Brexit

[[silent:arts]]

This new rule is plain stupid. Imagine if all countries had the same requirement...  :

This. And you would need to keep track of changing VAT rates & rules in each single country ...

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Well, one good reason I can think of why such a ruling could be beneficial (ITSO protective in a good sense for local businesses) is that low-cost China products plus state-sponsored postage for instance is sheer unbeatable.

If it is the case, it shows they have not taken the lessons of history.
Remember the CE marking, that was supposed to curb the influx of cheap goods from the Far East and reinvigorate local production? Well it had exactly the opposite effect.
I believe the chinese, with the help of their department of commerce, will find a clever way to counteract this regulation.

 

[Script]

Yes, quite sure of that too.

I see British customers clearly losing on this. It makes several import products either unavailable or more expensive. I'm thinking 'British VAT certified' vendours who charge a tax handling fee. BTW, how much is an international money transfer to British tax authorities ? Or do they accept non-commercial transfer (to friend) via PayPal or what...

 

[Banzai]

Whatever the campaigners said, most of people who voted leave did so because they were pissed off with Brussels interfering in their daily lives.

Can you give 1 example of Brussels interfering in your daily life?

 

[JohnRoberts]

If it is the case, it shows they have not taken the lessons of history.
Remember the CE marking, that was supposed to curb the influx of cheap goods from the Far East and reinvigorate local production? Well it had exactly the opposite effect.
I believe the chinese, with the help of their department of commerce, will find a clever way to counteract this regulation.

I lived (worked) through the harmonization of EU safety agency standards. Admittedly my perspective is as a US manufacturer selling to probably 100 different countries world wide. The EU was a can of worms with every small country having their own set of standards. New product design had to not only meet these multiple standards, they had to be tested by each country's agency for approval.

This created a barrier to competition benefitting local manufacturers, but every small EU manufacturer had to jump through the same hoops to sell to other small EU countries. This was contrary to the goal of free trade within the entire EU community by all members. This harmonization didn't happen in one fell swoop. A handful of countries became the defacto standard setters for the entire EU, and most EU countries accepted one of those handful of agency approvals.

The CE transition is a huge leap from there, pretty much calling for self certification by manufacturers (how could that go wrong?). While recourse against foreign manufacturers is lacking. (I used lead free solder on drum tuners I shipped into the EU, but only because I believe in following laws, even if there is no possibility of punishment.) 

This could be as simple as UK fully endorsing CE safety regulations (while it is a little more complicated than that.)

China has been enjoying most favored nation trade status for over 20 years. Maybe those decades ago they deserved some special trade treatment, but there was a deal that they were supposed to live up to regarding human rights, etc.

The Chinese are very invested in keeping their factories humming, and greasing the levers controlling trade. The Chinese have lots of experience at bribing foreign officials (they have learned the benefit of gifting wealth indirectly to family and relatives, rather than to the officials directly).   

JR

 

[Script]

Interesting. However, I do not see Bruxelles approaching the Johnson family. ; )

 

[ruffrecords]

Can you give 1 example of Brussels interfering in your daily life?

Easy, forcing our government to prosecute traders who still allow you to buy things like meat using imperial units like pounds and ounces. They and we are forced to use metric. Same with petrol. You cannot buy it by the gallon any more it has to be by the litre. Thank heaven we stopped short of changing miles to kilometres.

Cheers

Ian

 

[rob_gould]

Hmm, I've read about this before. It's not quite as clear cut as that. For example :

The changeover to selling of petrol by the litre rather than by the gallon took place after the Board was wound up. It was prompted by a technical shortcoming of petrol pump design: pumps (which were electro-mechanical) had been designed to be switchable between metric and imperial units, but had no provisions for prices above £1.999 per unit of fuel. Once the price of petrol rose above £1 per gallon, the industry requested that they be permitted to sell fuel by the litre rather than the gallon, enabling them to reduce the unit price by a factor of about 4.5 and so to extend the lives of existing pumps.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metrication_in_the_United_Kingdom

Metrication was under discussion in Britain in the 1860s!

Changing tack, what I find equally funny and frustrating about all this 'faceless bureaucrats in Brussels' stuff is the lack of concern Brits have over unelected bureaucrats like this chap. I'm sure all the Brits on the board will recognise him :

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/15/revealed-cummings-role-handing-covid-contract-firm-run-by-friends

This isn't a story about something which took place 40 years ago. It's happening now. British politics is absolutely awash with unelected advisers and bureaucrats doing whatever the hell they like, it would seem. But the anti EU crew are strangely quiet when it's closer to home.

 

[ruffrecords]

This isn't a story about something which took place 40 years ago. It's happening now. British politics is absolutely awash with unelected advisers and bureaucrats doing whatever the hell they like, it would seem. But the anti EU crew are strangely quiet when it's closer to home.

Not true. We Brits are forever vigilant for corruption, cronyism and other forms of back handers, bribes and corruption.

Cheers

Ian

 

[volker]

Yes, clearly:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/09/boris-johnson-britain-corruption-cronyism-checks-balances
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/28/politicians-were-once-held-to-account---now-nothing-stands-in-their-way
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/aug/03/boris-johnsons-list-of-lords-is-a-disgrace-corruption-westminster
https://jacobinmag.com/2020/11/uk-corruption-conservative-party-dark-money-boris-johnson-brexit/
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/boris-johnson-dominic-cummings-michael-gove-corruption-cabinet-government-a9633941.html
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/exclusive-boris-johnson-overruled-officials-to-take-friend-jennifer-arcuri-on-jet-set-trade-missions-5v0clbmmj

In other Brexit news, exports to EU are down 68%. I hope the NHS at least gets its weekly £350 million, could prove very useful these days.

 

[ruffrecords]

Yes, clearly:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/dec/09/boris-johnson-britain-corruption-cronyism-checks-balances
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/nov/28/politicians-were-once-held-to-account---now-nothing-stands-in-their-way
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/aug/03/boris-johnsons-list-of-lords-is-a-disgrace-corruption-westminster
https://jacobinmag.com/2020/11/uk-corruption-conservative-party-dark-money-boris-johnson-brexit/
https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/boris-johnson-dominic-cummings-michael-gove-corruption-cabinet-government-a9633941.html
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/exclusive-boris-johnson-overruled-officials-to-take-friend-jennifer-arcuri-on-jet-set-trade-missions-5v0clbmmj

In other Brexit news, exports to EU are down 68%. I hope the NHS at least gets its weekly £350 million, could prove very useful these days.

Well it is hardly surprising from the left wing press. I am just glad we have now vaccinated over 25% of the adult population instead of having to wait for the bumbling EU bureaucracy to sort it out.

Cheers

Ian

 

[rob_gould]

Not true. We Brits are forever vigilant for corruption, cronyism and other forms of back handers, bribes and corruption.

Cheers

Ian

I couldn't disagree more strongly.

What's your opinion on this?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5060241/Priti-Patel-faces-sack-meetings-Israeli-PM.html

Fired as minister for international development for various breaches of ministerial code, and now home secretary.  Her political career should have been over, but somehow she got a promotion.  Loyalty over brexit would be one explanation; but it certainly doesn't appear to be to do with credibility, honesty or competence.

I agree wholeheartedly that the Guardian does itself no favours with its lefty liberal opinion pieces - it's the middle class liberal equivalent of the Daily Express' obsession with princess Di and Winston Churchill and it's preaching to the chiir.

However, I don't see any of the billionaire owned right wing press holding the government to account at the moment, so I'm pleased that some media outlets still are.

Just because stories of corruption and cronyism aren't published in right leaning papers, I think dismissing them as left wing lies is perhaps burying one's head in the sand a bit.

And the last link which was provided up there was from the Times.

 

[ruffrecords]

I agree that politicians are resilient and slippery creatures. Ursula von de leyen is an excellent example. I see no evidence that this is any worse in the UK than anywhere else.

Cheers

Ian

 

[L´Andratté]

V.d.Leyen is a brilliant example of the outcomes of promotion for incompetence, "complimenting someone away", as it is expressed in german language. Her track record is most horrible and expensive for tax payers. Alas her family tree...

I think exceptionalism, being it american, british or german is aways a path of delusion and tied to some belief system/ideology which differs in important ways from e.g. moral compass.

Far from disrespecting the Britons for their decision (only the political sock puppets and their silly ever mutating lines of argumentation), I hope this will come out good in the end in ways noone could foresee.
I think economy and societal politics is a bit of a chaotic system. :

First world corruption is well tucked away in some million dollar per second back and forth on business accounts. I don´t think a british councilman or border official would be much impressed with a dollar note inside my passport or something. But being one of the fiscal centers of the world, London is inevitably also one of the money laundering centers of the world...
Organized crime and economy have merged. Corruption is a grey in grey thing and we 1stWorlders are often very forgiving towards ourselves!  Just my 5c from the twilight zone 

 

[warpie]

But being one of the fiscal centers of the world

Not anymore...

Amsterdam overtakes London as Europe's trading hub
By EUOBSERVER

12. FEB, 07:16
Amsterdam has overtaken London as the share-trading capital of Europe, just a month after Brexit became official, the Financial Times reported. Trading volumes at three exchanges in the Dutch capital grew fourfold to average €9.2bn per day in January, while average volumes in London fell sharply to €8.6bn last month. An estimated €6bn of European share trading shifted from London to Europe when Brexit officially took effect in January.

https://euobserver.com/tickers/150911

 

[ruffrecords]

Not anymore...

Amsterdam overtakes London as Europe's trading hub
By EUOBSERVER

12. FEB, 07:16
Amsterdam has overtaken London as the share-trading capital of Europe, just a month after Brexit became official, the Financial Times reported. Trading volumes at three exchanges in the Dutch capital grew fourfold to average €9.2bn per day in January, while average volumes in London fell sharply to €8.6bn last month. An estimated €6bn of European share trading shifted from London to Europe when Brexit officially took effect in January.

https://euobserver.com/tickers/150911

But as usual the truth is a little harder to reach. A large proportion of these transactions are undertaken by a kind of subsidiary of the LSE in Amsterdam so in fact the number of transactions orchestrated in London has increased.

Cheers

Ian

 

[ruffrecords]

Back on the VAT subject again, I just placed an order with Thomann. Instead of 19% German VAT, they charged me 20% UK VAT. Looks like the big payers were prepared for the change. As usual it is the small guy who suffers.

Cheers

Ian

 

[Script]

EU doesn't allow import of shellfish caught by UK fishers anymore. It's the same shellfish as before Brexit -- shellfish that used to be widely sold across the EU, especially in France, I think. Weird side effect.

 

[ruffrecords]

EU doesn't allow import of shellfish caught by UK fishers anymore. It's the same shellfish as before Brexit -- shellfish that used to be widely sold across the EU, especially in France, I think. Weird side effect.

It is because the EU changed the rules about how often and where the shellfish is tested (I think by a vet). I am not sure of the details but I think much smaller batches have to be tested before they leave the UK instead of much bigger batches when they reach their destination.  The result is the delays caused mean that some, most or all of a batch arrives at its destination inedible. Typical effing EU bullocks.

Cheers

Ian

 

[Tubetec]

We used regularly get cooked Scottish mussels on the shelves here in Ireland ,
sometime back they vanished only to be replaced lately by frozen cooked Italian mussels ,
its madness in some ways , theres only a 30 mile stretch of water between Ireland and Scotland , now they have to transport a few thousand kilometers instead and Id imagine the the waters off Scotland would be much cleaner than the Mediterainian anyday .