The Vaccine

[JohnRoberts]

In the news today I read about Walmart expanding in store COVID jabs to seven more states, already jabbing in their home state of Arkansas. Next will be GA, IN, LA, MD, NJ, SC, and TX... They will also help with distribution to pharmacies. They already do vaccination in their in store pharmacies, so this is a no brainer (doesn't do me any good yet). 

JR

PS: For another example of common sense finally being realized, several countries and vehicle makers are experimenting with using induction coils under roadways to charge EV while on the roads. The initial focus seems to be for large transports like buses and logically this makes more sense in densely populated cities, but eventually if we can eliminate heavy batteries from EV they will become more efficient means of transport.

 

[crazydoc]

The mRNA COVID-19 vaccine series consist of two doses administered intramuscularly:

    Pfizer-BioNTech (30 µg, 0.3 ml each): 3 weeks (21 days) apart
    Moderna (100 µg, 0.5 ml): 1 month (28 days) apart

Persons should not be scheduled to receive the second dose earlier than recommended (i.e., 3 weeks [Pfizer-BioNTech] or 1 month [Moderna]). However, second doses administered within a grace period of 4 days earlier than the recommended date for the second dose are still considered valid. Doses inadvertently administered earlier than the grace period should not be repeated.

The second dose should be administered as close to the recommended interval as possible. However, if it is not feasible to adhere to the recommended interval, the second dose of Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines may be scheduled for administration up to 6 weeks (42 days) after the first dose. There are currently limited data on efficacy of mRNA COVID-19 vaccines administered beyond this window. If the second dose is administered beyond these intervals, there is no need to restart the series.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/info-by-product/clinical-considerations.html

 

[JohnRoberts]

There is discussion about only using single jabs of the mRNA vaccines to get more of the population some protection quickly. I suspect the call for precision in timing, is because that is how it was tested. I saw one report (?) that a single dose of Pfizer/BioNTech provided 91% effectivity (that sounds higher than numbers touted for two jabs).

The J&J vaccine will be single dose but they still need to complete testing before submitting for emergency authorization.

JR

 

[Tubetec]

Both Pfizer and Moderna now seem to be back pedaling on the amounts of vaccine there able to deliver in Europe.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Both Pfizer and Moderna now seem to be back pedaling on the amounts of vaccine there able to deliver in Europe.

I saw the article a couple months ago but it seems that all the mRNA vaccines use a common ingredient only made by one small family owned business in Switzerland. That could explain supply disruptions, or not. 

JR

 

[KrIVIUM2323]

Pfizer ( and their lawyers) decided to limit the amount of 'bottles' as the lawyer discovered that by contract they commited to ship dose and not bottles,  and as some country discovered that a bottle could be divided in 6 doses rather than the official five one ( given you have dedicated gear and skills to extract the last dose without damage which doesn't seems to be an easy jobs even for trained personal): presto 20% gain.

Afaik this is the case for whole EU atm. I won't even think about what they'll impose to Africa or other third world country.

Take care of yourself.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Pretty interesting to see that these Rna vaccines have been in the works for a while

DARPA  awarded Pfizer a contract several years ago as it relates to this....Other big names as well...Sanofi ,Moderna .etc...

https://www.livescience.com/52150-humans-become-vaccine-factories.html

Messenger RNA vaccines have been in the works for a few decades, I think it was initially developed as an anti-cancer therapy. Then it was used against ebola in Africa, but that is not the cash cow that a world wide pandemic vaccine is.


JR 

 

[Tubetec]

Astra now seem to be hedging their bets as well .

 

[JohnRoberts]

Interesting... Bringing this to  people's attention would have been a positive to make people that much more confident in the seemingly speedy process. Maybe I just missed it somewhere along the way...
Their Super Soldier stuff is neat......

The gears turn slowly in the drug approval business and this new vaccine process is probably way more expensive than mature old school vaccine technology that has been operating at scale for decades.

If the COVID pandemic helps big Pharma scale up mRNA to make it cost effective for wider use this could be a boon for treating multiple obscure diseases, but one pandemic at a time.

JR

 

[JohnRoberts]

Merck just cancelled two COVID vaccine candidates reportedly because of inferior immune response compared to other vaccines already out there. I didn't see what the effectiveness was, but the existing vaccines hitting 80-90% set a high hurdle to beat.

JR

 

[crazydoc]

But it looks like this single dose is still in the running, maybe EUA in the next few weeks, and just needs refrigerator storage (2 to 8 degrees C).

Johnson & Johnson’s (J&J) JNJ-78436735 COVID-19 vaccine was shown to be 90% efficacious in interim results, according to findings published in the New England Journal of Medicine. The single dose investigational vaccine, which is being developed by the Janssen Pharmaceutical Companies of Johnson & Johnson, is more commonly referred to as the Ad26.COV2.S vaccine, and is a recombinant, replication-incompetent adenovirus serotype 26 (Ad26) vector encoding a full-length and stabilized SARS-CoV-2 spike (S) protein.

After a single dose vaccination, data showed neutralizing antibodies against COVID-19 were detected in over 90 percent of study participants at Day 29 and 100% of participants aged 18-55 years at Day 57. These neutralizing antibodies remained stable through Day 71, currently the latest timepoint available in this ongoing study, in all participants aged 18-55 years. The company plans to release data in participants 65 years and older in late January.

https://www.contagionlive.com/view/j-j-covid-19-vaccine-shows-90-efficacy-in-interim-data

 

[JohnRoberts]

But it looks like this single dose is still in the running, maybe EUA in the next few weeks, and just needs refrigerator storage (2 to 8 degrees C).

Johnson & Johnson’s (J&J) JNJ-78436735 COVID-19 vaccine was shown to be 90% efficacious in interim results, according to findings published in the New England Journal of Medicine. The single dose investigational vaccine, which is being developed by the Janssen Pharmaceutical Companies of Johnson & Johnson, is more commonly referred to as the Ad26.COV2.S vaccine, and is a recombinant, replication-incompetent adenovirus serotype 26 (Ad26) vector encoding a full-length and stabilized SARS-CoV-2 spike (S) protein.

After a single dose vaccination, data showed neutralizing antibodies against COVID-19 were detected in over 90 percent of study participants at Day 29 and 100% of participants aged 18-55 years at Day 57. These neutralizing antibodies remained stable through Day 71, currently the latest timepoint available in this ongoing study, in all participants aged 18-55 years. The company plans to release data in participants 65 years and older in late January.

https://www.contagionlive.com/view/j-j-covid-19-vaccine-shows-90-efficacy-in-interim-data

Yup, apparently doesn't require deep freeze either. J&J is still weeks away from emergency approval, but my state could use more vaccine sources.

The state web advice says to check back again mid-february, to see if more is received, and new appointment slots to get jabbed open up..

Reportedly J&J is still pursuing a new anti-viral medication.
====

I wonder if some of the hyperbolic news reports about vaccine sitting around in states unused, was vaccine held back for second jabs.

JR 

[update- wait for it... pretty soon moderna will pivot from saying that their Covid vaccine spanks all the sundry variants, to pimping their new improved booster shot that protects against variant XYZ... This is happening sooner than I expected. Caveat not literally happening yet, but watch this space. /update]

 

[ruffrecords]

Anybody here actually had a vaccine shot yet?

Cheers

Ian

 

[zebra50]

Anybody here actually had a vaccine shot yet?

My mum and great aunt were jabbed on Friday. They are 77 and 79 respectively, so maybe gives an indication of progress here in the UK.

 

[ruffrecords]

That's about what I expected. My neighbour who is 76 got his last week but his wife who is only 71 got hers too.

Cheers

Ian

 

[crazydoc]

LA County Fire Department COVID cases dramatically decrease after 75% get vaccinated

Currently available COVID-19 vaccines worked well in clinical trials, and now we're seeing evidence they're protecting people in the real world - even after one dose. The Los Angeles County Fire Department has seen a dramatic decrease in its COVID-19 positivity rate since firefighters started getting vaccinated during the last week of December.
Approximately 75% of the county’s firefighters, over 3000 people, have received their first dose of the vaccine. In December their COVID-19 positivity rate was 18%. It has dropped to 5.6%.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/la-county-fire-department-covid-cases-dramatically-decrease-after-75-get-vaccinated/ar-BB1d6ASL?ocid=bingcovid

 

[JohnRoberts]

LA County Fire Department COVID cases dramatically decrease after 75% get vaccinated

Currently available COVID-19 vaccines worked well in clinical trials, and now we're seeing evidence they're protecting people in the real world - even after one dose. The Los Angeles County Fire Department has seen a dramatic decrease in its COVID-19 positivity rate since firefighters started getting vaccinated during the last week of December.
Approximately 75% of the county’s firefighters, over 3000 people, have received their first dose of the vaccine. In December their COVID-19 positivity rate was 18%. It has dropped to 5.6%.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/la-county-fire-department-covid-cases-dramatically-decrease-after-75-get-vaccinated/ar-BB1d6ASL?ocid=bingcovid

I didn't see any mention of wether that 5.6% were vaccinated?

JR

 

[Script]

everyone needs two shots of either the Moderna or Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine for that 95% protection.

This might answer it.

 

[crazydoc]

I didn't see any mention of wether that 5.6% were vaccinated?

JR

Good question. But if 25% have not been vaccinated, it's possible most or all the positive tests were in that group. Then again, as Script mentions, you need 2 doses for full protection. and many have only had one dose.

I can't find any relevant data.

 

[JohnRoberts]

This might answer it.

Moderna did some testing of one shot effectiveness  and reportedly realized 80-90% which is pretty damn good.

The Sinovac (chinese covid vaccine) recently approved for use in brazil, delivers just over 50% effectiveness... (50.38%).

If we are operating in an apparent shortage of vaccine doses, it seems prudent to give twice as many people 80% effective protection. This seems like a no brainer, but moderna has not been formally tested as a one jab vaccine, so not authorized for use that way. The 80-90% result was from a single 2,000 person trial.

It has not been tested any other way than the two jab regimen 3-4 weeks apart so we have no idea if delaying the second jab until supply catches up would have an adverse impact. It is easy to imagine the benefit from vaccinating twice as many people with first jabs. 

JR

PS: Moderna is reportedly working on new vaccine variants better matched to new COVID strains.