Auratone DIY

[Zebra_PD]

Hi.
Am about to embark on the journey to build a couple of Auratone clones myself.

The hardest task seems to find a suitable driver nowdays....

I have found a driver I would like some swing by the group before I place an order.

It is a replacement clone for the Pioneer A11EC80-02F that someone on gearslutz suggested was one of the original speakers used over the years by Auratone.

Impedance 8 ohms
Sensitivity 91 dB 1W/1m
Frequency Response 100 to 10,000 Hz
Voice Coil Diameter 1"
DC Resistance (Re) 8.11 ohms
Voice Coil Inductance (Le) 0.71 mH
Resonant Frequency (Fs) 100 Hz
Mechanical Q (Qms) 5.14
Electromagnetic Q (Qes) 0.98
Total Q (Qts) 0.82

https://www.soundimports.eu/en/grs-4fr-8.html

The thing is that it's not magnetic shielded. But will that in any way alter the sound?  Or is that only done to not interfere with old broadcast equipment/monitors?

 

[btyreman]

I know this speaker is a good one and still available:

https://impactaudio.co.uk/products/visaton-fr-12-4-ohm-13-cm-5inch-fullrange-speaker-system

maybe that helps?

 

[DaveP]

Look at post 1, I gave the volume there!

DaveP

 

[abbey road d enfer]

The thing is that it's not magnetic shielded. But will that in any way alter the sound?  Or is that only done to not interfere with old broadcast equipment/monitors?

Does it really matter? Magnetic flux escaping the loudspeaker used to be a concern with CRT's, where it would twist the image and shift the colours, but today, flat screens are impervious to that.
The only type of audio equipment it would interfere with is tape/cassette recorders, only if you were silly enough to place the speakers right on the heads or tapes.

 

[Zebra_PD]

I know this speaker is a good one and still available:

https://impactaudio.co.uk/products/visaton-fr-12-4-ohm-13-cm-5inch-fullrange-speaker-system

maybe that helps?

Thanks! Appreciate it a lot! Will check that driver out as well!

This might been talked about earlier in the thread but was the dimensions of the originals changed internally to compensate for different drivers used and/or if any electronic filters was implemented in the design?

Someone in a Swedish hDIY forum suggested to me that the Altec 405-8H was another driver used by Auratone back in the days. Looking at the specs of those would u consider it to be plausible? 

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Someone in a Swedish hDIY forum suggested to me that the Altec 405-8H was another driver used by Auratone back in the days. Looking at the specs of those would u consider it to be plausible?

The only useful info in this document is the mounting diameter! Only the Thiele-Small parameters could indicate suitability for using in an Auratone-type enclosure.

 

[moamps]

The only useful info in this document is the mounting diameter! Only the Thiele-Small parameters could indicate suitability for using in an Auratone-type enclosure.

What are the optimal values of these parameters for this enclosure (closed box, 1-2 l effective volume)? I never saw published TS parameters of original Auratone driver.
Also, I was under impression that the low frequency response isn't so important as mid to mid-high peak in upper band and smooth  fall at high (minimal cone breakups).

 

[Zebra_PD]

The only useful info in this document is the mounting diameter! Only the Thiele-Small parameters could indicate suitability for using in an Auratone-type enclosure.

Here are some more specs

http://alteclansingunofficial.nlenet.net/Thiele-Small.html

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Here are some more specs

http://alteclansingunofficial.nlenet.net/Thiele-Small.html

Well, it indicates that it would be acceptable in a 2.23l closed box. However, it does not ensure it sounds like an Auratone.
I was the distributor for Auratone in the 80's and 90's, and our service dept replaced a lot of Auratone drivers. They were very ordinary, cheap. I doubt Auratone ever used Altec speakers, the price point would be inadequate.
BTW, the Visaton FR12 advocated by btyreman is rejected by my speaker design software for use in a closed box!

 

[DaveP]

The whole point of using Auratones was not to get perfect HiFi, but to hear what your mix might sound like from recordplayers, radios and other low-end consumer electronics.  There is a balance with this type of speaker so it sounds most natural when it cuts off at about 100Hz and 10KHz.  They are not small cheap monitors, you mix with your normal gear then check it out on the Auratones to see if it still sounds reasonably balanced on lesser speakers.  The other benefit is that it allows you to hear  the mid-range better by removing the top and bottom end.

DaveP

 

[btyreman]

Well, it indicates that it would be acceptable in a 2.23l closed box. However, it does not ensure it sounds like an Auratone.
I was the distributor for Auratone in the 80's and 90's, and our service dept replaced a lot of Auratone drivers. They were very ordinary, cheap. I doubt Auratone ever used Altec speakers, the price point would be inadequate.
BTW, the Visaton FR12 advocated by btyreman is rejected by my speaker design software for use in a closed box!

if you look there's at least one example on here of somebody using the  same speaker, it will definitely work regardless of what the software says, it was also the speaker used by the chap who created littlepapercones which was a nice sounding solid wood alternative to the auratone, here's a link to a review of it from soundonsound, I think there must be an 8 ohm version but it looks like the same speaker to me. https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/littlepapercones-single-driver

p.s I am not saying you are wrong either, but the speaker must sound alright, sound on sound give it high praise indeed.

 

[abbey road d enfer]

if you look there's at least one example on here of somebody using the  same speaker, it will definitely work regardless of what the software says, it was also the speaker used by the chap who created littlepapercones which was a nice sounding solid wood alternative to the auratone, here's a link to a review of it from soundonsound, I think there must be an 8 ohm version but it looks like the same speaker to me. https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/littlepapercones-single-driver

p.s I am not saying you are wrong either, but the speaker must sound alright, sound on sound give it high praise indeed.

I didn't say it can't work. Any speaker in any box "works". I just noticed the software said I was "off limits". Of course a software has no ears. 

 

[TomS]

Hey,

I was wondering what drivers are suggested as a replacement I've read about quite a lot of drivers in this forum but honestly I don't know which one to choose since the Maplin one is a no go.
I've read about the Visaton FR12 which is easily available here in the Netherlands, also the Monacor SP-4/60PRO is there any other driver that's confirmed to be great for use as an Auratone driver? Or which one of the two I mentioned is better? As a student, I'm on a bit of a tight budget so yeah I thought these Auratones would be a great B set next to my Genelecs.

Edit: I've also read about the Visaton WS 13 E could anyone give me an opinion on that too?

Another edit: I found out the little paper cones use Visaton FR12's so I'm leaning towards that because people seem to be quite happy with those speakers.

Thanks in advance everyone!

Greetings,

Tom

 

[Rob Flinn]

Hey,

I was wondering what drivers are suggested as a replacement I've read about quite a lot of drivers in this forum but honestly I don't know which one to choose since the Maplin one is a no go.
I've read about the Visaton FR12 which is easily available here in the Netherlands, also the Monacor SP-4/60PRO is there any other driver that's confirmed to be great for use as an Auratone driver? Or which one of the two I mentioned is better? As a student, I'm on a bit of a tight budget so yeah I thought these Auratones would be a great B set next to my Genelecs.

Edit: I've also read about the Visaton WS 13 E could anyone give me an opinion on that too?

Another edit: I found out the little paper cones use Visaton FR12's so I'm leaning towards that because people seem to be quite happy with those speakers.

Thanks in advance everyone!

Greetings,

Tom

The WS 13E appears to have a higher power rating, which might be useful to consider.

 

[rp]

Are you replacing drivers in an existing cabinet, or building from scratch?

Looking at the Visatons, the WS13e looks like the more appealing of the two. The FR12 has that big midrange dip in the frequency response, and high Qts of 1.87.

I've looked into building some auratone-style speakers and the driver I thought looked interesting was the Seas MCA12RC. It would require a box a little bigger than the classic auratone. It's not the most budget-conscious choice, but also not crazy expensive. The 4" and 5" Faital woofers seem interesting too.

I've never gotten around to realizing the project, as I already have a pair of original auratones. I took out the woofers at one point to see what they were, but I couldn't find enough information to get anywhere. They had larger magnets/motors than I was expecting.

Take these comments/suggestions with a grain of salt, my speaker-building experience is limited.

 

[TomS]

Yeah, I did see that dip too was questioning that. But maybe then the Monacor is the best option for this build since it seems to be really linear from 200hz to 5k with a boost at 6k of 10db which is quite a lot. But apart from that, it seems quite flat. I did compare the FR12 frequency response a bit to the original aura tone and it looked quite similar. The WS 13 E seemed quite steady but it looks a bit like a tilt filter the higher it gets the louder it gets. So I'm not sure yet about any of the 3 speakers. Also I'm building one from scratch.

 

[TomS]

Yeah, I did see that dip too was questioning that. But maybe then the Monacor is the best option for this build since it seems to be really linear from 200hz to 5k with a boost at 6k of 10db which is quite a lot. But apart from that, it seems quite flat. I did compare the FR12 frequency response a bit to the original aura tone and it looked quite similar. The WS 13 E seemed quite steady but it looks a bit like a tilt filter the higher it gets the louder it gets. So I'm not sure yet about any of the 3 speakers. Also I'm building one from scratch.

At the moment I'm leaning most to the Monacor speaker or the FR12 8 ohm. The 8 ohm version seems to have less of a dip around 600hz than the 4 ohm which seems weird to me but I was going to get the 8 ohm version anyway. But the Monacor seems like the flatest out of these two.

 

[TomS]

The Monacor speaker is suggested for a vented box and it doesn't seem ideal in my speaker design software. The Visaton WS 13 E does look quite appealing since that gets a little boost around 120 Hz from the box size which might even out the tilt filter effect the woofer has. So I'm now again leaning towards the Visaton WS 13 E.

God it's hard to choose a correct driver.

 

[Rob Flinn]

It's not really that hard.  Auratones are used to see what you mix sounds like on some average cheap speakers, therefore worrying too much about the driver maybe defeating their purpose a bit.  They're never going to sound like a pair of scm50's

 

[cyrano]

I'm with Rob here. The first Auratones weren't made for the studio. They were background muzak speakers, made by a furniture company with zero speaker experience.