Brexit

[ruffrecords]

As to why the Scots want to leave the UK, I blame Mel Gibson and Braveheart, it all started from then   He hates the English.

DaveP

But they don't want to leave. They had a referendum and decided to stay. Or once again, just because it is not the result some politicians wanted, they want to keep voting until they get the result they want?

Cheers

Ian

 

[DaveP]

Or once again, just because it is not the result some politicians wanted, they want to keep voting until they get the result they want?

Yes, Ian that's what's going on here.  Sturgeon is hoping it will make a difference to the vote when we leave the EU.

DaveP

 

[Script]

Also I think that the EU will not permit Scotland to go alone as part of the EU as it will set a dangerous  precedence.  Spain for one will block it for their own internal reasons so I think Sturgeon has a bluffing hand here.

Scotland and Catalonia are only comparable when thinking in black and white. In reality they are not comparable -- neither in terms of economic significance, nor in term of geography.

Catalonia is the affluent part of Spain and fed up with paying the bill for poorer regions in Spain. They are the Spanish elitists, so to speak. It's as if London said we don't want to be part of the UK any more.

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Why would banks want to go to Dublin?

 

[DaveP]

Why would banks want to go to Dublin?

They speak English and it's in the EU and not too far from where they are at the moment.

I doubt they would go to France because of the language and the bureaucracy here.

Just to give you an example:

RS components in the UK has one site for companies and private individuals and you can pay by credit account or credit card and all the technical info is available.  When they set up RS in France they had a professional site where you can only buy from them with a TVA number. http://fr.rs-online.com/web/

For private individuals (particuliers) you have to go to their simpletons website with sparse technical info in order to buy without a TVA number and use your credit card.  http://www.rs-particuliers.com/

DaveP

 

[madswitcher]

But they don't want to leave. They had a referendum and decided to stay. Or once again, just because it is not the result some politicians wanted, they want to keep voting until they get the result they want?

Good point Ian, I had forgotten that, as has Ms Sturgeon

Regards
Mike

 

[Script]

But they don't want to leave. They had a referendum and decided to stay. Or once again, just because it is not the result some politicians wanted, they want to keep voting until they get the result they want?

Not so sure about that. Scottish musicians I talked to were of a very different opinion. They said that the referendum for Scottish Independence had been rigged. Well, not rigged but that there had been a lot of scaremongering back then and tricking people into voting "stay" based on false claims that everybody would lose their pension if Scotland left. Hmm, the scaremongering part sounds familiar...

Elections are not held because politicians don't like the results, elections are held because time passes and reality changes. Same as general elections. And referendums should be held if a majority of people want to have a say in something, not because politicians play strategic games.

Anyway, why should a second Scottish Independence referendum be so scary? The result of a referendum is not a guarantee that it'll come true. And even if it does and Scotland left the UK, wouldn't that be better for the UKexScotland? As far as I know there is more money flowing into Scotland than money flowing from Scotland into the rest of the UK. last but not least, a few decades ago we saw the USSR dissolve... yet we are all still here.

 

[Script]

Why would banks want to go to Dublin

They speak English and it's in the EU and not too far from where they are at the moment.

I doubt they would go to France because of the language and the bureaucracy here.

Yeah, makes perfect sense. Thanks. I heard/read talks about them thinking about moving to Paris and Frankfort, even Munich( ??? ). Paris I don't really see either -- French bureaucracy indeed seems to be a treadmill. Dublin, sure, I guess the US would have an interest in that too, cos they saw the UK as their gateway to the EU market -- in that sense Dublin would mean a short move and still be ideally located 'on the way' so to speak...

But who knows. maybe the UK comes up with an offer that even the US can't resist.

 

[ruffrecords]

There's no reason the banks would move from London and every reason to stay. This just FUD.

Cheers

Ian

 

[abbey road d enfer]

RS components in the UK has one site for companies and private individuals and you can pay by credit account or credit card and all the technical info is available.  When they set up RS in France they had a professional site where you can only buy from them with a TVA number. http://fr.rs-online.com/web/

For private individuals (particuliers) you have to go to their simpletons website with sparse technical info in order to buy without a TVA number and use your credit card.  http://www.rs-particuliers.com/

I'm not sure you can blame France and its bureaucracy. Farnell have been much cleverer than RS, their site is easy and I guess that's why they are much more popular among both professionals and DIYers.

 

[Script]

I do perceive the UK talking about possibly reforming the House of Lords as very positive.
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Why would banks not want to move out of London?

 

[abbey road d enfer]

I heard/read talks about them thinking about moving to Paris

I think it was a jibe sent in response to Boris' earlier exhortations addressed to French bankers to come to London.

 

[Matt Nolan]

There's no reason the banks would move from London and every reason to stay. This just FUD.

Cheers

Ian

Only if we can secure passporting rights post brexit.

 

[ruffrecords]

Only if we can secure passporting rights post brexit.

Not a problem for the Swiss.

Cheers

Ian

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Amazing, how Brexit unearthes so many unanswerable questions; if preparing is half the battle, the battle is far from being 100% won.
The politicians who have force-fed Brexit to the masses should be tarred and feathered.

 

[Script]

Not sure tarring and feathering really is of this century...  ;D

But I agree that there should be attempts at giving answers that consist of more than single sentences, acronyms and catchwords. Maybe if sombody only explained the upside of leaving good enough, some people could actually be convinced or at least uncertainty be reduced. Hard-lining doesn't help at this stage. The referendum campaigning is long over.
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Why would banks not want to move out of London?

 

[Matt Nolan]

Not a problem for the Swiss.

Cheers

Ian

The Swiss still have to allow immigration (actually they have more than twice the number of migrants per capita than we do) and they have paid well over a billion Swiss Francs (roughly on par with the US $) into the EU since 2008.

I don't think we can have the "cake and eat it" situation. If we keep some of the EU membership benefits, we must also keep some of the apparent down-sides.

I should just state here for the record that I don't think of immigration as a down-side.

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Not sure tarring and feathering really is of this century...  ;D

But adequate for separatism, which is not of this century, as hard to admit it seems for some (many).

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Why would banks not want to move out of London?

It seems unconceivable only because it would change the lives of so many people, and, somehow, there would be so much reluctance as to make it impossible, but history has shown that "impossible" things may happen, such as the fall of the Berlin wall.

 

[sahib]

Not so sure about that. Scottish musicians I talked to were of a very different opinion. They said that the referendum for Scottish Independence had been rigged. Well, not rigged but that there had been a lot of scaremongering back then and tricking people into voting "stay" based on false claims that everybody would lose their pension if Scotland left. Hmm, the scaremongering part sounds familiar...

There was no such scare mongering and trickery. This is/was a typical response of some who did not like the result.

....The result of a referendum is not a guarantee that it'll come true. And even if it does and Scotland left the UK, wouldn't that be better for the UKexScotland?

No.

As far as I know there is more money flowing into Scotland than money flowing from Scotland into the rest of the UK.

In the absence of solid facts and figures it is debatable.

 

[Script]

@Sahib
I do get your point. I assume it would be a turn to the less favourable again for your business if Scotland left. I fully get that and respect that. Personally, I couldn't care less whether Scotland left or stayed. However, I'm also curious to hear about what you think is be better for your neighbours (Scotland IN or OUT, UK IN or OUT etc etc etc). -- For my part, I should be an ardent supporter of Abe-san, Japan's current prime minister (he's so good for my wallet). However, I'm not, as I see Japan's social and economic reality quite clearly.

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I don't mean disrespect of any sort to anyone but I do get the impression that what I wrote above about hardlining went unnoticed.

Call me cynical to the bone, but having peeked into the political circus a bit I think Ms May and her policy of 'domestic appeasement' is little democratic, yet possibly the right thing for the time being (i.e., no vote in Parliament & convincing the House of Lords to refrain from 'blocking'). Yes, politicians tend to hold onto their chairs, but it also buys time for people to pull together and tell their politicians what to do.

And time is of the essence for the UK. Detailed visions (tentative at this point but detailed please!) from both camps about how the UK can be 'rebuild' to come up with a workable future for all UK citizens should be voiced to make the thing fly as a whole.

Conversely, acronymic answers, merely dropping the names of other countries, and simple 'yes or no' answers do have the tinge of reposing in 'moral superiority', waving off and denying voiced concerns (both real and imagined), being driven by mere self-interest, and sitting at the table to do hardly more than smoking a pipe in self-contentment. It's a waste of time. If this goes on until spring next year, the historic once-in-a-lifetime chance will slip away unused. The 'democratic' work lies ahead, not behind.

Two of the few things that I got out of this thread so far is that (a) there are a couple of xenophobic/racist people in the UK now (but those people do not post in this forum!) and (b) that Britain sees the first signs of redistribution of wealth/income.

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Off to work now...

 

[ruffrecords]

What really makes me laugh is opposition politicians moaning that May won't tell them what her negotiating position is going to be.  As anyone in business knows, the first rule of negotiating is you don't tell the other side anything until you sit down with them and you can bet any opposition politician that knew May's plans would be a leaky as a sieve.

Cheers

Ian