analag

Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« on: September 26, 2013, 07:16:02 AM »
After much harassment I've decided to return to audio and electronics. I have been building and destroying cars for the last couple of years. They keep threatening me with riches and fame, but you know that's a bunch o bullsh!t don't ya?
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.


Rochey

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2013, 07:31:30 AM »
Welcome back dude... Sounds like the itch flared up again! ;)
Expat Audio Home: http://www.expataudio.com

okgb

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2013, 08:30:50 AM »

 they have medicine for that eh ?
where will you start ? have any projects in mind ?
GKB Audio / Greg Boboski

Gus

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2013, 11:28:37 AM »
Make sure you build clones because that is all people seem to want.

gemini86

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2013, 04:48:58 PM »
Begun, the clone war has! mmmhhmmmmmm
- Rodney

"...you better call Kenny Loggins, 'cause you're in the danger zone."

alexc

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2013, 07:26:26 PM »
Make sure you build clones because that is all people seem to want.

Hardly surprising since most electronics has been done many times over in just about every available configuration.

And how do you define a clone anyhow? Kind of a wide spectrum there.

In short - wot a generalisation that is to make !
I ping therefore I am

okgb

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2013, 10:55:08 AM »

 How do you elevate the lowest common denominator  ?
GKB Audio / Greg Boboski

Gus

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2013, 11:16:03 AM »
Make sure you build clones because that is all people seem to want.

Hardly surprising since most electronics has been done many times over in just about every available configuration.

And how do you define a clone anyhow? Kind of a wide spectrum there.

In short - wot a generalisation that is to make !

Are you sure?
Years ago NYDave posted an interesting microphone circuit that most seemed to ignore
I have a few microphone circuits I have not seen posted and know of a few more from others I talk to.

Most of the fun people left and I would guess one reason is nothing interesting posted maybe because someone will take it and claim it as there own


ln76d

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2013, 02:16:55 PM »
Make sure you build clones because that is all people seem to want.

Clones aren't in fashion! Complete kits are on top now :)
If you ever bought ikea furniture - you're DIY-er!

DaveP

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2013, 05:18:33 PM »
Make sure you build clones because that is all people seem to want.

This is an interesting thread.

There are clones and clones.  Building a kit is like painting by numbers, someone else has done all the hard graft for you.

Building the thing from scratch when the original parts are either no longer available or too expensive to make it possible is quite another.

I wonder how many people would take any notice of any original design of mine, I would bet they would prefer to see me re-create a classic.  Its about a point of reference I guess, classics have a track record, originals don't.

I'd be interested to hear opinion on this.  My opinion is that Analag has done some genuinely inspirational work, wound his own transformers etc, true DIY.

best
DaveP
Soundcloud: Delayed Action.


alexc

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2013, 07:27:36 PM »

I'd be interested to hear opinion on this.  My opinion is that Analag has done some genuinely inspirational work, wound his own transformers etc, true DIY.


Agree with that!

Some of the more novel things discussed around here would have to be Analag's posts some years back of some very interesting ground up builds and also the schematic-design-sims that he would put up.

The all tube twists as well as the hybrid and ss ones were certainly thought and opinion provoking.

I liked some of the vari-mu type designs - in fact, for me they really all began with Analag's contributed work.
I ping therefore I am

alexc

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2013, 07:33:53 PM »

Most of the fun people left and I would guess one reason is nothing interesting posted maybe because someone will take it and claim it as there own

People will always come and go for whatever reason, including to spin off commercial interests.

Such is life.

I think that there's also been quite a good bunch of new people over the last few years that have pushed the forum's boundries in just about every direction.

Since around 10yrs back that I can remember at these boards, the collective has expanded wildly beyond anything I could have expected.

All good!



I ping therefore I am

alexc

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2013, 07:50:04 PM »

I wonder how many people would take any notice of any original design of mine, I would bet they would prefer to see me re-create a classic.  Its about a point of reference I guess, classics have a track record, originals don't.


How original of a design would we be talking here? Broskie level of tube based originality?

The art of gaining a few percent performance for a great deal of complexity  :)

....

One might group 'original design' here, within the confines of .. diy audio .. into the 'fundamentals' and 'bells and whistles' categories.

There is always scope for design innovation in the 'bells and whistles', which would include packaging, controllability, distributed functionality and the like.

And you see that all around here at groupdiy.

And surely there is always a lot of economic motivations to original design - 'product placement' like squeezing more for less $ , or the opposite 'making as boutique as possible' to maximise $ as well as the places in between.

That too is well represented here at lots of different levels.

THEN there is also research type activities which are interesting in the their own right. No limit here on vistas to traverse.

BUT, apart from those things, and in the area of 'fundamental' audio functionalities, how much scope for original design is there?

After all, it ain't rocket science.   Is it? 

I sure don't know anything not already done many times over :>)

And what is design, anyhow? How do you know if it is 'original' anyway ?  :)

OK then.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2013, 08:09:42 PM by alexc »
I ping therefore I am

analag

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2013, 09:36:13 PM »
I have old stuff I never posted. Did I share the 30 tube compressor?
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.

alexc

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2013, 10:36:27 PM »
I think you shared 'a' 30-tube compressor, in pics :)

Maybe not 'the' ....     and not too much detail.

But certainly 'big blue' would be up there with the most comprehensive of them all!
I ping therefore I am

analag

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2013, 10:59:55 PM »
The transformers are custom and complicated.  I wouldn't have been able to wind them had I not been going through a divorce. They provided the needed distraction at the time.
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.

Rochey

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2013, 11:47:01 PM »
Funny about the transformers, sad about the divorce.

I do think it's amazing the "distracting powers" of engineering. Chasing that elusive extra dB is similar to ahab and the whale. :)
Expat Audio Home: http://www.expataudio.com

JohnRoberts

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #17 on: September 29, 2013, 12:30:07 PM »
Make sure you build clones because that is all people seem to want.

This is an interesting thread.

There are clones and clones.  Building a kit is like painting by numbers, someone else has done all the hard graft for you.
I used to operate a kit business back in the '70s (Phoenix Systems) and back then the dominant dynamic was people building kits to save money. I participated in the paradigm by building a bench full of Heath Kit test equipment for less money.

That old scenario has been altered by low cost manufacturing technology so modern kit builders are motivated by other things. Building a kit is not unlike the electronic lab courses in school but you end up with a more useful end result.

Buying and building kits is a good first step to learning how things work under the hood. Just not a great business model anymore (ask Heathkit)
Quote

Building the thing from scratch when the original parts are either no longer available or too expensive to make it possible is quite another.
I don't completely understand the attraction for all things old (I'm old). While there is a subset of old legacy products that didn't suck back then and don't suck now. At Peavey when we decided to make a tube comp/limiter we had to tool our own opto gain element since there was no production part available off the shelf. This was to appeal to a niche market and it would have sold far better if offered by somebody with a hipper brand image.
Quote
I wonder how many people would take any notice of any original design of mine, I would bet they would prefer to see me re-create a classic.  Its about a point of reference I guess, classics have a track record, originals don't.
The originality or heritage of a design should not matter, the performance should. I escaped from the hifi side of audio decades ago because it did not see any connection between product performance and market success.
Quote
I'd be interested to hear opinion on this.  My opinion is that Analag has done some genuinely inspirational work, wound his own transformers etc, true DIY.

best
DaveP
While it is true you need to do something different to improve any existing design, it does not follow that anything different will be better. Sometimes it is just different. In these days when audio technology is pretty mature and most paths are quite good, the easiest way to sound different is to deviate from flat, linear response.

While I wouldn't claim that all possible permutations of standard component combinations have been explored, most cost effective ones have.  That said it is always educational to experiment. Just don't expect to find much low hanging fruit when picking in an old orchard.

JR
Visit https://circularscience.com to hear what properly "cleared" drums sound like.

Ptownkid

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #18 on: September 29, 2013, 07:44:18 PM »
Welcome back man!

analag

Re: Aaaargghhh!!!!!
« Reply #19 on: September 29, 2013, 09:42:26 PM »
I'm not working on new designs just yet, I'm woking on a muscular DAW.
To JR...negative and positive feedback can yield interesting psychoacoustic possibilites. You know... the big heads think it's unethical.
Audio engineering suffers from misinformation, disinformation, and downright lying more than most fields of endeavour.