PSU question

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rotation

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Jan 24, 2006
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402
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slovenia
Hi!

I need PSU for 2 Pico compressors, it has op amps on in/out. It needs +-15V DC. How can i get 15V out of this one? Changing the regulators? I'm looking at this one because it is simple enough to be built on veroboard.
http://www.beatbazar.com/guests/ssltech/kps-1/index.htm
It's Keit's design i think.

Miha
 
You would use 7815/7915 series regs ...... another trafo would be best ...... putting out +18/-18 so the regs don't have to drop too much voltage .... or use resistors prior to the regs to drop a few volts.
 
Yes, just omit the 48V stuff (LM317 and associated components from the Bridge Rectifier onwards) and use a 15-0-15V transformer. No need to use an 18V transformer since the peak-RMS ratio means that 18-0-18V will rectify to about ±25Volts DC... Too much margin to drop for cool running at 15V... 15-0-15V will rectify up to about 20VDC: a much more respectable margin. (I like at least 3V, but not more than 8V, unless there's a compelling reason...

You can do it with 18-0-18V or 20-0-20V, but the regulators will run significantly hotter, for no reason. It will therefore needlessly limit the current that you can draw.

Keith
 
[quote author="SSLtech"]Yes, just omit the 48V stuff (LM317 and associated components from the Bridge Rectifier onwards) and use a 15-0-15V transformer. No need to use an 18V transformer since the peak-RMS ratio means that 18-0-18V will rectify to about ±25Volts DC... Too much margin to drop for cool running at 15V... 15-0-15V will rectify up to about 20VDC: a much more respectable margin. (I like at least 3V, but not more than 8V, unless there's a compelling reason...

You can do it with 18-0-18V or 20-0-20V, but the regulators will run significantly hotter, for no reason. It will therefore needlessly limit the current that you can draw.[/quote]

There's the issue of dips in the wall voltage, though. If the wall voltage is down 10%, and you allow 2.5V for diode drops, your unregulated voltage with a 15-0-15V tranny becomes about 16.6V, not counting ripple. That's a little too close a squeak for me. I prefer going with 18-0-18 or 20-0-20 and dropping the extra voltage in resistors, a small one between the diode bridge and the first filter cap, and a larger one with another filter cap to form a two stage filter, which also reduces the ripple a lot. Basically I design so the input of the regulator is 3V greater than the regulated voltage at -10% line voltage.

Peace,
Paul
 
[quote author="mediatechnology"]...I really like the way you derived the 48V.[/quote]
Praise from Caesar! :grin:

I like it, too! It's not often that I have flashes of clarity, but I definately count that as one of my more inspired moments... -I still remember the exact feeling the moment that I was trying to draw a bi-legged multiplier and realised that the shape of the converging diode ladder that I was sketching had taken a very familiar shape... I also stll have the prototype which I built on veroboard, fully expecting such a simple thing to NOT work, because surely I must have overlooked something...

Paul, I usually allow 1.2V for a series pair of silicon diodes, since there's only ever two diodes in a bridge that conduct, so even with a 10% sag I tend to view it as 17.9Volts DC going into the 15V regulator... Certainly 2.4V seems too much to pay in silicon tax for a single bridge rectifier...

None the less, the point about resistive series drop between capacitive stages is well taken, and more recent PSU playtime has invariable included these steps. -The experiments for the recent Behringer ADA-8000 Power Supply modification thread showed me what a benefit these extra resistive stages can be.

Keith
 
Somebody did... They come standard as a part of the SSL 9k board "kit" i believe. -I did the layouts for all 3 boards (preamp, PSU and balance out) to allow for a modularity of approach, possibly adding EQs etc at a later date, (and the pico compressor looks like an excellent complementary 'channel compressor' type of module) so that people could make their own SSL-flavoured channel strips, but for all the 9k preamp boards that have been sold, I've only ever used ones that I've etched myself... perhaps one day I'll get a set of the black-market-available ones and see how they stack up. :wink:

The prototype for the PSU was done on veroboard and works well... The 2 or 3 I've buiilt since them have been home-etch affairs, with less than pristine edges to the boards. -I keep meaning to re-lay the board out, with pads for series resistance, and all three regulators aligned along one edge, for ease of heatsinking/board mounting

If course in addition to the line regulation question, there's also the question of true sine distortion, which will influence the exact peak-to-RMS relationship, shifting slightly from the usual 1.414 relationship... In the end you can make a choice between cool regulators (if your wall power is not prone to droop) and better drop-out protection in case of droopy power, at the expense of regulator power dissipation (in the form of heat).

A 16-0-16VAC secondary transformer is not a bad compromise to get 15V, and should be reasonably sag-immune, without getting overly hot. Go up if you're worried about sagging wall voltage, down if you're worried about heat.

Keith
 
Ahhh, i forgot about this quetion..Thanks for help!
I already have transformer and regulators, so i will finish it very soon.
Btw, i done a lot of search to find this simple PSU. It seems easyer to find schems for known gear than finding the PSU..

Miha
 
[quote author="mediatechnology"]Keith - One other thing that occurred to me was that you might want to reverse the polarity of C4 relative to C3. Wouldn't that make the composite capacitor a bipolar? (Forming a back-to-back capacitor string of C3/C4 with a bridge in the middle.) Just a thought...[/quote]
Mmmmmmnnnn....

The + plate of both C3 and C4 sits at (approximately) 30-something volts above their - plates as drawn... if you reversed either one, you'd get some bother.

Though I'm not sure I see what you're describing C3 and C4 can never "see" each other because of the orientation of the bridge... -there's no conductive path which allows them to 'meet' without fighting an opposing instantaneous voltage through a winding. -Am I on the wrong track?

Keit
 
Keith, I've been reading about your KPS-1 design with lots of interest - looks like a very nice and compact PSU solution.

Say I wanted to build myself a PSU delivering 48V and +/-15 volts... is that possible with only one transformer? I guess just changing the 7818/7918's to 7815/7915's and still using a 20-0-20V transformer would be a bad idea since the regulators would run too hot. So should I use a 18-0-18 transformer (or would that be to small for 48V), step down voltages before the regulators with resistors (if so I would probably need help figuring out where to put them and which values to use) or something completely different?

Any hints would be much appreciated. :green:
 
you can always use the 317 and 337 regulators. just adjust resistors to correct voltage. but 7915/7815 would be allot easier on the perf board.
 
[quote author="audio2"]you can always use the 317 and 337 regulators. just adjust resistors to correct voltage. but 7915/7815 would be allot easier on the perf board.[/quote]

I am planning to make mine on perf board so that's why I wanted to go for the 7915/7815 solution - just don't know if that will work.

Can anybody help me on figuring out if they will be able to adjust down to +/-15V without running too hot if using a 20-0-20V transformer??
 
[quote author="mediatechnology"]
There's the issue of dips in the wall voltage, though.

In some areas of the country we do take our stable power voltage for granted. [/quote]

No kidding, have you ever been to Memphis?!? It's terrible
 
YA you can use the 78 & 7915. the max input voltage is 35v. Just make sure you got them heat sinked. they shouldnt run to hot. a little sink on each should be cool.
 
[quote author="audio2"]YA you can use the 78 & 7915. the max input voltage is 35v. Just make sure you got them heat sinked. they shouldnt run to hot. a little sink on each should be cool.[/quote]
Thanks :thumb: I'll try it out!
 
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