I had a custom powder made for me for a project, and had two different places powder coat a panel one local, one states away. Both did underwhelming work.. The first company was local and even though they got the best reviews in town, the finish was very uneven looking lots of bubble like dips in the finish. I found a company out of state that said no worries we can do it right, and they did do a better job, but still a slightly bubbly looking finish. I know theres a way to get smooth finishes! I see it all the time on gear, but I'm striking out! Anyone have suggestions for a place to powder coat some panels for me? I'm in Nashville btw...
Sourcing Powder Coaters
- Thread starter kidb
- Start date
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Maybe contact Matt Stager of Stager mics ([email protected])? His mics have great looking powder coats and he's in Nashville too.
Powder coat is not rocket science but a PIA to start and stop for small runs. I recall when Peavey set up our powder coat production line and it was significant, but worked better running the same color for long runs, not small batches.
JR
JR
pucho812
Well-known member
If you have the space can get a diy powder coat kit
I had an acquaintance who worked at a small local motorcycle rebuilding shop do a small batch of powder coating for me back in the day. He was surprised at how small / simple the job was. Maybe look into that kind of business in your area?
IIRC the production powder coat line involved a controlled environment with electrostatic charged parts hangers to attract the powder onto the parts. Then they run through an oven to get cooked (cured). Not rocket science but imo not simple.
JR
Just a diy powder coater speculating: the OP complaints sound like maybe too much powder material was applied. Easy to do. It can cause an orange peel finish.
MidnightArrakis
Well-known member
[Anyone have suggestions for a place to powder coat some panels for me?] -- How many panels do you need powder-coated?
I'm guessing that for what you need to have done and with using your own powder, your personal project will probably more than likely tend to run a bit pricey. With that being said, there is a sheet-metal shop here where I live that primarily works on defense contractor projects, yet I have used them myself for a couple of my design projects. This local sheet-metal shop sends their projects out to a local powder-coating shop to do all of their powder-coating. I am mentioning this just to give you a reference of the level-of-quality that this local powder-coating shop has to be able to provide in order to meet defense contractor projects.
I myself have visited the powder-coating shop umpteen times and on the occasions when I have been there, they were involved with powder-coating "parking meters" for a nearby small town and even a "wrought-iron bench" for some local old-lady who wanted to freshen-up the look of her bench that she had in her backyard. My point??? ..... This local powder-coating shop does everything from an old-lady's backyard bench to rack-mount chassis I have personally designed to equipment consoles used on U.S. Navy vessels.....all with the same level of craftsmanship and quality. Would this be "good enough" for you?
[I know there's a way to get smooth finishes] -- YES!!!.....There is!!! But, you will need to do some "homework" first in order for you to determine -- exactly what type -- of "smooth" finish that you are looking for. There is:
- Smooth
- Fine
- Fine Textured
- Sandtex
- Matte
- Low-Gloss
- >> Others.....
- Federal Standard 595 Color FS 37038 Flat Black
- Federal Standard 595 Color FS 17038 Black
- RAL9005
- Black Sandtex
- Realcoat EL HNF35QF ECB-1363A (Black 2701)
>> Here's a stack of one of the rack-mount chassis I have designed:
>> My chassis ready to be powder-coated:
>> My chassis rear-panels inside the powder-coating booth:
>> Chassis rear-panel powder-coated and on a finished piece of equipment:
>> Chassis inside-view:
>> One of my "panel" designs:
>>> Your call!!!.....
/
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S.Samuelsson
Active member
Hi.
I got paid to wet-paint cars for a while back in the late 80's and have done some diy-powdercoating over the decades, but the bulk of my knowledge comes from my education and the various industrial jobs I've had over the years.
Just as any other surface treatement method, powdercoating looks decievingly simple.
Especially if done by a professional, in a powdercoating facility.
While the principle is very simple: just heat the piece to a predetermined temperature -> apply the powder -> melt/cure the powder -> done, the reality is a whole 'nother ballgame.
That's one of the reasons "wet paint" is still the preferred method in most applications even though the tightening environmental legislation makes it more and more expensive and difficult every few years or so.
Powdercoating on the other hand, is very environmental friendly in comparison so if it was easy, everything that can fit in a curing oven would be powdercoated.
If not by the powdercoaters who gave it a go, it's a surprise to me that they agreed to use unknown (to them) powder, a failure of a some sort is pretty much guaranteed.
It takes a lot of time (and powder) to dial all the parameters in, if and when a flawless result is required.
While they all look, well, a powderous substances, there's a lot of variations and it's usually discouraged to mix the powders.
It's been a while I last checked, but if a custom powder was required, it was ordered straight from the manufacturer and something along the lines of 1000Kg was the minimum order.
The former would be a rookie mistake, so if this was a poll, my vote would go for the latter.
If anything, it's pretty safe to say that if a one-off or a very limited run has a smooth and shiny surface, it's most likely wet paint.
Reasonably smooth finish can be acchieved by powdercoating as well, but it takes a lot of skill, and a precisely tuned process.
Not to mention a lots of parts that are exactly the same (or similar enough), otherwise all the tuning (time and powder) has to be put in the price of that one-off job.
Regards,
Sam
I got paid to wet-paint cars for a while back in the late 80's and have done some diy-powdercoating over the decades, but the bulk of my knowledge comes from my education and the various industrial jobs I've had over the years.
Just as any other surface treatement method, powdercoating looks decievingly simple.
Especially if done by a professional, in a powdercoating facility.
While the principle is very simple: just heat the piece to a predetermined temperature -> apply the powder -> melt/cure the powder -> done, the reality is a whole 'nother ballgame.
That's one of the reasons "wet paint" is still the preferred method in most applications even though the tightening environmental legislation makes it more and more expensive and difficult every few years or so.
Powdercoating on the other hand, is very environmental friendly in comparison so if it was easy, everything that can fit in a curing oven would be powdercoated.
By whom?
If not by the powdercoaters who gave it a go, it's a surprise to me that they agreed to use unknown (to them) powder, a failure of a some sort is pretty much guaranteed.
It takes a lot of time (and powder) to dial all the parameters in, if and when a flawless result is required.
While they all look, well, a powderous substances, there's a lot of variations and it's usually discouraged to mix the powders.
It's been a while I last checked, but if a custom powder was required, it was ordered straight from the manufacturer and something along the lines of 1000Kg was the minimum order.
Sounds like either condensation droplets boiling, or something affecting the surface tension during the baking/curing.
The former would be a rookie mistake, so if this was a poll, my vote would go for the latter.
Marketing claims aside, there's actually no way to tell whether the finish is wet painted or powdercoated.
If anything, it's pretty safe to say that if a one-off or a very limited run has a smooth and shiny surface, it's most likely wet paint.
Reasonably smooth finish can be acchieved by powdercoating as well, but it takes a lot of skill, and a precisely tuned process.
Not to mention a lots of parts that are exactly the same (or similar enough), otherwise all the tuning (time and powder) has to be put in the price of that one-off job.
Regards,
Sam
Polychem/IFS Coatings. It is a custom color, not out of a book. Matching a vintage console. I sent them a panel and they did a great job with the color!
Ah this makes some sense to me. I am not well versed in what it takes to powder coat, no one has tried explaining how nuanced it can me, makes perfect sense, just didn't know! I have used a local place before with great luck for coating and printing, with excellent smooth finishes, but they have sadly changed ownership and dropped that service...
Polychem was able to get me a 5lb order of a custom color, not bad at all!!!
This likely seems to be my issue, I need true custom colors. The company that does it, will not coat, they just make powder. So my two strikeouts are likely my local shop, and Swift Screen Printing Inc (who did my screen) said they could do a better job, and they did! but probably need some experience with the powder for smoothness desired. Or maybe a wet paint is called for, idk.
I have one panel, was happy to pay for it. Unfortunately I would do 10 panels but I'd like to find someone that can do a great job before sending all panels. Might be trickier than I thought. I will ask the powder people for recommended coaters. Ironically the test sample they sent me from the powder house was excellent! My world is one offs or small runs, difficult in most ways to pull stuff off, usually not cheap!
I was very optimistic about your spot, but I'm afraid all the colors I need are custom, in no book. I bought an RAL sample swatch book, nothing close enough sadly. I can already get black and grey easily but I'm trying to branch out with custom colors. Thanks for the info though, looks good!
MidnightArrakis
Well-known member
[I can already get black and grey easily] -- Actually, and after re-reading my response I don't think that I was as clear as I needed to be, but.....that segment of my response was actually geared towards a variety of specifications that calls out different types of a "smooth" surface. Make sense???.....
[had two different places powder coat a panel] -- I know that your thread here is about "powder-coating", but.....you have never mentioned anything about what -- type -- of "panel" you are needing to be powder-coated. A rack-panel? A car-door panel? A side-panel to a wine-rack? A panel to your furnace? A rear-panel to your wife's make-up holder? Just what kind of a "panel"???.....
In any case and no matter what type of panel it may be.....whenever you may need another panel mechanically designed.....I'm here!!!
/
Our go-to local guy retired last fall... I am so bummed. He was one of those shops that was quality first. He did everything from military stuff (mostly Navy), to old lady's bench's as well. He let me work in the shop for an entire day working at each station, so I could understand the process. This allowed me to make parts better suited for powder coating, and made his job easier while allowing us to Create a cost effective, durable part. I am going to miss him.
S.Samuelsson
Active member
Hi.
Even the handheld variety has come down in price, and the accuracy has improved.
On the other hand, for someone who's not well versed with the basics of powder coating, it's really difficult to know which tricks apply to their particular case, and which don't.
And in the end, even the professionals have to "waste" some time and some powder if a new powder or a difficult shaped object comes to their booth.
Most won't bother with 'em though, great that You have one that does.
At least over here the powdercoaters used to sell small quantities of the powders they used, but it was often a hit and miss.
And limited to solid colours, primarily from the RAL-line, industrial coating was afterall the bulk of their job.
Some of the powders are hydroscopic as well, so it's important to keep them dry, or dry them before applying.
With wet paint the colour selection is virtually endless, the surface can usually be sanded/buffed/polished if mirror smoothness is required, and there's a lot more facilities to choose from who can do the work.
As a general rule, powdercoated piece on the other hand can't be sanded or buffed smooth, the colour isn't uniform below the surface.
They could also give the coaters You used more detailed instructions, especially if the chemistry of Your powder differs from the ones they're used to use.
.
It's after all mainly a sample of the colour and surface texture, since they sadly don't do powdercoating itself.
If You are so inclined and have a heat gun or a torch (You probably do), for gits and shiggles if for nothing else, You can try how simple at the very simplest powdercoating can be.
Take a piece of metal, heat it with the heat gun or a torch a bit, sprinkle some powder on it, and heat (from below) to melt the powder, done.
It probably won't look like much, but You'll get the basic idea.
DIYers like me use a household oven for smaller pieces, with something like that You can acchieve quite good results, even without a (cheap) powdercoating gun, with or without electrostatic attraction.
The powdercoating can also be "built up" for tool handles and such, by alternating between curing and stirring the tool to be coated in a bag or jar of powder.
For the best results, in the technical notes of Your powder there should be a mention about the preheat temperature, as well as the curing temperature and -duration.
Regards,
Sam
Thanks, they seem to be a highly professional company.
Nowadays it's quite easy (with the right tools) to find out any colour by using spectrometry.
Even the handheld variety has come down in price, and the accuracy has improved.
Sadly, things like that are often considered trade secrets that no one wants to share, so no wonder You didn't know.
On the other hand, for someone who's not well versed with the basics of powder coating, it's really difficult to know which tricks apply to their particular case, and which don't.
And in the end, even the professionals have to "waste" some time and some powder if a new powder or a difficult shaped object comes to their booth.
That has sadly been the trend for a few decades now in all sorts of trades, but fortunately DIYers have filled some of the voids, and there's usually some professional facilities left as well, even if they're a bit farther away.
That is truly great if You ask me, smaller quantities from professional suppliers are often lifesavers.
Most won't bother with 'em though, great that You have one that does.
At least over here the powdercoaters used to sell small quantities of the powders they used, but it was often a hit and miss.
And limited to solid colours, primarily from the RAL-line, industrial coating was afterall the bulk of their job.
Some of the powders are hydroscopic as well, so it's important to keep them dry, or dry them before applying.
With 5lbs, there's plenty to practise with, so that shouldn't be a problem.
Unless its absolutely necessary for a reason or another to use powdercoating, my vote would always go for wet paint for small runs or one-offs.
With wet paint the colour selection is virtually endless, the surface can usually be sanded/buffed/polished if mirror smoothness is required, and there's a lot more facilities to choose from who can do the work.
As a general rule, powdercoated piece on the other hand can't be sanded or buffed smooth, the colour isn't uniform below the surface.
Not that the modern durable wet paints are particularily easy to strip off if there's a blunder, but powdercoating really doesn't want to come off if one needs to have another go.
That's a good plan, IMO they have to have several go-to places, it doesn't make any sense if they don't.
They could also give the coaters You used more detailed instructions, especially if the chemistry of Your powder differs from the ones they're used to use.
I don't doubt that, but there's no way to tell how many they did before they chose that one to send to You
.It's after all mainly a sample of the colour and surface texture, since they sadly don't do powdercoating itself.
True, but at least to me the beauty lies in that very difficulty, and there's always a need for the people who can actually do one-offs or small runs for a reasonable price.
If You are so inclined and have a heat gun or a torch (You probably do), for gits and shiggles if for nothing else, You can try how simple at the very simplest powdercoating can be.
Take a piece of metal, heat it with the heat gun or a torch a bit, sprinkle some powder on it, and heat (from below
) to melt the powder, done.It probably won't look like much, but You'll get the basic idea.
DIYers like me use a household oven for smaller pieces, with something like that You can acchieve quite good results, even without a (cheap) powdercoating gun, with or without electrostatic attraction.
The powdercoating can also be "built up" for tool handles and such, by alternating between curing and stirring the tool to be coated in a bag or jar of powder.
For the best results, in the technical notes of Your powder there should be a mention about the preheat temperature, as well as the curing temperature and -duration.
Regards,
Sam
My Powder Coater just had me buy a quality brand of powder he trusted in whatever chemistry and color we wanted - saved me some money. There are a couple types and we found one type MUCH more durable after our testing.
