Bush Comes Under Shoe Attack in Baghdad

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> Adlai Stevenson showing the hole in his sole...

For so many diplomats and politicians, that should be spelled with a "u".

pulitzer.jpg

"the aristocratic, intellectual Stevenson, who was having difficulty establishing himself as a candidate of the people"

Arabs/Islams think shoe is unclean. Poor Russians see shoe as wealth/power. And in the USA of 1952, a hole-in-sole became a symbol of frugality and earthiness.
 
There is no need to get personal... I don't think Keith is remotely culpable for the early nation building of the British empire in the middle East. They did a pretty good job with India and Oz, and...... even Hong Kong is slowly infecting the rest of China with capitalism and more freedom.


JR

PS If the Soviet Navy wants to play war games, why not hold some artillery practice on the Somali pirates instead of visiting Cuba and playing footsie with Chauvez.




 
ssltech and others seem to foment a hatred of Bush and America in this very forum. Perhaps we should check in with Mr. Hamm and see if that is behavior fitting of a modertor....

On the one hand ssltech and his ilk bash this country and its current president and on the other hand derives income and a living here. If the US is such a hated hell-hole why did he and countless others chose to live here?

One guy throwing a pair of shoes does not speak for the 50 million or so liberated in the middle east.

Young girls attending school for the first time in Afganistan are having acid thrown on them. Is that Bush's fault? Is it Amereica's fault? No, it's the people doing it at fault and it's very, very unfortunate that many in the Arab world cling to a way of life which is so hostile to education, women and the rule of law. One has to assume that the people throwing the acid at these young woman also hate America and our way of life. Why should I care what they think?

I'm really sick of the constant Bush-bashing which is every bit as "confrontational" as anything I have ever said. The Bush bashing occurs far more often than any of my posts here in the Brewery. Yet, our moderator at the height of hypocrisy seems to allow a far greater degree of confrontational behavior when the confrontor agrees with him. If you disagree with the mob here at Prodigy they will first belittle you and when that doesn't succeed our moderator will delete your posts. Call it "selective outrage."

I fail to see much distinction - figuratively speaking - with many in the mob here and the people throwing acid at Afgan school girls or the loser throwing the size 10 shoe. The mindset is the same. I think many posters could do without additional encouragement from our moderator who seems to share a hatred for the country that supports him. Perhaps some humilty for the blessings he enjoys would go a very long way.
 
unmitigated hatred for Obama

I have no hatred for the man what so ever. I'm suspicious of many of his ideas - many of the the ones he campaigned on - but I've pretty much given him a pass the last two months. I want to see him succeed as long as it doesn't take away the freedoms I (and all of us) enjoy.

You seem to encourage much of the anti-American vitriol here ssltech. PRR, Sam Groener, clintrubber seem to be above that. As a moderator you should be above this too.

I'm very thankful for the blessings I receive and don't complain about the country that has provided them to me. I don't bash the United States, George Bush and I haven't bashed Obama. I have asked questions and expressed concerns about him prior to the election but he's also my President (elect) too. In that sense I support him. I particularly support him as (future) Commander in Chief. He has a tough job ahead and I'm already starting to see the grey hair. I sincerely wish him well.

Just lay off Bush, the hatred of the United States and encouraging others to do the same. If you're a US citizen ssltech (and I hope you are though it really doesn't matter) stop hating yourself. Remember that a large portion of your (perhaps silent) audience here didn't vote for Obama and it doesn't serve you, Prodigy-pro, the forum and Chae Ham to alienate them. The only reason I began to appear in the Brewery at all was to provide some opposition to the constant stream of anti-Bush anti-American vitriol.

the previous contempt for America has now been stirred up into a festering hatred

Say who? ssltech? Just because one loser threw a pair of shoes?
 
I can't stand Bush. Does that mean I "hate America" too? Or am I already anti-American by virtue of being from New York and disliking country music and Wal-Mart? Come on, man. The "Anti-Bush = Anti-America" straw man ceased to be effective a long time ago, even among the Fox News crowd.
 
The "Anti-Bush = Anti-America" straw man ceased to be effective a long time ago, even among the Fox News crowd.

I didn't make the Bush/America connection, ssltech did:

the previous contempt for America has now been stirred up into a festering hatred

For the record, do you feel this way ssltech? The shoes were thrown at Bush not America correct? So why the connection?

We know that New York Dave doesn't hate America and that's a good thing. Thanks New York Dave. I love my country too. Like yourself I don't particularly care for country music and I don't shop at Wal*Mart.
 
Gentlemen-

This is an AUDIO forum. We have a side-room for non-audio chat, but it is NOT for extended attacks on each others' politics. There are a zillion places FOR such sparring.

Damn. Don't you have a transformer to wire, or something?
 
The difference between a thoughtful discussion of government and political rants is accepting that others hold different opinions based on different influences or life experience. I would be foolish to try to change other people opinions, all I try to do is correct gross misinformation when I see it.

The polarization against Bush is so strong in this country that the last election was effectively run against him and not the actual candidate. I find the drum beat of Bush bashing more of a popular fashion statement than evidence of deep critical inspection, but he's a lame duck now so no longer important. I suspect the unfortunate legacy of GB is to be remembered for his Mission accomplished photo op, and ducking that shoe, while I'm not convinced that many here fully grasp the symbolic significance of that shoe event to the Arab street. The event can't be undone, but the opportunity remains for the folks in power, to demonstrate that Iraq is now a free country with a freedom of speech they didn't formerly enjoy.

I expect the new US administration to distance itself from the "image" Bush has earned in the world, while (I hope) continuing to do, what needs to be done. So far they appear to be more moderate than some supporters would like, but it's still too early to make judgments.

I remain convinced that we avoided a disaster by not withdrawing troops from Iraq a couple years ago as so many wanted. Now we have a far better chance of leaving behind a successful democracy. 

JR

PS: There's a classic story about Bill Richardson, crossing his legs and accidentally pointing the bottom of his shoe toward Saddam in a negotiation to release some US citizens back in '95.  Also the Al-Rashid Hotel in Baghdad has a tile mosaic of Bush I in the lobby floor for everyone to disgrace by walking upon.


 
More shoe stuff  MTA in NY

http://www.nypost.com/seven/12172008/news/regionalnews/man_tries_to_throw_shoe_during_mta_meeti_144642.htm
 
I would like to add my 2c about this. I have many friends from States and all around the world so people can be cool no matter where they are from. Politicians are all the same  shit . Pardon my French but that came right from my hearth. Also, I don't believe they are working for the country and for the voters. So, I like my country , I like your country but I don't like politicians. Also I enjoyed watching the clip and I would like to see more  ;D
 
Claude: in 5+ years on this forum (and its predecessor) I have never seen any statement from Keith that could, by any stretch of the imagination, be interpreted as fomenting hatred of America. So please, either furnish specific examples to back up your allegations or desist in your attempts to smear the character of a good man and someone whom I'm proud to call my friend.

John R: I'm sorry, but GWB is a tool and I've thought so from the beginning. My opinions are not informed by what's "fashionable" and I think it's a bit condescending to assert or imply otherwise.
 
I would love to get SERIOUSLY love to roll up my sleaves and get involved. For once I will bite my tongue, - some. Why oh why do people descend into the "If you are not for us you must be against us?" Smacks of fundamentalist extremism to me.

 HARK! - I do not know Keith beyond a few postings. Kieth lives in America, presumably has a green-card, pays his taxes, fixes your dodgy gear, and as a free-minded, sentient citizen expresses an opinion, which just so happens to contradict yours. Last time I looked, America was a DEMOCRACY, and enshrined in YOUR AMERICAN constitution is the RIGHT to express your opinion as you feel fit. That WHY you are fighting in Iraq isn't it? Freedom and democracy? Shame on you for immediately questioning the loyalty one of your Citizens on the basis that he doesn't fit YOUR personal profile. Your kind of with us or against us mentality is seriously worrying. You'll be burning books next.


  It might come as quite a shock to you that a large proportion of your population were neither born in America, nor share your politics.



   And this is an AUDIO FORUM for Crissakes . . .
 
I wrote a long response but deleted it... it pointless to argue opinion.

Merry Christmas everybody

and Claud... please let it go. You're not helping your cause with personal attacks.

JR
 

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