Deaths from climate change

[scott2000]

Sounds great. Whaddaya all think?

That Bill Gates made a smart move with Heliogen?

 

[user 37518]

https://news.mit.edu/2023/mit-engineers-create-supercapacitor-ancient-materials-0731
Sounds great. Whaddaya all think?

Remember hearing somewhere that someone is working on a transistor made of wood? Perhaps it is BS, but I thought it was interesting.

 

[JohnRoberts]

You're not missing anything, really.

This might be the breakthrough needed to make renewable energy universal. Supercaps from cement, carbon black and some potassium chloride.

https://news.mit.edu/2023/mit-engineers-create-supercapacitor-ancient-materials-0731
Sounds great. Whaddaya all think?

I think my smart thermostat that controls my baseboard heaters in my back bedroom might use a super cap instead of battery backup. Over the years with multiple brief power outages it never lost it place (or time), until last week when we lost power for 3 hours or more. === I just went back and reread the instructions and it did not say how, but states it should save settings for 4 hours without power.
===

I changed the settings on my coffee roaster to tolerate 415'F max.... this would make charcoal but I was able to finish my roast today suitably dark.

JR

 

[ruffrecords]

Seems like the recent boiling earth scares are nothing to do with human CO2 but directly caused by the 2022 Tonga eruption according to NASA:

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2022GL099381

Cheers

Ian

 

[user 37518]

Seems like the recent boiling earth scares are nothing to do with human CO2 but directly caused by the 2022 Tonga eruption according to NASA:

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2022GL099381

Cheers

Ian

That can't be right, consensus has already spoken

 

[ruffrecords]

That can't be right, consensus has already spoken

Consensus will now admit El Nino as a factor but only if bundles with AGW, but you are right, they are silent on inconvenient facts.

Cheers

Ian

 

[user 37518]

Consensus will now admit El Nino as a factor but only if bundles with AGW, but you are right, they are silent on inconvenient facts.

Cheers

Ian

That pesky NASA getting in the way of The Science.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Just shows how little we actually know about Earth's natural phenomena and their effect on climate at the surface. Also, the hubris shows through in the paper. "Unprecendented" levels of H2O injected into the stratosphere! Based on 17 years of MLS data and other collected "during the satellite era." That's almost nothing in geologic timescales. Unprecedented!

 

[cyrano]

Seems like the recent boiling earth scares are nothing to do with human CO2 but directly caused by the 2022 Tonga eruption according to NASA:

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1029/2022GL099381

Cheers

Ian

That's not what that study tells us...

It tells us warming from volcanic eruptions will add to global warming, as expected and, it is higher in this case than what was previously observed in the satellite era.

 

[scott2000]

I object to his obvious bias. Who signs his paycheck? Who manages his work product (including said hit-piece)? Only a blind fool cannot see the conflict of interest.

Interesting...albeit creepy... Spending 5 seconds looking for connections is like the kevin bacon game...

 

[ruffrecords]

That's not what that study tells us...

It tells us warming from volcanic eruptions will add to global warming, as expected and, it is higher in this case than what was previously observed in the satellite era.

The study tells us that factors other than human activity have a very significant effect on climate. Volcanic action can both increase and decrease global warming depending on its character.

Cheers

Ian

 

[JohnRoberts]

The study tells us that factors other than human activity have a very significant effect on climate. Volcanic action can both increase and decrease global warming depending on its character.

Cheers

Ian

Exactly... Historically volcanoes cause global cooling, but this one released aerosols that caused warming.

JR

 

[Matador]

The study tells us that factors other than human activity have a very significant effect on climate. Volcanic action can both increase and decrease global warming depending on its character.

Cheers

Ian

Hmmmmmmmmm.

Preliminary climate model simulations (see Supporting Information S1 for details) suggest an effective radiative forcing (e.g., Forster et al., 2001; Myhre et al., 2013; Smith et al., 2020; Wang et al., 2017) at the tropopause of +0.15 Wm−2 due to the stratospheric H2O enhancement (Figure S3b in Supporting Information S1).

But wheres the proof?

 

[user 37518]

But wheres the proof?

You are exactly right, it is all speculation. If this is proof of anything, it should be that we shouldn't be screaming that the world is going to end as if it is a fact.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Exactly... Historically volcanoes cause global cooling, but this one released aerosols that caused warming.

JR

Our limited very limited historical understanding of volcanoes is the issue. Same with other large scale processes. It's ridiculous to pretend science understands all of the complex interactions in these natural systems well enough to predict climate changes even a decade out.

Look at any graph of estimated CO2 levels going back beyond the 100-300k years BP Homo Sapiens era. What caused all of the massive changes in climate then? How many natural processes from pre-human times continue today?

Isn't it apparent that plate tectonics, volcanism, oceanic currents, etc. are operating at a massive scale beyond anything humans have done (perhaps other than global thermonuclear war)? Krakatoa was a 10^18J event which is bigger than Tsar Bomba by around an order of magnitude. Hunga Tonga-Hunga eruption was 10-20% more energetic than Tsar Bomba. 1960 Chilean megathrust earthquake was 10^19J. Chicxulub asteroid crater event was 10^23 to 10^24J.

 

[user 41968]

More "bat-shitery" "conspiracy theory de jour" from the BBC:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-66332399

The President of Calabria, Roberto Occhiuto, went even further than Coldiretti and estimated that arson in his region was behind 80% of wildfires.
"Last year in Calabria we caught 22 arsonists and this year, too, we are finding several," Mr Occhiuto said.
He and regional authorities are keen to emphasise that they are putting systems in place to deter such behaviour - including drones that scan the territory for arsonists.

"Arson, really? Why that's conspiracy theory. I don't have time for that."

Yes cupcakes, really.

 

[cyrano]

The study tells us that factors other than human activity have a very significant effect on climate. Volcanic action can both increase and decrease global warming depending on its character.

Cheers

Ian

That was already a given before this study. What was new, was the amount of water vapour content. Since the volcano was submerged, that was to be expected, but has never before been measured.

Most scientists accepted global warming as a given, but the exact amount of human influence is not known. Note that "global warming" also could mean some areas getting colder. It's only warming on a global scale.

 

[ruffrecords]

That was already a given before this study.

It is indeed a given, but one that is studiously avoided by the AGW zealots and the press

What was new, was the amount of water vapour content. Since the volcano was submerged, that was to be expected, but has never before been measured.

Which is good because it shows our understanding of climate factors is severely limited.

Most scientists accepted global warming as a given, but the exact amount of human influence is not known. Note that "global warming" also could mean some areas getting colder. It's only warming on a global scale.

Indeed, but to read the press you would think human influence is the ONLY factor.

Cheers

Ian

 

[cyrano]

The press doesn't do science, I'm afraid. It is entertainment, after all.

Our understanding of climate change isn't complete, but it isn't bad either. It was the first occasion for modern science to observe an underwater eruption and collect data from it.

Also, volcanic eruptions influence the weather, not the climate. The effects never last longer than a few years, in very rare cases half a century. Still, that's not climate.

 

[JohnRoberts]

The press doesn't do science, I'm afraid. It is entertainment, after all.

I perceive a shift in media to now actively promote agendas and ideology

Our understanding of climate change isn't complete, but it isn't bad either. It was the first occasion for modern science to observe an underwater eruption and collect data from it.

My previous understanding was that volcanos were only responsible for cooling.

Also, volcanic eruptions influence the weather, not the climate. The effects never last longer than a few years, in very rare cases half a century. Still, that's not climate.

+1 climate is weather averaged over 30 years.

JR

 

[AnalogPackrat]

The press doesn't do science, I'm afraid. It is entertainment, after all.

That is, unfortunately, a relatively recent phenomenon. Science was more accurately conveyed by the press 30-50 years ago than it is today.

Our understanding of climate change isn't complete, but it isn't bad either.

My complaint is not about completeness, but about hubristic predictions based on known incompleteness of understanding. Chicken Little is not "The Science."

It was the first occasion for modern science to observe an underwater eruption and collect data from it.

And yet we had knowledge that such eruptions occur. So why posit that volcanic activity only causes cooling when you damned well know that you have incomplete data and understanding of vulcanism?

Also, volcanic eruptions influence the weather, not the climate. The effects never last longer than a few years, in very rare cases half a century. Still, that's not climate.

Never? Bullshit. And volcanism is a continual process, not a single event. Billions of tons of various gases and dust injected into the atmosphere doesn't just disappear in a few years. Or if it did then our human-generated CO2 and SO2 emissions will also.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toba_catastrophe_theory

 

[cyrano]

My previous understanding was that volcanos were only responsible for cooling.

The most known effect is from the ash. That'll shut out sunlight, so the first few days or even weeks or months will be cooler, yes. Krakatau influenced the weather for years.

But the longer term effect is a rise in temperature once the ash has left the atmosphere. There are other factors, like size of the eruption and wind direction. Not all eruptions are explosive etc. So it's interesting to find that in this case, water vapour has the same effect as CO2 or methane.

 

[JohnRoberts]

The most known effect is from the ash. That'll shut out sunlight, so the first few days or even weeks or months will be cooler, yes. Krakatau influenced the weather for years.

yes

But the longer term effect is a rise in temperature once the ash has left the atmosphere.

I don't recall ever hearing that

There are other factors, like size of the eruption and wind direction. Not all eruptions are explosive etc. So it's interesting to find that in this case, water vapour has the same effect as CO2 or methane.

Water vapor, as in cloud formation is well known and well studied wrt atmospheric albedo, AFAIK....

JR

 

[cyrano]

Water vapor, as in cloud formation is well known and well studied wrt atmospheric albedo, AFAIK....

These aren't clouds. The vapour was pushed much higher. But I'm not a meteorologist either. And my memory isn't what it used to be...