scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #440 on: February 13, 2018, 09:51:36 AM »
John please do homework for me too...  ;)
You've blamed tands but doing in the same way.

Looks like it was being asked for ......... Not sure if it's the same as unrelenting linking so I wouldn't call it "doing it in the same way"???? That's just me though......

I'd like you to back up this claim, if you can, or if you can't back it up, explain why you made it?

I don't see a link, so I guess you were just making those reports up earlier? Link it. If you can't do that, .....

I remember we've discussed reliable sources of information.
CNN isn't really considered completely unreliable by some????

Do you want me spamming with links to RT, Sputnik, Russia24 etc?

I doubt anyone would ask for spamming but, it's your right to share your view . I for one like reading different views on topics. Especially current events.






ungifted

Re: economy
« Reply #441 on: February 13, 2018, 10:35:16 AM »
Ok. I'm trying to be objective as possible.
Does the link
https://edition.cnn.com/2017/04/13/middleeast/russia-unsc-syria-resolutions/index.html
is proving Assad poisoned his nation? No, I suppose.
Do US need UN resolution to start bombing anyone over the world? Again No. We've seen it. So we've heard John's opinion: US is worlds "shepherd".
Again. John says Russia is "messing with our elections among other things". I remember how it was discussed here, with links to CNN etc articles explainin "a man in the middle attack", etc etc. But again, no evidence. Is it so complex that we can get no evidence? Very secret reports no one ever seen?
No need to argue again. Opinions expressed. Everybody understands everything I think.
http://diy-tubes.com - parts for guitar/studio gear

scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #442 on: February 13, 2018, 11:10:14 AM »
I think JR said "reportedly"........ meaning "to me" , it's being reported or investigated and not a real fact yet......

Not sure about the election thing....It's nice to hear that it's not a supported theory though......


tands

Re: economy
« Reply #443 on: February 13, 2018, 09:01:37 PM »
I think JR said "reportedly"........ meaning "to me" , it's being reported or investigated and not a real fact yet......

Not sure about the election thing....It's nice to hear that it's not a supported theory though......


That's why I want a link, casually dropping 'reportedly this happened' is a cheap and easy way of lending credence to an opinion, or in this case a formulation.

Quote
Quote from: JohnRoberts

Does anybody think China or Russia will be better shepherds than us? Assad now sheltered under Putin's wing has reportedly used poison gas against his own citizens in Syria again


John is careful to say 'reportedly', but he uses these two false reports to claim we should be 'shepherds' (go to war to get what we want), when the possibility of assad launching the gas attack is essentially zero. If John were arguing honestly, he would tell you that, but he doesn't, and he doesn't link. If I hadn't demanded a link, he'd have succeded in getting x number of people to believe that assad gassed civilians once before, but because Obama chickened out, assad went ahead and did it again, recently. Thereby implying something (war) must be done or assad will continue doing it. These are his claims. They are false. Pay attention and you may notice other instances of this tactic.

Then he resists providing a link, claiming someone is asking him to do something woefully arduous, 'homework'. Oh no.  ::)

Fake news. Propaganda. Either that or he only read the headline and is just winging it from there. Which again is why I want a link for this kind of thing. He's talking about the US Govt killing people instead of americans having health care.
Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey

scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #444 on: February 13, 2018, 10:24:11 PM »
John is careful to say 'reportedly',

the possibility of assad launching the gas attack is essentially zero.

"Essentially" zero??? Sounds pretty careful..... Got a link?  This one doesn't make me feel like it's essentially zero.....

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/05/world/middleeast/syria-bashar-al-assad-atrocities-civilian-deaths-gas-attack.html


If I hadn't demanded a link, he'd have succeded in getting x number of people to believe


Well hopefully Y number of people can decide for themselves

(war) must be done or assad will continue doing it. These are his claims.

I must have missed where he said that.....

cheap and easy way of lending credence to an opinion, or in this case a formulation.

ROTFL.....
« Last Edit: February 13, 2018, 10:38:08 PM by scott2000 »

tands

Re: economy
« Reply #445 on: February 13, 2018, 11:18:28 PM »
Quit chopping my post into parts that omit my points if you want to pretend you're debating me.  ROTFL... ::)

"Essentially" zero??? Sounds pretty careful..... Got a link?  This one doesn't make me feel like it's essentially zero.....

Assad has held onto power against all odds for decades, thus he is not dumb.

Gassing civilians is the best excuse the US could dream up to attack him, a war he would not survive.

Since he's not dumb, he didn't do it. Either time.

It was those trying to get him out of power, to provide the US govt with an excuse, so we would attack assad for them.

What does that make you 'feel like'?



I must have missed where he said that.....

Looks like you'll have to start paying better attention.
Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey

scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #446 on: February 13, 2018, 11:24:43 PM »
More 'reports'. No proof then?
Assad has held onto power against all odds for decades, thus he is not dumb.
Gassing civilians is the best excuse the US could dream up to attack him.


And there's proof to this claim?

Since he's not dumb, he didn't do it. Either time.

Never mind.... found it....

Gassing civilians is the best excuse the US could dream up to attack him, a war he would not survive.

It was those trying to get him out of power, to provide the US govt with an excuse, so we would attack assad for them.
What does that make you 'feel like'?

Not good....But isn't that what this is all about anyway???

This reminds me of trying to share my opinion on the Venezuelan situation. I have first hand encounters with many many many Venezuelans who have left their country because of the horrible conditions there. I make it a point to ask them what's going on there and it's not pretty. Some would argue that it's just an excuse for war and, although I can't say I know what the outcomes are or the intentions of some, I definitely can't stand there and ignore the fact that real human beings are actually talking to me face to face and telling me stories that are real. Unless it's some deep operation to convince the minds of all Floridians to support the Government's decision to help.......hmmmm

It really makes me think about what "proof" really means . I guess I'll just trust the one in my alcohol from now on..... :P
« Last Edit: February 14, 2018, 02:56:59 AM by scott2000 »

tands

Re: economy
« Reply #447 on: February 13, 2018, 11:55:35 PM »
How nice for you.
Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey

JohnRoberts

Re: economy
« Reply #448 on: February 14, 2018, 10:49:53 AM »

This reminds me of trying to share my opinion on the Venezuelan situation. I have first hand encounters with many many many Venezuelans who have left their country because of the horrible conditions there. I make it a point to ask them what's going on there and it's not pretty. Some would argue that it's just an excuse for war and, although I can't say I know what the outcomes are or the intentions of some, I definitely can't stand there and ignore the fact that real human beings are actually talking to me face to face and telling me stories that are real. Unless it's some deep operation to convince the minds of all Floridians to support the Government's decision to help.......hmmmm
Venezuela has been on a path to totalitarianism for years, first under Chavez (with the help of Castro) and continued by his hand picked replacement Maduro.

They have been living off the fat from the local oil resources but first took a hit from the international drop in oil prices. The second hit is from mismanagement of the oil infrastructure they inherited (stole) from western oil companies. 

Right now it is a test to see if Maduro can maintain control as oil based dollar flow continues to decline, and oil output declines. Venzella is actually shipping less oil than their OPEC quota, because their oil infrastructure is in disrepair and getting worse due to under investment in basic maintenance.

This is hard to watch. One high profile opposition leader was recently killed by a police raid, while Maduro has armed some political supporters while not allowing regular citizen to have weapons. Maduro uses a cadre of Cuban operatives embedded in his security forces to help monitor and control opposition.

Maduro is slowly and methodically dismantling what is left of their democracy (he controls the judiciary and used them to thwart what's left of the legislature).

Venzella used to be one of the more wealthy SA countries thanks to the oil wealth, now it is impoverished, with citizens barely getting adequate food and medicine.  The exodus to FL is not a completely new thing. Young people with the ability to leave did years ago. Desperation in Venzella is probably increasing over recent years, so flow may be increasing to.   
Quote
It really makes me think about what "proof" really means . I guess I'll just trust the one in my alcohol from now on..... :P
I wouldn't expect to find a lot of truth on the WWW.  What passes for proof is pretty flexible, people are more willing to believe memes that agree with their preconceived notions.

Some think youtube is absolute truth, while others don't believe we landed on the moon. YMMV   ;D ;D ;D

JR
John Roberts
http://circularscience.com
Tune it, or don't play it...

tands

Re: economy
« Reply #449 on: February 14, 2018, 07:18:29 PM »

Venzella used to be one of the more wealthy SA countries thanks to the oil wealth, now it is impoverished, with citizens barely getting adequate food and medicine.  The exodus to FL is not a completely new thing. Young people with the ability to leave did years ago. Desperation in Venzella is probably increasing over recent years, so flow may be increasing to.   I wouldn't expect to find a lot of truth on the WWW.  What passes for proof is pretty flexible, people are more willing to believe memes that agree with their preconceived notions.

 I don't believe anything you say JR. Not a word.

Quote
Earlier this year, the United Nations Program for Development placed Venezuela among the countries with the highest Human Development Index, surpassing most Latin American countries. Since 2013, Venezuela has also decreased infant mortality rates, heart disease HIV/AIDS rates, according to the World Health Organization.

Quote
Venezuela currently has the second lowest rate of homelessness in Latin America, with only 6.68 percent of its population being unhoused, Habitat for Humanity reports. At 5.6 percent, Peru has the lowest rate of homelessness in the region.

Quote
Maduro’s progressive education policies have made Venezuela rank sixth in the world in terms of enrollment in primary education and has increased its coverage of secondary education to 73 percent of the population. His policies have also made Venezuela a country with the highest literacy rates in Latin America, with 95.4 percent of the population knowing how to read and write, the U.N. reports.

https://www.telesurtv.net/english/analysis/4-Gains-Maduros-Venezuela-Made-That-Mainstream-Media-Ignores-20170413-0026.html



Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey


scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #450 on: February 14, 2018, 09:32:32 PM »
I don't believe anything you say JR. Not a word.

https://www.telesurtv.net/english/analysis/4-Gains-Maduros-Venezuela-Made-That-Mainstream-Media-Ignores-20170413-0026.html




I agree the Venezuelan people I have met are very educated .

To see teachers,accountants,dentists,attorneys etc coming here to take jobs less desirable so they can eat or buy anything they need to survive is unfortunate.
Of course they can wait in line for hours there to get some eggs or bread and hope there is any when they get to the front of the line. But they can always buy things on the black market there which seems to be the most common way. Not a lot you can do with money if there isn't anything to buy.

The bolivar there is equal to .00004 US dollars.......

You need a bucket of money to buy a hot dog there.....If you can even get money.......

Nice source for your link....lol

Telesur (stylised as teleSUR) is a multi-State funded, pan–Latin American terrestrial and satellite television network sponsored by the governments of Venezuela, Cuba, Ecuador, Nicaragua, Uruguay, and Bolivia that is headquartered in Caracas, Venezuela.



 




tands

Re: economy
« Reply #451 on: February 14, 2018, 10:46:25 PM »
You just stated that you are unable to determine what is true unless you're drinking. Now you're implying telesur isn't credible, but your expats are. How do you know?

ROTFL... :o

In any case, none of this rises to a level that I think their government needs to be overthrown and their country and people destroyed by civil war, so we can pick over their carcasses and steal their oil. I'd rather have single payer health care and leave them to their own business.

https://twitter.com/search?q=%23nancypezombie&src=typd

This reminds me of trying to share my opinion on the Venezuelan situation. I have first hand encounters with many many many Venezuelans who have left their country because of the horrible conditions there. I make it a point to ask them what's going on there and it's not pretty. Some would argue that it's just an excuse for war and, although I can't say I know what the outcomes are or the intentions of some, I definitely can't stand there and ignore the fact that real human beings are actually talking to me face to face and telling me stories that are real. Unless it's some deep operation to convince the minds of all Floridians to support the Government's decision to help.......hmmmm

It really makes me think about what "proof" really means . I guess I'll just trust the one in my alcohol from now on..... :P
Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey

scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #452 on: February 15, 2018, 03:43:21 AM »
You just stated that you are unable to determine what is true unless you're drinking. Now you're implying telesur isn't credible, but your expats are. How do you know?

ROTFL... :o



Wow. I was jokingly implying that the definition of proof has been diluted so much that the only definition of proof I trust is the one in my alcohol.     

You'll get it.. Unless you did get it and you felt like being offensive yet again.


 
Quit chopping my post into parts that omit my points if you want to pretend you're debating me.  ROTFL... ::)

Assad has held onto power against all odds for decades, thus he is not dumb.

Gassing civilians is the best excuse the US could dream up to attack him, a war he would not survive.

Since he's not dumb, he didn't do it. Either time.

It was those trying to get him out of power, to provide the US govt with an excuse, so we would attack assad for them.

What does that make you 'feel like'?



Looks like you'll have to start paying better attention.


So is it the US dreaming up excuses or is it those trying to get Assad out of power to give the US an excuse????........




and regarding the telesur being controlled by the Venezuelan government. I think it qualifies for speculation that there may be some bias involved in the reporting.......Ever watch Fox news vs?......






« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 05:01:52 AM by scott2000 »

tands

Re: economy
« Reply #453 on: February 15, 2018, 05:37:37 AM »
I thought you were referring to this-

Quote
In vino veritas is a Latin phrase that means "in wine, truth", suggesting a person under the influence of alcohol is more likely to speak their hidden thoughts and desires.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_vino_veritas

So is it the US dreaming up excuses or is it those trying to get Assad out of power to give the US an excuse????........



It's possible some cooperation is happening between the US Govt and the rebels to coordinate the false flags. If so, that would mean someone over here is greenlighting poison gas attacks on Syrian civilians to make a US attack on assad politically feasible.
Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey

scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #454 on: February 15, 2018, 09:38:11 AM »
I thought you were referring to this-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/In_vino_veritas

Why? Because your search bot came up with that? I think it needs a patch.....

]It's possible some cooperation is happening between the US Govt and the rebels to coordinate the false flags.[/b] If so, that would mean

someone over here is greenlighting poison gas attacks on Syrian civilians to make a US attack [/color]on assad politically feasible.

Quit chopping my post into parts that omit my points if you want to pretend you're debating me.  ROTFL... ::)

Assad has held onto power against all odds for decades, thus he is not dumb.

Gassing civilians is the best excuse the US could dream up to attack him, a war[/u] he would not survive.

Since he's not dumb, he didn't do it. Either time.

It was those trying to get him out of power, to provide the US govt with an excuse, so we would attack assad for them.

What does that make you 'feel like'?



Looks like you'll have to start paying better attention.



Well, that's 3....even 4 scenarios...... pretty much covers it... At least you seem to believe that the gassing is a possibility..just have to decide who's doing it I suppose..... because it's essentially zero chance that it's actually Assad....  ::)

... I was worried because you don't seem to believe the Venezuelan people I've talked to describing the conditions over there (I'm sure that's our doing too).........


seriously, get an update or patch .......



« Last Edit: February 16, 2018, 05:49:18 AM by scott2000 »

tands

Re: economy
« Reply #455 on: February 15, 2018, 05:11:55 PM »
 You're attempting the Chewbacca defense?

Quote

A Chewbacca defense is the name in the United States given to a legal strategy in which the aim of the argument seems to be to deliberately confuse the jury rather than to factually refute the case of the other side.

...

Cochran
    ...ladies and gentlemen of this supposed jury, I have one final thing I want you to consider. Ladies and gentlemen, this is Chewbacca. Chewbacca is a Wookiee from the planet Kashyyyk. But Chewbacca lives on the planet Endor. Now think about it; that does not make sense!

Gerald Broflovski
    Damn it! ... He's using the Chewbacca defense!

Cochran
 Why would a Wookiee, an 8-foot-tall Wookiee, want to live on Endor, with a bunch of 2-foot-tall Ewoks? That does not make sense! But more important, you have to ask yourself: What does this have to do with this case? Nothing. Ladies and gentlemen, it has nothing to do with this case! It does not make sense! Look at me. I'm a lawyer defending a major record company, and I'm talkin' about Chewbacca! Does that make sense? Ladies and gentlemen, I am not making any sense! None of this makes sense! And so you have to remember, when you're in that jury room deliberatin' and conjugatin' the Emancipation Proclamation, does it make sense? No! Ladies and gentlemen of this supposed jury, it does not make sense! If Chewbacca lives on Endor, you must acquit! The defense rests.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chewbacca_defense

ROTFL... :o.

.

« Last Edit: February 15, 2018, 05:19:30 PM by tands »
Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey

tands

Re: economy
« Reply #456 on: February 15, 2018, 05:12:32 PM »
 
Quote
Assad has held onto power against all odds for decades, thus he is not dumb. Gassing civilians is the best excuse the US could dream up to attack him, a war he would not survive. Since he's not dumb, he didn't do it. Either time.

It was those trying to get him out of power, to provide the US govt with an excuse, so we would attack assad for them.

...

It's possible some cooperation is happening between the US Govt and the rebels to coordinate the false flags. If so, that would mean someone over here is greenlighting poison gas attacks on Syrian civilians to make a US attack on assad politically feasible.
Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey

scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #457 on: February 15, 2018, 06:14:28 PM »

 ;)






tands

Re: economy
« Reply #458 on: February 15, 2018, 11:01:05 PM »
Feel free to try again anytime.

ROTFL...  ;D
Robinson Crusoe Romeo and Juliet the Odyssey

scott2000

Re: economy
« Reply #459 on: February 15, 2018, 11:53:06 PM »
It's possible ;)