Output issue with Behringer ADA8000

[Bjorn218]

I’ve been using this using for a little over a year now but only using the inputs into my interface.  I have now upgraded to an interface where I have to use the outputs to the Behringer. Except I’m getting nothing across the board. 

I receive no output including performing a loop back test with the ADAT cable into powered monitors.  Would anyone happen to know if the xlr pins should have some sort of current through them to somehow test to see if is the xlr ends or something further inside the box?

 

[Bo Deadly]

I somewhat doubt the outputs are an issue. It's almost certainly more of a software issue. Most likely just routing on the computer end. I assume you installed whatever drivers? Is there a GUI interface that could show you levels?

 

[Khron]

"A loop back test with the ADAT cable into powered monitors"??? What monitors are those, that have ADAT inputs?

On one hand, it would be interesting if you mentioned what interface you're using (with the ADA8000 as an add-on). That may or may not have its own internal mixer / router (which, depending on the brand and architecture, may very well NOT match the channel names that show up in your DAW).

On the other hand, some greater detail in how things are connected, and how you ran your tests, might also give us a bit more to work with.

 

[Bjorn218]

I somewhat doubt the outputs are an issue. It's almost certainly more of a software issue. Most likely just routing on the computer end. I assume you installed whatever drivers? Is there a GUI interface that could show you levels?

Yes and I am getting signal in and out according to RME Totalmix as well as my DAW.  If I cycle the Behringer unit I can hear the power thump on the monitors.  Which is why this is perplexing.

 

[scott2000]

"A loop back test with the ADAT cable into powered monitors"??? What monitors are those, that have ADAT inputs?

There are some Rolands that have this afaik....

Not sure if those are optical spdif or adat

 

[Bjorn218]

"A loop back test with the ADAT cable into powered monitors"??? What monitors are those, that have ADAT inputs?

On one hand, it would be interesting if you mentioned what interface you're using (with the ADA8000 as an add-on). That may or may not have its own internal mixer / router (which, depending on the brand and architecture, may very well NOT match the channel names that show up in your DAW).

On the other hand, some greater detail in how things are connected, and how you ran your tests, might also give us a bit more to work with.

Loop back test of the ADA using an ADAT cable plugged into the send and return of the ada ADAT ports.  I would then mic check each channel in turn as well as moving one of my powered monitors to the corresponding output channel the mic would be plugged into.  I had read of doing that in a couple of posts in the existing ADA8000 threads on this forum. I don’t remember which one but probably the 15 page modding thread which I read last night.  It was a way to bypass the AD/DC to use the preamps direct to a board or external recorder. 

I’m using a RME HDSP 9652 as my sound card. The Behringer I’m using as the physical I/O.

 

[Bjorn218]

There are some Rolands that have this afaik....

Not sure if those are optical spdif or adat

My monitors are old maudio bx-5s. The first series before they made them better or whatever. 

 

[scott2000]

Oh... Simple misunderstanding....

Have you checked the RME settings (not total mix) to see if there is anything off there?

 

[Youngwhisk]

Should work. Have you set the sync to Master?

 

[Bjorn218]

Oh... Simple misunderstanding....

Have you checked the RME settings (not total mix) to see if there is anything off there?

They are set to how I’m being instructed to set them.  It’s good hardware but the drivers span their whole lineup so my card uses some of the drivers capabilities but not others, and another device may use portion of what mine uses and other stuff mine doesn’t etc. 

I think I’m understanding it but not really.  I just wanted to see if when I am trying to playback something, I could have measured voltage on the analog outs to see if signal is even getting to them.  Personally I think it’s either the Behringer return or the RME send that is dead.

 

[scott2000]

The previous suggestion makes sense about setting the sync. Not sure about the Behringer but the old Tangos were very picky about this.

How are your settings are in the RME control panel where you set your latency and sample rates etc....(not the total mix).  There is a setting for the spdif that can output it through the optical ports which can disable the actual ADAT.  It only disabled channels 1-8 or something iirc... Spdif should be set to coax if you intend to use all the ADAT ports as ADAT ...

There are some other converters that use optical spdif and not adat and has caused me confusion in the past. Maybe make sure to rule this out too.

You'll get it figured out... The total mix can get you in the weeds if you're not familiar with it and start clicking things but there is a reset I believe if you need it....

but yes you can measure AC voltage across pins 2 and 3 of your xlr or tip and ring of your trs to see if you're getting signal.. but it sounds like you're not..

On the other hand, some greater detail in how things are connected, and how you ran your tests, might also give us a bit more to work with.

+1

 

[Pusch3l]

Do you use the breakout cable?
the red RCA plug is digital out but you have to use some kind of converter (which I used for some years) or (what I now use) the presonus monitor station 2.

 

[Bjorn218]

The previous suggestion makes sense about setting the sync. Not sure about the Behringer but the old Tangos were very picky about this.

How are your settings are in the RME control panel where you set your latency and sample rates etc....(not the total mix).  There is a setting for the spdif that can output it through the optical ports which can disable the actual ADAT.  It only disabled channels 1-8 or something iirc... Spdif should be set to coax if you intend to use all the ADAT ports as ADAT ...

There are some other converters that use optical spdif and not adat and has caused me confusion in the past. Maybe make sure to rule this out too.

You'll get it figured out... The total mix can get you in the weeds if you're not familiar with it and start clicking things but there is a reset I believe if you need it....

but yes you can measure AC voltage across pins 2 and 3 of your xlr or tip and ring of your trs to see if you're getting signal.. but it sounds like you're not..

+1

My apologies for the past few days of silence.  I had my elderly mother down for a few days for some medical appointments so I had to be the dutiful Son and couldnt really get online to deal with this.  To answer your question regarding the RME settings these are them.
https://i.ibb.co/8mr30Vn/RME-settings.png

What really is bizarro is that there is ZERO available positive check from either company involved.  Behringer I can understand.  That company cannot even keep their registered customers accounts open.  I own several TC Electronics devices and while I like them TC, Behringer and the rest of those companies which hide like cowards under that Music Tribe banner, cant all leave this earth fast enough.  I keep getting told my email, account name and passwords are all invalid but when I try to register, I am told that the emails, account name and passwords are all taken....

RME? Their head of online technical support I wish I could have 5 minutes in a room alone with that guy.  No one appreciates constantly being spoken down to, and when you do not understand something through the apparent RME mind reading implant that unfortunately was missing out of the box of my soundcard the problem is obviously my ignorance  Yes the exact word that was used

Back to what I was saying, there is no physical test that either of those two companies have where a ignorant american with a DMM and a working knowledge of what end of a soldering iron not to touch when its on, can check to ensure the hardware they built is actually doing the stuff they claim it is supposed to before it goes all ones and zeros..  Test equipment I do know. Repairing guitar tube amps, guitar solid state amps, and the instruments that make nouise through them is what I do to keep dry when its raining.

 

[Bjorn218]

Do you use the breakout cable?
the red RCA plug is digital out but you have to use some kind of converter (which I used for some years) or (what I now use) the presonus monitor station 2.

No Sir I do not use the break out cable.  I have the two lightpipe TOSLINK cables sending something to the soundcard and converter, and a BNC word clock cable doing the same.

 

[radardoug]

If you do a loopback by using the ADAT cable, and get no output, the problem is the ADA8000. Make sure you have clock selected correctly. If you cant get this test working, your ADA8000 is faulty.

 

[Khron]

And the Behringer is set to clock off the BNC then? And the mic inputs work (in TotalMix / your DAW)?

 

[Pusch3l]

No Sir I do not use the break out cable.  I have the two lightpipe TOSLINK cables sending something to the soundcard and converter, and a BNC word clock cable doing the same.

I do not own a external WC. But looking at the backside of the ADA8000 you can connect a WC there and IIRC my ADA8000 is set to "Master".
I have no picture of the software available at the moment but I will send it in about 1 or 2 hours.

I have to ask this, so please be gentle:
You plugged the 2 Adat cables in the right connectors on the RME and into the ADA8000?
Do you see the red TosLink light on the outputs on each of the hardware?

Maybe you can switch from ADAT1 to ADAT3 for testing purposes and try to output something to ch24 and see how that goes.

Greets

 

[Bjorn218]

Please excuse me for performing necromancy.  I have some time to deal with this now and am not honestly stressed about it as I am in the could give a damn more over this right now.  I just want to figure out why I get no output.  Unless I hit certain pins on a T074!!!!

@Pusch31 you mentioned a picture of some software?  Do you remember what you meant?

Yes, as far as I know, I was plugging into the correct TOSLINK ports. Mind you I also ran the ADA on its own using a TOSLINK cable as a jumper which everyone claims bypasses(in a sense) the ADAT converters.  Use a cable as jumper and input 1-8 shows signal at output 1-8 respectively. Output is dead, well I’m getting sub volt electrical readings that fluctuate on what Input is doing.

At the time I pretty much gave up on being able to use the Behringer unit for any output.  Input through the RME into the DAW works perfectly. Including testing it on the Focusrite Safire Pro24 which I was using until May’s Windows update would not see my 1394 card anymore.

Here is where I am at now.
Last night I pulled the top cover off and plugged the Behringer in and again decided to see if I’m running only half the transformer.  Low and behold I was getting voltage to the output side of the unit.  I couldn’t find the schematic Keith had drawn up and posted on my phone, so I pulled up a T074 data sheet and started seeing if any of the pins were actually receiving voltage. I did not write any of the readings down sadly, but I did get some output signal. On the T074 for channels 1 and 2, I first checked the pins 4&11 which power the IC.  Pin 4 is +Vcc and pin 11 is -Vcc. When I touched the pins with my DMM probe, I did get an audible pop when the probe touched a pin. I had hooked up Channel 1 output to my Marshall practice amp. I was able to hear this but the practice amp was dimed both the pre and master volumes. The pops were not loud but noticeable. I checked all other output pins as well as the positive inputs. These would be pins 1,7,8,and 14. The positive input pins are pins 3,5,10, and 12. I got the same type of pop (similar to pop one gets plugging in a mic on a hot channel on a pa but not as loud obviously.  I did not test the input negative pins and I did check the other Vcc+&- pins on the remaining 3 T074 if’s resulting in similar pops. 

The main reason why I did not record the value content was that the pins are so small my attention was more focused on making sure I didn’t short the ic

So I am not sure where to go from here to get output. 

I am under the impression that when the ADA8000 is used, inputs run into the A/D converter then into the TOSLINK output, to wherever the user decides to use the ADAT routes it.  Upon a returning signal through the TOSLINK in(return), the signal is routed to match the input channel so essentially the Behringer unit is noting more than a type of Output send and return one would find on a larger kixing desk with a ADAT routing loop between the analog inputs and outputs. And, that my trying to use a pair of outputs as an audio out from the DAW is t going to work properly.  At least not without an additional piece of hardware I will need to use to attach my powered monitors to.  The Behringer unit isn’t designed to be used how I’ve been trying to use it.

 

[Khron]

I'm still not entirely clear on just how you intend(ed) to use the thing, but I will say this - apart from the clock circuitry, the input and the output sides of the ADA8000 are completely independent.

The 8 mic/line inputs go into the ADC('s), then into the AL1401 ADAT encoder (or V1401, if it's Behringer's own CoolAudio version), then out the optical output.

The optical input goes into the AL1402 / V1402 receiver, into the DAC('s), and out the analog outputs.

Doing an optical loopback connection bypasses nothing - the signals are still going through both the ADAT transmitter as well as the receiver. There's no sort of mixing / rerouting the unit can do; the ins and outs are indeed mapped 1:1, respectively.

If you want to output analog signals on, say outputs 5 and 6, that's what you'll need to route the signals to, in your DAW and/or TotalMix. Do keep in mind that assuming how signals are routed does not mean they really are - things can get complicated with these uber-flexible systems.

 

[Bjorn218]

What I am trying to do is use the ADA outputs to run to a pair of powered monitors so I can hear what I am recording/mixing/etc.

I can verify signal in all the way to being able to record on the input side of the ADA.  I can verify I have signal at least getting to the output sends in the RME software as much as seeing the meter movement on the computer screen.  There is ADAT light signal on the RME ADAT Out.

I get no actual audio signal I can hear from the ADA outputs.  But lie I said when I was checking for voltage on the T074 I did hear audible noise as one would testing output transistors, or an IC on a solid state amplifier.  Just the sound of the probe touching the componant being tested.  Just trying to figure out what I may be doing wrong as I have been told by some other associates who have a similar set up all I should have to do is assign one of the rear outputs to left monitor and one to right monitor.  In this case assign them by pair is suggested.  Ie 1/2, 3/4, etc.  I have done that as well as randomly tried assigning the outputs.  Still the same no audio.  The monitors I am trying to input into is a piece of M-audio bx5s.

I’m attaching the schematic I am using to make sure I am on the same page I should probably start following the signal after the AL1402/V1402 receivers?  Just confused as to why same problem on each output is all.  Get no audio signal but do get audio pi’s when touching the T074 legs. 

You mentioned the RME Total Mix, yeah I am still not fully confident with that software either.  Seems to not want to allow me to assign the outputs to anything else but 1/2 in the software  but it doesn’t seem to see the ADA