Another CK12 Thread - what's available in 2023?

[mrgrooves666]

Deep.

Pardon, what is that?

 

[Roxxy]

I've had no complaints about my customer service and always oblige customers who want customized tuning of my Ck12. I think if people understood how much attention to detail and how time consuming it is to make a great Ck12 there would be less of this race to the bottom mentality.

I bought one from you and it sounds fantastic. Also doing business with you has been a pleasure. No bad service at all

 

[OPR]

Pardon, what is that?

How deep is your love is your love is your love

I bought one from you and it sounds fantastic. Also doing business with you has been a pleasure. No bad service at all

Thanks Roxy!

 

[Екатерина]

I don't know if it's my imagination, but I always feel that the copper plates under the CT12 film are all through holes, so CT12 relies on its internal structure for damping???

 

[OPR]

There are lots of quality CK12 capsules out there now including those made by members here. Off the top of my head there is MBHO, Josephson, Telefunken, Beesneez, OPR, Upton, Heiserman, FLEA, my own and there will be a few more in the next 6 months I am positive of. I appreciate the kind words but the real differences now are our personal aesthetics so there are slight variations between our signature sounds or builds. I realize that some of these are not always available but as more and more companies make them they will become easier to get.

Sorry to hear you're injured Tim! Hope you heal fast!
And thanks for spreading the love.

Tim is correct in that there will be aesthetic differences in the way each company chooses to tune it's Ck12. This is likely due to the wide variation in original Ck12 production that people have such different experiences with the variants they've come in to contact with. ie different mechanical tuning of the back-plates to wide variations in diaphragm resonance. I've had a professional customer ask me to tune my ck12 into very dark territories in order to match an uber dark OG 251 that they were trying to emulate, which is what they felt was the real "251 sound"( which BTW did sound amazing on electric guitar) but... Not so great for other purposes as well as very having poor rear rejection, which was infact a big part of that particular "real 251's" sound. So basically what I'm saying is that if you have a particular sonic preferece work with someone you can comunicate back and forth with with that will allow revisions to get the sound you want. No point saving $100.00 and not being entirly happy that'd be false ecomony...

 

[Tim Campbell]

I don't know if it's my imagination, but I always feel that the copper plates under the CT12 film are all through holes, so CT12 relies on its internal structure for damping???

It is your imagination. The reason you see this backplate at all is that older AKG's backplates oxidized and so became non reflective but new capsule's backplates reflect light and so it appears that the gold deposit is thinner. I use the same delay network as original AKG CK12s.

 

[Екатерина]

It is your imagination. The reason you see this backplate at all is that older AKG's backplates oxidized and so became non reflective but new capsule's backplates reflect light and so it appears that the gold deposit is thinner. I use the same delay network as original AKG CK12s.

Oh, Tim actually replied to me, it's a bit surprising. I heard that you've been injured recently and I'm worried about your health. I didn't question your intentions, I was just curious about the structure of CT12. Compared to K47 K67 M7, CT12 is more mysterious

 

[GeorgeToledo]

AKG was dropping a glass bead on the diaphragms to check diaphragm resonance. Were they just going “ah, totally different from the last one, wonderful, box it up?”. Seems a little doubtful, no?

Were they really making capsules with a wide spread of tension within a given period of capsule subtype, or have they settled in that way over the years?

 

[Whoops]

Off the top of my head there is MBHO, Josephson, Telefunken, Beesneez, OPR, Upton, Heiserman, FLEA, my own and there will be a few more in the next 6 months I am positive of.

Hi Tim, I was talking about the scarcity in getting capsules for DIY builders, in the context of this forum and this thread.
Almost all the companies you mention don't sell their capsules to the public.

And the tiny exceptions that do sell to the public, don't have your knowledge, your many years of experience and dedication and the consistency of your capsule. Also they are very overpriced for the product they offer.

If you don't agree with me please let me know which capsule is available for the public where the builder has more or the same knowledge, experience and dedication invested as yourself?
If there is someone selling capsules for DIY that you feel is better than you please share it with us

I realize that some of these are not always available but as more and more companies make them they will become easier to get.

The biggest difference as far as I can see in the near future will be 3U Audio,
Guonsheng has many years of experience in making capsules, he is really dedicated to his craft and will not release a product that is not really well made and though after. When it comes to capsules it's important to separate salesman with curiosity in capsules from true capsule builders with passion.

Maybe Soliloqueen from Arienne Audio will develop a CK12 capsule in the future, with the passion involved that would also be a great capsule for sure.

Thanks Tim

 

[OneRoomStudio]

Hi Tim, I was talking about the scarcity in getting capsules for DIY builders, in the context of this forum and this thread.
Almost all the companies you mention don't sell their capsules to the public.

And the tiny exceptions that do sell to the public, don't have your knowledge, your many years of experience and dedication and the consistency of your capsule. Also they are very overpriced for the product they offer.

If you don't agree with me please let me know which capsule is available for the public where the builder has more or the same knowledge, experience and dedication invested as yourself?
If there is someone selling capsules for DIY that you feel is better than you please share it with us



The biggest difference as far as I can see in the near future will be 3U Audio,
Guonsheng has many years of experience in making capsules, he is really dedicated to his craft and will not release a product that is not really well made and though after. When it comes to capsules it's important to separate salesman with curiosity in capsules from true capsule builders with passion.

Maybe Soliloqueen from Arienne Audio will develop a CK12 capsule in the future, with the passion involved that would also be a great capsule for sure.

Thanks Tim

I think Ben (BeesNeez) has been making capsules at least as long as Guosheng, and both he and @OPR have many happy customers that sing their praises. I’m excited for the prospects of a 3U CK12, but with the prices that @OPR is offering here, his capsules are much more inline with what the forthcoming 3U will likely be sold for.

Also, while I respect and appreciate Guosheng, he’s been saying he has CK12 in the works for at least three years now, with no sign of it on the near horizon.

 

[Mikael-ange]

I don't own any Tim or Ben ck12, but I can tell I love my OPR ck12.
I used some mic with Tim ck12 on it during session, but no direct a/b with the OPR one. But both sound like what I think a ck12 sound like imho.

 

[HerbertR]

I can't stress enough that the three CK12 capsules currently available to the public really do give you world-class sound quality that doesn't need to shy away from comparison with any original AKG capsule. And anyone who says otherwise should please test it. The OPR is a really perfect hammer capsule and in my opinion very similar to the slightly "straighter" Haun, a bit warmer and more flattering than Haun, but the Haun sounds a bit more correct and can be used in more different ways imo. The Beesneez Alu is a bit brighter and creates a kind of 3D image even more clearly than the other two capsules. The bass on the Beesneez is also a bit tighter, denser than the other two available and the signals come through a bit more easily during the mixdown. The OPR, on the other hand, has that strong, silky "We are the world" ala Herold Faltinger touch, and is really classy on vocals....
I've had good experiences with all the manufacturers available. Beesneez (with his super nice and pretty wife) dipped me a CK12 without any problems, which had not survived the "trans-indic" Ocean journey from Australia to the EU so well. OPR is very quick to respond to inquiries, and the lady from Haun in sales was also communicative and offered me a capsule without a "housing" without any problems, but it was a bit more expensive than from the two Australian colleagues. I never got an answer from Josephson, Lawson... That's fine too, if they don't need it.
And yes, Arienne might also be up to something with a CK12 or Collaboration. But ask her yourself.....

 

[Delta Sigma]

I have two CT12s in a C12 pair and they sound incredible and are quite versatile.

I had a gold Beesneez CK12 (circa 2014) in an ElaM 251 that had an issue with being overly bright (still sounded great with a filter). I sent Ben sound samples and he said that they've learned a lot since 2014 and sent me a replacement (that's impressive customer service). He gave me the choice between gold & aluminum and I had to try aluminum. The BN alu CK12 is the most "3D" capsule I've ever heard and the way it captures low end is jaw dropping. It's sibilance can be a little harsh sounding at times. Maybe just a little less forgiving on a bad vocalist (me) than the gold BN CK12 or the CT12s.

I'm very excitedly planning to purchase an OPR (@OPR I emailed you with some questions). I think, for me, the OPR CK12 might be the ElaM 251 capsule of choice, though I'll have to do some tests when I actually get it. If the OPR CK12 sounds as good in the 251 as I imagine (based on samples I've heard), I have plans to build a new mic around that aluminum Beesneez CK12.

Bottom line is, my experience so far is similar to @HerbertR and these capsules all sound fantastic, but different. Both my Beesneez and Tim Campbell capsules make it hard to love K47/K67 based mics!

 

[Whoops]

I think Ben (BeesNeez) has been making capsules at least as long as Guosheng,

Guosheng started working in microphones and capsules after he finished his degree in 1983.
He has 41 years of experience.
If Ben was already born in 1983 he was still wearing diapers.

This doesn't mean in no way that Ben doesn't make good products, as far as I can see he is very passionate about what he does and I'm sure he gives the best for his products.

But we have to set the record straight and get the facts right,
Guosheng is one of the most experienced people in the capsule business in the world at the present.

I’m excited for the prospects of a 3U CK12, but with the prices that @OPR is offering here, his capsules are much more inline with what the forthcoming 3U will likely be sold for.

The prices you are talking about which I supose is $343.63, it's for a minimum order of 50 units.
That price is not inline at all with a forthcoming 3U Audio CK12 which will be sold for around $240 for an order of 1 unit.

So it's not equivalent or inline at all

Also, while I respect and appreciate Guosheng, he’s been saying he has CK12 in the works for at least three years now, with no sign of it on the near horizon.

To do it right it takes time, I'm sure Tim also took a long time until he was able to make a capsule that he completely satisfied with the result.
Better to take longer and do it properly than rushing up releasing a product that was still not high standard.
If it takes 3 years for Guosheng to make it right then we know that once he is happy the capsule he releases will be really good.

 

[kingkorg]

I think Ben (BeesNeez) has been making capsules at least as long as Guosheng, and both he and @OPR have many happy customers that sing their praises. I’m excited for the prospects of a 3U CK12, but with the prices that @OPR is offering here, his capsules are much more inline with what the forthcoming 3U will likely be sold for.

Also, while I respect and appreciate Guosheng, he’s been saying he has CK12 in the works for at least three years now, with no sign of it on the near horizon.

Guosheng has never publicly announced CK12. The word got out on the web, and people started pushing him, and contacting via email about the release date.

Guosheng is a serious scientist with full understanding behind the capsule technology, science, design... He knows pretty much everything there is to know about them. And he is up there in his age.

I don't want to comment on Beesneez products beyond what i have already written on the forum.

Guosheng is not active on forums, and doesn't snoop around and go full mayhem every time someone criticizes his products.

 

[ZHOUJUN]

Guosheng started working in microphones and capsules after he finished his degree in 1983.
He has 41 years of experience.
If Ben was already born in 1983 he was still wearing diapers.

This doesn't mean in no way that Ben doesn't make good products, as far as I can see he is very passionate about what he does and I'm sure he gives the best for his products.

But we have to set the record straight and get the facts right,
Guosheng is one of the most experienced people in the capsule business in the world at the present.



The prices you are talking about which I supose is $343.63, it's for a minimum order of 50 units.
That price is not inline at all with a forthcoming 3U Audio CK12 which will be sold for around $240 for an order of 1 unit.

So it's not equivalent or inline at all



To do it right it takes time, I'm sure Tim also took a long time until he was able to make a capsule that he completely satisfied with the result.
Better to take longer and do it properly than rushing up releasing a product that was still not high standard.
If it takes 3 years for Guosheng to make it right then we know that once he is happy the capsule he releases will be really good.

Guosheng started developing capsules in the 1980s and published many papers on microphones more than 20 years ago.

 

[OPR]

AKG was dropping a glass bead on the diaphragms to check diaphragm resonance. Were they just going “ah, totally different from the last one, wonderful, box it up?”. Seems a little doubtful, no?

Were they really making capsules with a wide spread of tension within a given period of capsule subtype, or have they settled in that way over the years?

Most likely it's a combination of both.
I've restored several that had wildy different front to back diaphragm resonance and chaimber tuning ,especially older models. But yes it would also be the effects of time heat and cold exposure, abuse etc.
In the end this is what people listen to, 60 plus years on, which can lead to different perceptions of how CK12 should sound.

 

[Tim Campbell]

I currently have 14 original AKG CK12's for comparisons in my collection as well as working on many AKG CK12s for clients over the course of every year. None of them sound exactly the same and really cover a spectrum from dark to bright. All of us as manufacturers decide which variant we enjoy most or think is most useful and that accounts for differences in sound with our products. The first examples of CK12 type capsules I posted here was in 2004 on the old forum but as OPR says I initially wasn't interested in being a manufacturer and only pursued it because it was interesting.
I was supposed to be with Guosheng at his factory in November but because of my injury postponed it until next year.

As I mentioned there are other manufacturers that will be producing this capsule shortly. There won't be a shortage but also as others have mentioned why race to the bottom. If you want a bad, cheap CK12 "type" capsule there are many on offer now.