come from the spring reverb, I would rectify the 5VDC for the PT2399 from the heating 6.3AC winding.

20231112_234722.jpg


Edit. Changed schematic for better CF
 
Last edited:
Im not sure Id want the delay in series with the reverb input , mixing it back in parallel with the abillity to send a portion of the delayed signal back to the tank ,maybe ?
 
Im not sure Id want the delay in series with the reverb input , mixing it back in parallel with the abillity to send a portion of the delayed signal back to the tank ,maybe ?
Well, the CF at the output is supposed to mix in the delay via the level pot. (If that works?), so the delay is parallel to the source signal.
 
Okay, I still don't know what you mean, sorry. 😅

Can you sketch that out?

With the OP amp pedal version it works very well. The delay expands the sound possibilities of the reverb enormously. The combination of slap back echo and spring reverb for instance sounds really great.
 
regeneration , that basically means feedback from output to input , used with a spring it extends the decay and makes it sound more smooth .

Good idea to repurpose a biscuit tin to house pedal electronics ,
its cheap and gives good screening ,
 
regeneration , that basically means feedback from output to input , used with a spring it extends the decay and makes it sound more smooth .
Thanks, I will try that.
Good idea to repurpose a biscuit tin to house pedal electronics ,
its cheap and gives good screening ,
Yep, other advantages are the simple mechanical hold for all the required components. These sheet metal boxes are also very easy to machine, as the wall thickness is very thin. The whole thing is also kept nice and tidy until the final chassis is finished. Last but not least, the provision of such test housings is very tasty... ;)
 
Maybe consider a highpass filter w/resonance control in the feedback loop. Maybe an insert point for other stuff like phasers and flangers?
Thanks for joining this thread!

In fact, I looked into this at the beginning of my experiments. My original goal was to build an effect device that behaves more like an instrument.

I've completely moved away from that, not because it would be bad, but because my focus has changed musically.

My goal for some time now has been to keep the delay rather minimal, short slapback echoes and early reflections are the goal. What's important to me is the sound and how the effect handles high levels. I am currently experimenting with a diode clipper to protect the PT2399 from too much clipping..

I'm also trying to keep the background noise as low as possible.

It's amazing what this 1.50€ chip can do. I like the sound, it sounds really good.
 
There's plenty of scope to mash up PT2399 mayhem with gunslinger Metasonix tubery, but I can't see much point in tacking in bootstrapped cathode followers to be blunt. As others say colouring by altered feedback is a creative area.
 
Is the PSU in your valve spring reverb capable of supplying another valve ?
Yep, no problem.
There's plenty of scope to mash up PT2399 mayhem with gunslinger Metasonix tubery, but I can't see much point in tacking in bootstrapped cathode followers to be blunt.
I fully understand this perspective, but I will continue to do it anyway. To be honest, the use of tubes is usually difficult to justify when you look at the facts. This ranges from microphones to power amps.

My goal is to model my subjective felt and heard sound perception of old records with the possibilities I have.

Last but not least, I'm in it for the fun, no business involved.
 
Last edited:
Ive been fooling around with reverb tanks again lately ,
using REW to view the FFT ,
I think theres some new functionalty in REW V5.3 relating to RT-60 time measurements ,
using it to test reverb tanks is the obvious next logical step ,

Viewing the output of the spring on the FFT panel something becomes very clear ,
the settling time for the spring at low audio frequencies takes very long ,
like 15-20 seconds or more , any physical vibrations the tank is subjected to create a powerful low end hump , which doesnt die away for ages .

Heres the type of tank I'm looking at just now ,


Only one spring is driven , the recovery is taken from the far end of the Z shaped arrangement ,

Output transducer measures 370 ohms with the DMM ,
with the LCR
380 ohms @100hz
470 ohms @1khz
14Kohms @7.8khz

Ls-385mH



Worth noting the 4 springs mounting the sub tray have a small piece of felt pushed into them ,
thats extremely effective at damping large low frequency wobbles due to vibration ,

I might try the same principle with the main springs ,

Lining the sub tray with felt is another trick I do , it prevents the springs ever touching down on metal and in the event the artist kicks the amp over at the end of the gig it doesnt create that horrific tearing iron sound associated with spring tanks .

Hmmm a thought just came mind ,
instead of felt , the loop side of self adhesive velrco tape might make a good crash landing pad for the springs , I might have to try that .

often in guitar amps the reverb channel return passes through a tiny coupling cap , maybe as low as 500 or 1000pF with 100kohms load following at the grid , so some HPF is probably a good idea.



Another thing is magneticaly damping the springs , a bit like a guitar pickup pole piece very close to the strings does .
my tests show a small low powered magnet within a few mm of the spring exerts enough force to give good damping in the subsonic range , Ive yet to audition the effect with my ears , but visually I can see the spring acts less like a slinky with the signal rebounding endlessly back and forth , it comes to a rest very much faster in the LF region .

A small thumbscrew which can raise and lower a magnet to the spring would be perfect ,
its a bit like a continously variable HPF/damping , without any electronic circuitry .


I should be back with the preliminary listening test results later today ,
The pic below shows the positions of the magnets a few mm below the rivet that joins the two spring sections .
Will be interesting to note any variation in impedence on the LCR with the magnets in place compared to without as well as how things look in REW/FFT.
 

Attachments

  • Peavey tank2.jpg
    Peavey tank2.jpg
    68.5 KB · Views: 0
I tried various arrangements of magnets to damp the springs
and they definately help put manners on the big wobbly bottom end , Id say they give around a 30db reduction in LF content with careful placement ,
downside is if the magnet it to large and powerfull the spring might become attached , or even drag the sub assembly down to deck .

Then I had brainwave ,
fridge magnet material ....
its light weight and easy to cut ,
more to follow.....
 

Latest posts

Back
Top