Hell exists

[desol]

I just wanted to reach out to people on this forum to say that recently, as in the last week, I have gone through a very powerful experience that I wanted to share. I had been objectively analyzing video's on youtube for months, showing various people that had gone through NDE's and experienced hell. I have been very spiritual throughout my entire life(was an alter boy when I was young). Anyhow, all of these people through whatever events, drug overdoses, suicides, car accidents(which left them disfigured), etc...reached 'this place' through these events. I have come to believe that they ARE telling the TRUTH...and that you do NOT want to go to this place.

At least "I" don't, and I've made my choice.

In the last week, I have decided to rebuke the devil's offer's in this life, become a born again Christian and follow the path of Christ. From what I was able to analyze and deduce based on everything I know about psychology, religion, philosophy, science, etc....they are not lying about what they have experienced. Through analysis, I have also personally deduced that they are not dreaming it. I think this is something that we all share as a strong interest, unless your heart has been significantly hardened against the idea by said culprit.

Because of what I have experienced and continue to experience in my life, through events that only I understand...I would urge people to analyze some of these accounts and come to their 'own' decision. For me, it is The Truth. Hell exists and I am not going there. I've turned around so to speak, and chosen to 'walk the other way'.

I always thought the story in the bible was a lie, but it is not, for me, now. At first it was huge 'shock' to my system...but now that it's settled in, I'm ok with was entailed with the position. I'm more than ok with it.

 

[boji]

Have you researched the effects of DMT on the brain?  Studies show the brain produces a huge amount of this psychrotrophic chemical when under mortal duress which may account for the mystical experience.  That the NDE narrative tends to revolve around light and the crossing of thresholds is still nonetheless interesting.
But unless you can create a control group that has been shielded from all the ancient stories of light, the afterlife, angels and heavenly destinations, and then they also spontaneously recount the same type of stories during an NDE, we can't be sure there's anything supernatural going on with regard to deathly visions.

 

[bluebird]

Wow, pretty brave post. Your really opening your self up for a lot of criticism and questioning. Or perhaps crickets....

I'll just say I have been through the spiritual searching journey pretty much my whole life. My parents even had a Guru from India.
I was into the Astral Plane thing for a while, which has some similarity's with NDE's. Recently read the Bible... Was into meditation.

I finally landed in the exact opposite spot as you. The fact that there are so many philosophies and religions and spiritual paths, brought me to the conclusion that its impossible for me to ever REALLY know what is what. I was positive I found the answer so many times. Until a better answer showed up.

After all the new age metaphysical hippie dippy stuff, I figured a Bible study and a few dinners with my friend who is a devout  Christian would give me a solid answer. How could so many people be wrong? And that was my friends main argument. But it just didn't connect. There was no calling for me, no sign... Never really has been, just different ways of looking at the world and human behavior.

So I decided to give up all the looking and searching and reasoning and chose to just live my life the best I can.  As soon as I made the decision to drop it, I felt a big weight lift off my shoulders. I just don't have to know. And I decided I don't care what happens to me when I die. I'll deal with that when and if it presents itself.

But hey, congratulations on your decision. There is a lot of comfort that can be had in faith. And you could be right, I honestly don't know...I honestly don't know.

P.S.
If there is some "God" or higher power...There is no way our brains can comprehend or understand it. I can't even comprehend how they make an automatic transmission, let alone why the physical universe exists.

 

[boji]

But to reply to the hell paradigm, I think of its value in terms of helping us appreciate the long term dangers of bad behaviour.

Here, I'll do my best (worst) J.Peterson impression: Hell is a powerful and useful emergent abstraction of the human mind, in that it instills a sense of the punitive and regulates good behavior, and can be used independent of present circumstances or when real-world figures of authority are not around to demand we be 'proper citizens'.  It has served our species to great effect.  I think atheists are terribly shortsighted when wishing to rid humanity of it whole-cloth, as if it's some unnecessary baggage we carry around from our unsavory past. No earthly eden is going to come about without it, imo.

 

[desol]

Have you researched the effects of DMT on the brain?  Studies show the brain produces a huge amount of this psychrotrophic chemical when under mortal duress which may account for the mystical experience.  That the NDE narrative tends to revolve around light and the crossing of thresholds is still nonetheless interesting.
But unless you can create a control group that has been shielded from all the ancient stories of light, the afterlife, angels and heavenly destinations, and then they also spontaneously recount the same type of stories during an NDE, we can't be sure there's anything supernatural going on with regard to deathly visions.

I have considered the effects of DMT(the one you're talking about/brain crisis secretion), which I had read about many years ago....however, after a lengthly careful analysis of many of these experiences, I've made my decision. At first I thought myself ridiculous(and like I said, it was a massive physical, spiritual, mental shock. how could this be? It can't be?) however, my senses tell me, it is so. My heart also tells me it is so. Even my own relative, personal consequential day to day 'experiences' that only 'I' know. Tell me so. They're all working together. And I've chosen to listen to it...very seriously.

I've read Einstein, special relativity....I've followed buddha and researched many of these topics on a deep level for years. I've followed objective medicine, I've followed theoretical particle physics. Everything 'needs' to be objective for me. Everything that I've ever come to know, says it should not be, you need proof...however, I believe these people...and I believe them very seriously. This life, I've concluded is not about fun and games when it has ended...it is not about falling 'asleep', at the wheel.

And as such, many of the doctors, neurologists and other trained individuals(trained to critique) that have had these experiences(not all hell bound) likewise have no other corner of explanation. I only came to tell my personal choice on the matter, as it is a part of the deal that I've accepted, from Christ. I'm also fine with what it entails. No money. No thinking I know everything. No pining over this temp world/life.

Also, there is no light in the outer darkness...which rules out DMT experience. Serious business...and none of it can be scientifically proven. It's about 'your' choice based on your free will, while you're here...and there is only 'one chance'.

I threw out my bible a long time ago, I was just like everyone else. Prove it. It's been proven.

The purpose is to tell the truth to as many people as can be saved, before their lives end. So they can make their choice. What helps me understand now, is to know that hell 'is real' and everything subsequent is based on knowing that fact. And 'no-thing' can change it. Ever, however hard 'it' tries. It 'hates' us, because we have a second chance.

I suggest many at least consider, seriously.

 

[boji]

Have you researched the effects of DMT on the brain?
You mean like cancer research?]

No. The research on DMT I've seen has to do with NDE's, the pineal gland and 3rd eye stuff. I'm into a book by Michael Pollan that questions the popular negative opinions of psychoactive substances.
https://newrepublic.com/article/148420/can-psychedelic-drugs-good


Desol, I've taken a rational approach in replying to your thread, but I want you to know I very much appreciate your quest for meaning. The spiritual experience is something we all could do well to keep plugging for in our own lives.

 

[desol]

Your welcome. It's a part of the job.  That is all...

To let you know, what I have chosen.

 

[bluebird]

You should watch "Come Sunday" Its a Netflix movie. Very powerful. A preacher realizes everyone is saved.

 

[desol]

You should watch "Come Sunday" Its a Netflix movie. Very powerful. A preacher realizes everyone is saved.

I understand your skepticism...

 

[boji]

I've always had a problem with the separation and uniform popularity of secular music because to me, some of the best music I have ever heard I also imagine was born from soul(s) trying to bring to life the sound of the magnificent, the other-worldly.

This gets at the heart of my choice to build a console, as I think of it as a church, built up brick by brick by my hands. What lofty cherbum wishes to grace me with their presence while passing through my halls when I'm done remains to be heard, but it is my grand, most grand desire.

 

[desol]

As long as one doesn't expect to find any type of salvation in these 'things'. Or in this world, for that matter.

None of these things can save you from the 'second death'.

 

[boji]

The atheist in me agrees with you. The theist in me only wishes to participate in that which is greater than myself.

 

[bluebird]

I don't have any skepticism, I just don't know.

But the movie was interesting because here a preacher with immense faith in god, had an epiphany while watching a infomercial about starving kids in Africa. He reasoned, if there was a God, that these children couldn't be going to hell. They were not Christians. And they were not going to hell, that was his faith and it cost him his parish.  He eventually choose to work with (preach the word of Jesus) the LGBT community and other groups rejected by the traditional Christian church.  Its true story and very inspiring.

I'm not trying to disprove your beliefs, I'm just having a conversation about your topic, because you posted.

 

[desol]

I don't have any skepticism, I just don't know.

But the movie was interesting because here a preacher with immense faith in god, had an epiphany while watching a infomercial about starving kids in Africa. He reasoned, if there was a God, that these children couldn't be going to hell. They were not Christians. And they were not going to hell, that was his faith and it cost him his parish.  He eventually choose to work with the LGBT community and other groups rejected by the traditional Christian church.  Its true story and very inspiring.

I'm not trying to disprove your beliefs, I'm just having a conversation about your topic, because you posted.

It sounds good, however, I believe these people's personal NDE experiences, over his rational or anything else that should make sense to us. One of the precepts, is that our 'apparent knowledge' over God's illustrates just one, of our follies. The story as such, that 'it' was cast to the earth because of 'it's' free will. It made the decision to go against. Then, 'our' ancestors chose to follow 'it', because of 'their' free will choice. This again, was disobedient. Because of this nastiness, all perish by default. That is, until Christ 'made ground'.

As much as this appears like a fairy tale, I believe their NDE experiences, over my own self apparent knowledge of what should 'make sense' to me, that I am(in part) good.  The point I reached, light being the constant...we're bound to this galaxy.

All else rational, is not for me to decipher 'any longer'...only to believe and be 'obedient' to what is being warned in these Near Death Experiences.

 

[desol]

The atheist in me agrees with you. The theist in me only wishes to participate in that which is greater than myself.

Trust me, you don't want to make the wrong decision...

 

[Gregg Johns]

faith is a good thing,sometimes on our path we learn what to do and hells on the top of the list!

 

[desol]

faith is a good thing,sometimes on our path we learn what to do and hells on the top of the list!

You don't want to even chance it, based on what I see.

 

[boji]

Welcome to the forum Mr. Johns.

I've cat-called hell and she turned out to be one nasty harpie.

 

[desol]

Reminds me of Ecclesiastes 12:12

I join the others ...... in applauding your sharing...


True

'Many' will try to stop you...but it's not worth it. Not even close.

 

[bluebird]

Reminds me of Ecclesiastes

Than was actually one of my favorite books. The world has no meaning without God...Appealed to my philosophical side.

You don't want to even chance it, based on what I see.

Dang dude whatever you saw  must have really scared you.  I've heard a very convincing NDE from a soldier who was blown 10 or 15 feet by an explosion. He said he definitely was out of his body  completely conscious watching his body on the ground from up in the air.
But how do you observe with no eyes? What is observing?