Has modern culture jumped the woke shark?

[JohnRoberts]

The best way to deflate over the top wokeness is to ridicule it... Bud seems to need a pin prick.

JR

 

[living sounds]

Some people have strange tastes...

 

[Tubetec]

Imagine if a man had done the same thing and depicted women as animals , enslaved ,shackled and masked there would be uproar , yet because its part of a gay parade its all quite acceptable to the woke brigade .
Just goes to show this woke thing isnt really about equality at all , its more about turning the tables and the balance of power from one section of society to the other .
Its like that Eurythmics song , some of them want to abuse you , some of them want to be abused.....

 

[Tubetec]

Heres an old clip from Irish comedian Dave MacSavage , Im pretty surprised it wasnt pulled from youtube yet .
funny though ,

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Some people have strange tastes...

It's not the strange tastes. It's the celebration, promotion, and attempted normalization of it all that causes trouble.

 

[living sounds]

I don't see this affecting the real world much. I've long lived in and now live near a city that is certainly a gay stronghold, and I've never encountered anything of the sort here. Granted, I've never been to a parade, but that's only once a year anyway.

Personally I am more annoyed by the changes made to language here, that make reading news stories and legal texts much more difficult. And all the transparent virtue signalling going on, as well as the predictable overraction from the other side.

All the narratives and emotion driven thinking of this prevents us from concentrating on the many real and pressing issues affecting our current and future lives. I used to say that things need to get worse to get better, and unfortunately that still seems to be the case...

 

[AnalogPackrat]

I don't see this affecting the real world much. I've long lived in and now live near a city that is certainly a gay stronghold, and I've never encountered anything of the sort here. Granted, I've never been to a parade, but that's only once a year anyway.

I have no issue tolerating any of the things consenting adults do so long as they aren't negatively affecting others (especially children).

Personally I am more annoyed by the changes made to language here, that make reading news stories and legal texts much more difficult. And all the transparent virtue signalling going on, as well as the predictable overraction from the other side.

Which is exactly how the problem begins. Tail (of the distribution) wagging the dog. It goes much deeper than annoying language.

All the narratives and emotion driven thinking of this prevents us from concentrating on the many real and pressing issues affecting our current and future lives. I used to say that things need to get worse to get better, and unfortunately that still seems to be the case...

Correct. Constructed greivances create "problems" where none exist.

"Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times." --G. Michael Hopf

 

[JohnRoberts]

I don't see this affecting the real world much. I've long lived in and now live near a city that is certainly a gay stronghold, and I've never encountered anything of the sort here. Granted, I've never been to a parade, but that's only once a year anyway.

There has been a small minority gay community around for a long time (back in the 70s I had a gay(?) hitchhiker start rubbing my leg. That ended his free ride.)

Personally I am more annoyed by the changes made to language here, that make reading news stories and legal texts much more difficult. And all the transparent virtue signalling going on, as well as the predictable overraction from the other side.

I don't want to give these pukes too much credit but changing the meaning of words is part of rewriting history, a well worn disruptive practice.

All the narratives and emotion driven thinking of this prevents us from concentrating on the many real and pressing issues affecting our current and future lives.

Sadly they are in fact trying to control what we consider "real and pressing"..... Describing climate change as an existential crisis, while open borders are only a challenge.

I used to say that things need to get worse to get better, and unfortunately that still seems to be the case...

While hard to imagine that seems to be about the only thing that explains a lot of behaviors; like intentionally thwarting economic growth.
===
ESG ratings are being used as a cudgel against major corporations by woke minorities to get them to toe the woke line. We see evidence of this from major corporations like Disney, Budweiser, Nike, etc. These major corporations are afraid to lose their 100% ESG rating making them less desirable investments.

I mostly have the opposite reaction (this reminds me I need to sell some more stocks before the recession).

JR

 

[scott2000]

I don't see this affecting the real world much

Confusing.... does not the US take precedent and therefore necessitate the lion's share of geopolitical discourse? Unless it's fake news,a large focus of the current administration has been to spread affirmative action to it's far edges if that's even the right terminology.

 

[living sounds]

ESG ratings are being used as a cudgel against major corporations by woke minorities to get them to toe the woke line. We see evidence of this from major corporations like Disney, Budweiser, Nike, etc. These major corporations are afraid to lose their 100% ESG rating making them less desirable investments.

And what happens to a company that hires people because they make it look better? After some time it will affect the bottom line and the market will sort it out.

Which is exactly how the problem begins. Tail (of the distribution) wagging the dog. It goes much deeper than annoying language.

Where exactly does it go much deeper? I see the obvious virtue signalling in hiring patterns in the media industry (some European countries following these American trends now appear to have actual minority overpresentation) and there are isolated idiotic incidents of e.g. male rapists supposedly identifying as women being placed in women's prisons etc. And I've noticed certain scientists that are usually very clear thinkers now refering to animals "that lay eggs" and "produce sperm" (for which the perfectly reasonable terms obviously are "female" and "male").

Again, I don't think this is going to last. Regression to the mean always happens. As usual, the next generation will look upon their parents and be embarassed and do think and act differently.

But climate change is a very different matter, it's science, not culture, and it will put increasing pressure on every single person on earth, unless we find ways to deal with it. And migration is and will increasingly be caused by climate change, it's vital to view these things in context.

 

[JohnRoberts]

And what happens to a company that hires people because they make it look better? After some time it will affect the bottom line and the market will sort it out.

in an efficient free market perhaps. we are seeing some pushback against over the top decisions. The joke image I posted is about bud hiring an activist influencer to improve their DEI score https://www.denominator.one/about/#Team (Diversity, equity, and inclusion). Kid Rock is being attacked by social media Karens for his visceral response to the bud light campaign (he shot up a case of beer).

Where exactly does it go much deeper? I see the obvious virtue signalling in hiring patterns in the media industry (some European countries following these American trends now appear to have actual minority overpresentation) and there are isolated idiotic incidents of e.g. male rapists supposedly identifying as women being placed in women's prisons etc. And I've noticed certain scientists that are usually very clear thinkers now refering to animals "that lay eggs" and "produce sperm" (for which the perfectly reasonable terms obviously are "female" and "male").

the transgender chaos turning woman's sports upside down has already done a lot of damage to female sports. They can't possibly compete fairly against self-declared female athletes that were born men. Men and women are indeed different.... Viva la difference.

Indeed we have seen the reports of male prisoners declaring that they are female to get put into female prisons, there have already been reports of rapes and IIRC pregnancy from this weak minded idiocy.

Again, I don't think this is going to last. Regression to the mean always happens. As usual, the next generation will look upon their parents and be embarassed and do think and act differently.

That is a very optimistic viewpoint but a lot of damage has already been done, and more happening every day. I keep waiting for social media to jump the woke shark (wake up to the idiocy). It looks like the #metoo, and #BLM movements have faded from the 24 hour news cycle (basketball games were almost unwatchable because of all the racial virtue signaling). ESG (DEI et al) are now discouraging investment in companies not certified "woke" by the Karens in charge. This will have an obvious economic impact on companies that do not yield.

But climate change is a very different matter, it's science, not culture, and it will put increasing pressure on every single person on earth, unless we find ways to deal with it. And migration is and will increasingly be caused by climate change, it's vital to view these things in context.

The risk of climate change has been grossly exaggerated to manipulate the public to accept energy policy changes that not only don't make much sense but will harm poor people around the world. The max global warming temperature target is arbitrary and completely ignores all the benefits of inexpensive energy provided by fossil fuels. India and China are still building new coal fired energy plants because of those obvious (to anybody with half a clue) benefits to drive economic growth and raise citizens out of poverty.

JR

PS: I watched an interview with ex-president Donald Trump last night and he had an interesting response to being asked about climate change. He dismissed it as being a grift, but instead offered that nuclear proliferation is the real existential threat. He is still a flaming blowhard so didn't verbalize his thoughts well (he called it nuclear warming) but my sense is that he was directionally correct as he often is when we remove the bloviating hyperbole.

 

[living sounds]

in an efficient free market perhaps. we are seeing some pushback against over the top decisions. The joke image I posted is about bud hiring an activist influencer to improve their DEI score https://www.denominator.one/about/#Team (Diversity, equity, and inclusion). Kid Rock is being attacked by social media Karens for his visceral response to the bud light campaign (he shot up a case of beer).

The predictable reaction from the right is equally cartoonish.

I actually think the whole "influencer marketing" thing is much more detrimental than anything else. People with no qualification other than having good looks and the ability to capture the reward system are looked upon by an entire generation as role models. At least rock stars had to be good at writing and performing art or sports stars had to be good at sports... I have some insight into the earnings of influencers, if only a small portion of that revenue still went into investigative reporting -and people wouldn't be captured by influencers and actually paid attention to important matters...

the transgender chaos turning woman's sports upside down has already done a lot of damage to female sports. They can't possibly compete fairly against self-declared female athletes that were born men. Men and women are indeed different.... Viva la difference.

Yes, but they are already backpedalling on that front. In hindsight almost everyone will realize how stupid that was...

 

[JohnRoberts]

The predictable reaction from the right is equally cartoonish.

as usual fringes on both sides are cra cra...

I actually think the whole "influencer marketing" thing is much more detrimental than anything else. People with no qualification other than having good looks and the ability to capture the reward system are looked upon by an entire generation as role models. At least rock stars had to be good at writing and performing art or sports stars had to be good at sports... I have some insight into the earnings of influencers, if only a small portion of that revenue still went into investigative reporting -and people wouldn't be captured by influencers and actually paid attention to important matters...

BUT... The administration has announced that it has plans to use TikTok influencers to disseminate political messaging. I know better than to underestimate the political strategies of democrats. Meanwhile the administration is wresting with efforts to ban tik tok from government devices. Unclear how they will square that apparent conflict.

Yes, but they are already backpedalling on that front. In hindsight almost everyone will realize how stupid that was...

I find that common sense is not that common in modern government.

JR

 

[Matador]

Sadly they are in fact trying to control what we consider "real and pressing"..... Describing climate change as an existential crisis, while open borders are only a challenge.

So inflating issues into a crisis is wrong?

the transgender chaos turning woman's sports upside down has already done a lot of damage to female sports. They can't possibly compete fairly against self-declared female athletes that were born men. Men and women are indeed different.... Viva la difference.

So it's a crisis? Turning the woman's sports world upside down? That sounds like much more than a simple 'challenge', yes? We must be careful with our usage of words, right?

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...rans-participation-transgender-women-swimming

The truth is that transgender women and girls are drastically underrepresented in women’s sports. Recent polls show that 0.6% of Americans identify as transgender. With about 220,000 women competing in NCAA sports last year, that should have amounted to about 1,300 transgender female athletes, but the actual number is negligible. Any policy on our inclusion in sport needs to be based on the reality of our participation, not misguided fears and politics.

https://mediahub.unc.edu/a-solution...t-trans-women-from-competing-on-womens-teams/

Joanna Harper, a researcher in Britain who studies the effects of hormone therapy on transgender athletes, told The New York Times that she estimates that 50 out of 200,000 women in college sports are transgender.

https://www.espn.com/espn/story/_/i...sgender-athletes-caught-middle-states-debates

There is no data available that provides an exact number of transgender students in high school, let alone transgender student-athletes. There are approximately 15 million high school students in the United States, and approximately 8 million of them participate in high school sports. A CDC study published in 2019 estimated that 1.8 percent of high school students are transgender, meaning there are roughly 270,000 transgender students in U.S. high schools. But a report by the Human Rights Campaign found that only 14% of transgender boys and 12% of transgender girls play sports. Given all of those numbers, it's statistically possible that there are some 35,000 transgender student-athletes in high school, which would mean 0.44% of high school athletes are transgender.
...
"What was very telling for me was a comment by the parents who said, 'We know that there's other transgender girls running, but we don't care about them because they're not winning,'" Lungarini says.

 

[living sounds]

The disparity between a body shaped by testosterone (which will and cannot not be undone by hormone therapy) and one without it is so significant that an aged transgender cyclists and a transgender swimmer easily won female championchips.

I wouldn't call it a crisis, personally, because I don't care at all for watching sports events. But many people do consider that important, and the aformentioned facts render these competitions quite pointless for all the (biologically) female participants and in turn for those watching these events.

 

[JohnRoberts]

So inflating issues into a crisis is wrong?

a popular strategy but IMO dishonest.

So it's a crisis? Turning the woman's sports world upside down? That sounds like much more than a simple 'challenge', yes? We must be careful with our usage of words, right?

I don't appreciate having words put in my mouth.. . I called it "chaos". I don't have a filly in this race but sympathize with female athletes being forced to compete with biological males. Former woman soccer star Megan Rapinoe has come out to support transgender athletes competing directly with women. For an amusing almost true anecdote her woman's team played a warm up match against a local boys under 15 club. This was not a formal contest but amusing in the context of male vs female athletes. The under 15 YO boys won 5-2.

https://www.theguardian.com/comment...rans-participation-transgender-women-swimming

there are examples of male swimmers who were not competitive, winning matches after declaring themselves to be female.

https://mediahub.unc.edu/a-solution...t-trans-women-from-competing-on-womens-teams/

do whatever is fair... if they need their own category to be on a level playing field, do that. If there aren't enough to justify their own category, why ruin the sport for so many actual female athletes.

JR

 

[JohnRoberts]

The disparity between a body shaped by testosterone (which will and cannot not be undone by hormone therapy) and one without it is so significant that an aged transgender cyclists and a transgender swimmer easily won female championchips.

We agree, that is science...

I wouldn't call it a crisis, personally, because I don't care at all for watching sports events. But many people do consider that important, and the aformentioned facts render these competitions quite pointless for all the (biologically) female participants and in turn for those watching these events.

To repeat I did not call it a crisis.

That said I do worry about the mental health of young people being repeatedly told/taught overwhelmingly negative predictions about our future. I have survived multiple "end of the world" predictions.

JR

 

[hodad]

I am not sure I understand the coordinated attack on Justice Thomas other than to distract from other news events.

100% agree!!! We should instead focus our time and energy on Woke Budweiser!!! That is what really matters!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[cyrano]

Ever heard of the spleen?

Whenever mankind gets into a new century, a new wave of puritanism hits. Nobody seems to know why exactly, but it's been observed at every turn of a century.

In our case, it's the turn of a millennium. We've survived the year 2000 problem. The world didn't go down in fire. So, let's clean up all that filth from the previous millennium.

Strangely enough, Wikipedia has several articles about, Wletschmerz is probably the most known one, but none in English. Go figure...

So the woke culture isn't new. It's the same thing over and over again. Mankind fooling itself...

 

[JohnRoberts]

100% agree!!! We should instead focus our time and energy on Woke Budweiser!!! That is what really matters!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you for your support.

Budweiser is just the latest example of big business acquiescing to the woke whiners. Letting the wokesters drive the bus will not end well.

JR