Best way to punch IEC panel mount connector in boxes.

[MidnightArrakis]

My main plan was to use it to make prototype front panels so no engraving was required. I had blanks the right size so it was just a matter of creating holes, slots and other shapes.

Creating the required G-code to do this from a 2D dxf file is non-trivial. You need to know the material thickness and take into account the drill size when calculating the drill path and feed rate. The CNC machine I purchased came with a program called Mach 3 which was supposed to do this. But it was a Windows program and I run Linux. I tried Mach3 under Wine but it did not work. So in the end I decided to write some Python scrips to create G-code. I designed basic functions to create G-code sequences for circles and slots with input parameters of hole/slot dimensions, drill size and feed rate. I got these working and proceeded to tests them out first on plastic and then on aluminium. This where I ran into problems. Everything worked fine with plastic or wood but I had huge difficulties with aluminium. No matter how slow the feed rate, how small the Z-increment, with or without lubricant, I could never finish a panel without breaking at least one drill bit. I toyed with the idea of upgrading the spindle motor but I had spent so much time on I decided to abandon it and go back to having panels made for me.

Cheers

Ian

[Creating the required G-code to do this from a 2D dxf file is non-trivial] -- Perhaps the below program may be useful with your attempting to translate one form of data into another. I have personally used a couple of their programs and have learned first-hand that they work quite well:

https://www.numericalinnovations.com/blogs/news/ace-translator-3000-includes-over-150-translators
[go back to having panels made for me] -- While I certainly do understand that this is a "DIY" forum and everybody is supposed to get their "jollies" by hacking, whacking and struggling with cut fingers to do their own sheet-metal work.....I personally prefer to just design my sheet-metal work using my "SolidWorks" 3D Mechanical Design program and simply e-mail my finished SolidWorks file to a sheet-metal fabricator and receive a finished product a mere short time later!!! NO FUSS!!! NO MUSS!!! Just a few BUCKS!!!

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[abbey road d enfer]

Just a few BUCKS!!!

My experience is that sheet metal fabricators charge a lump for translating client document (igs, dwg, dxf, g-code,...) to machine-specific code and preparation (cleaning, sorting material, wedging,...). that's prototyping. Typically $100-200.
I wished it was only a few bucks.

 

[MidnightArrakis]

I think the additional expense of powercon would pay for one of these punching tools quickly. I plan on needing to make 200 or so IEC cutouts and the cheapest powercon solution (including cable, connector, and fuse holder) seems to be around 16$ vs 7$ for an equivalent length iec cable/combined fuse holder. Obviously nit a big deal if doing a few one offs, but for doing small runs it does add up rather quickly

[I plan on needing to make 200 or so IEC cutouts] -- If you are planning on punching out 200 or so IEC cutouts by hand in order to try and save a few bucks, in my opinion.....you are just setting yourself up for some "premature aging" stress!!! There are a variety of PCB-mounted IEC power-inlets, some even with included AC-filters, to choose from in the marketplace. You just need to know where to look for these products.

NOTICE the PCB-Mounted IEC connector (with included filter) in the upper-left hand corner:

While I have absolutely -- NO IDEA -- of what it is that you are attempting to design/build/fabricate, if I were you.....I would find someone like "ME" to perform the mechanical design of whatever it is that you want to have made and then I send you my finished CAD-design file. Once you have a completed 3D CAD-model file of whatever it is you are looking to do, there are multitudes of low-volume and prototype sheet-metal fabricators available that are specifically setup to receive my type of CAD-files, import them directly into their sheet-metal fabrication equipment and literally -- "spit-out" -- your finished sheet-metal product very quickly and ship it to you!!!

This way.....you get everything fabricated to precise dimensions, all powder-coated and silkscreened as well, if that is what you are looking for. I personally do not see any need with having to struggle day-after-day-after-day trying to punch out 200-holes into a piece of sheet-metal, when a sheet-metal shop can punch them all out in probably 15-minutes or less.....and, precisely, too!!!

Here's a couple of NEUTRIK "PowerCON" connector CAD-models for you to contemplate:






SO!!!.....should you desire to have any assistance with the design of whatever it is that you are attempting to accomplish, I just so happen to know -- THIS GUY -- who is a pretty good "Equipment Designer" and is more than willing to help the members of this "GroupDIY" forum with their personal projects!!! What a deal, huh??? Send me a PM if interested.

Senior Electronics Mechanical Packaging & PCB Designer

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[abbey road d enfer]

I think the additional expense of powercon would pay for one of these punching tools quickly. I plan on needing to make 200 or so IEC cutouts and the cheapest powercon solution (including cable, connector, and fuse holder) seems to be around 16$ vs 7$ for an equivalent length iec cable/combined fuse holder.

I agree with Midnight Arrakis that 100-200 cutouts usually justifies using a subcontractor. Unless these are to be done on existing metalwork. However, it may be cheaper to completely replace existing panels than modify them.
Since we ignore the constraints, we can only conjecture.

 

[iampoor1]

I agree with Midnight Arrakis that 100-200 cutouts usually justifies using a subcontractor. Unless these are to be done on existing metalwork. However, it may be cheaper to completely replace existing panels than modify them.
Since we ignore the constraints, we can only conjecture.

I agree but the 100-200pcs is over the span of a few years and there will be atleast 15-20 variants within those 200 panels. If I was doing a single design with 100-200pcs being ordered I would absolutly pay a sheet metal shop to do it, but when I'm doing a couple at a time the setup charges don't make sense...oh and I do own a cnc so will eventually cut them on that the hydraulic tool that giraffe mentioned looks like it can punch out a connector in under a minute...so just trying to share some good use cases for it

If I do a commercial production run I will be sure to reach out to you Midnight!

 

[MidnightArrakis]

My experience is that sheet metal fabricators charge a lump for translating client document (igs, dwg, dxf, g-code,...) to machine-specific code and preparation (cleaning, sorting material, wedging,...). that's prototyping. Typically $100-200.
I wished it was only a few bucks.

[translating client document (igs, dwg, dxf, g-code,...) to machine-specific code] -- This part of my comment was related to using the "ACE Translator 3000" program for translating data files, -- NOT -- by using a sheet-metal fabricator.

[Just a few BUCKS!!!] -- With all of the recent advancements using 3D CAD-programs and the newly recent capabilities of various sheet-metal fabricators being able to directly import completed sheet-metal CAD-design files into their fabrication equipment, even the prototyping cost of "one-off's" has come down dramatically over the past few years!!! Well.....at least here in the States, I have no idea how things are over there in the EU and the UK. That is why I ended my comment with "Just a few BUCKS!!!".

And.....probably unlike most of the hard-core "DIY'ers" here on this forum, even if I was to have a "one-off" chassis fabricated, I would still much prefer to e-mail my SolidWorks file off to one of the specialized sheet-metal fabricators that I am aware of and have it made professionally, than spend the time down in my basement "bending and hacking and whacking" a bunch of metal up to become a prototype chassis. I used to do that when I was in my 20's, but now.....it's just not worth my while to bother with it.

[If I do a commercial production run I will be sure to reach out to you Midnight!] -- "THANK YOU!!" I appreciate the kind words!!! But, I wouldn't necessarily wait to do a "commercial production run" to contact me. I may be able to design you whatever it is that you are working on and all of your 15 - 20 variants more quickly than however it is that you are doing this now!!! My working within the "virtual realm" of designing stuff on-screen is way faster than you may think that it is. Why don't you send me some sketches and details of whatever it is that you are working on and let me see what I can conjure up for you, OK??? Again, I have - NO IDEA - of what it is that you are working on.

At my last full-time employment employer, they designed and manufactured "state-of-the-art" video matrix/switching equipment that was available in a variety of rack-mount chassis ranging from 1U to 12U in height. And.....in addition to every model of their basic equipment, every model was -- ALSO -- available in 6-to-12 different variations, depending upon connectors used, PCB's used, power-supplies used and so on. So.....because I was the "Senior Mechanical Designer" at this company, not only was I responsible for coming up with the original chassis and PCB-designs for every new product, but then I had to also come up with the chassis and PCB-designs for every imaginable variation of every new product as dictated by the Sales Department.

Once the company had SolidWorks installed there, it was far, far easier for me to come up with all of these mechanical and PCB variations for each and every model than it used to take me when we only had AutoCAD available. I'm just sayin'.....

[the setup charges don't make sense] -- It won't cost you -- ONE RED CENT -- to have me review your sketches, create some design files in my SolidWorks program and then send my files out to 3 of these specialized prototype sheet-metal fabricators and obtain some quotes. Once you are able to find that out, then in the future, you can determine whether you want to "hack and whack" some sheet-metal parts or to go ahead and have it fabricated. Sound like a plan???








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[thor.zmt]

OK I have had enough. I can do all the various holes in my project boxes and they all come out great except for the venerable IEC Panel Connector! Does any one know of a solution that is available other than ordering boxes with it done by the manufacturer. Something like a Greenlee Punch or the like.

Alternative, use Neutrik Powercon:

NAC3MPXXA

Only needs round holes that are easy to make and is far superior for contact (important for earth) and locking. It is to IEC what Speakon is to XLR's or 6.3mm Jacks for speakers.

Thor

 

[Newmarket]

Alternative, use Neutrik Powercon:

NAC3MPXXA

Only needs round holes that are easy to make and is far superior for contact (important for earth) and locking. It is to IEC what Speakon is to XLR's or 6.3mm Jacks for speakers.

Thor

Neutrik do good stuff. Only issue might be user acceptance when accustomed to common IEC cables rather than single manufacturer source for cable connection. Also depending on whether an accessible fuse holder is preferred and/or integrated EMC filter.

 

[abbey road d enfer]

Alternative, use Neutrik Powercon:

NAC3MPXXA

Check post #118. The day you can find a Powercon cable at Walmart has not come yet.

 

[thor.zmt]

Check post #118. The day you can find a Powercon cable at Walmart has not come yet.

Cut off IEC plug, fit powercon Plug, done.

The only issue with Powercon is that when you're out in the wild and you figure out you've forgotten the damn power cord, you can't go to the next hardware store to get one.
Same problems as products that use IEC high-current types (C19/20).
Not a big deal for studios, but a serious concern for mobile sound.

Carry spare connectors? You cannot get XLR, Jack or Speakon cables at Wallmart either (not last time I was there anyway, been a while since my last visit to 'murica) and that doesn't stop you using them.

For mobile, cables break. So you you keep spare cables in the boxes, I did when I was doing mobile sound.

Thor

 

[thor.zmt]

Neutrik do good stuff. Only issue might be user acceptance when accustomed to common IEC cables rather than single manufacturer source for cable connection.

As patents are long expired china makes cheap clones. So, multiple source.

Also depending on whether an accessible fuse holder is preferred and/or integrated EMC filter.

Fuse holders come in very nice ones that fit into round holes. The IEC's with build in fuse holders are garbage. Better not use. Getting a separate EMC filter is often a much better choice, including for agency compliance.

If you manufacture in volume, then getting metal work for IEC and using IEC obviously makes sense. It has been routine choice for me in many products.

But for one offs or three offs made by hand Powercon is great.

Thor

 

[Newmarket]

As patents are long expired china makes cheap clones. So, multiple source.



Fuse holders come in very nice ones that fit into round holes. The IEC's with build in fuse holders are garbage. Better not use. Getting a separate EMC filter is often a much better choice, including for agency compliance.

If you manufacture in volume, then getting metal work for IEC and using IEC obviously makes sense. It has been routine choice for me in many products.

But for one offs or three offs made by hand Powercon is great.

Thor

Wasn't aware of clones of the Neutrik stuff so that's informative. I still know there'd be market resistance tbh. Read the analogy you made to XLR cables etc but at a pinch you can pick those up at a general music store. Neutrik mains connectors not so much. Do like Neutrik stuff though. Designed in an internal in-line mains solution to some scepticism previously. Turned out well. (Unlike my venture into mini XLR territory ). These were non audio products btw.

Fuse holders - Personally I'm not the biggest fan of the integrated fuse holders. I often find the integrated drawer thing fiddly. But a lot of people like the convenience of storing a spare 20mm fuse in there. And the big win is for build avoiding wiring up a fuse holder. But yeah - I prefer the nice round ones personally.
And of course - panel space considerations.

EMC filters - well it's horses for courses. If the integrated filter does the job then all good and you get big benefits from no internal wiring. But I've actually needed to implement both in a couple of cases to get compliance. Complex product where the "Power" side of things needed a "Big Old Lump" of a chassis mounted Schaffner filter in addition to the IRC integrated filter to take care of the low power sensor / logic side of things.

wrt low / prototype Vs production volumes - well yes - economy of scale calculations. For top fun try cutting D type cutouts in super hard sheet steel with a Dremel. Complete with the discrete screw holes

 

[thor.zmt]

Wasn't aware of clones of the Neutrik stuff so that's informative.

Of course China clones/fakes anything and everything.

I still know there'd be market resistance tbh.

What market, we are talking about one offs for personal use of very small numbers sold to close acquaintances.

If you make enough to worry about "market resistance" you make enough to get someone else to do your metalwork and let them worry.

Fuse holders - Personally I'm not the biggest fan of the integrated fuse holders. I often find the integrated drawer thing fiddly. But a lot of people like the convenience of storing a spare 20mm fuse in there. And the big win is for build avoiding wiring up a fuse holder. But yeah - I prefer the nice round ones personally. And of course - panel space considerations.

In some early products in the name of convenience, we used integrated IEC/FuseHolder/Switch/RF Filter. We found the way the included connections were done sucked, had to rebuild each and every unit and had the added inconvenience of a rear-mounted power switch.

Poly Fuses are self resetting and are the best choice.

EMC filters - well it's horses for courses. If the integrated filter does the job then all good and you get big benefits from no internal wiring. But I've actually needed to implement both in a couple of cases to get compliance. Complex product where the "Power" side of things needed a "Big Old Lump" of a chassis mounted Schaffner filter in addition to the IRC integrated filter to take care of the low power sensor / logic side of things.

I found taking it all "on board" gives more control in a production environment where almost any wound part is custom anyway. Here a unit I personally designed:

Outside

and inside:


Incidentally, this is a 25W+25W valve amp, class AB Push-pull with "super EL84" outputs and a SMPS for HT, Heaters and solid state DAC/Phono stages.

wrt low / prototype Vs production volumes - well yes - economy of scale calculations.

That is what we are discussing.

Thor

 

[abbey road d enfer]

I still know there'd be market resistance tbh. Read the analogy you made to XLR cables etc but at a pinch you can pick those up at a general music store. Neutrik mains connectors not so much. ...
... Designed in an internal in-line mains solution to some scepticism previously. Turned out well....These were non audio products btw.

I've been the Neutik distributor for about 20 years and found out the hard way.
Some markets are more ready to accept innovations than others. Audio, and in particular live sound less so. Understandably. Diverging from long established habits is a risk a live sound enginer thinks twice about before giving in.

"The show must go on" is a daunting injunction.

 

[Newmarket]

Of course China clones/fakes anything and everything.

True enough. I've had to deal with "questionable" Molex KK type connectors previously.

What market, we are talking about one offs for personal use of very small numbers sold to close acquaintances.

If you make enough to worry about "market resistance" you make enough to get someone else to do your metalwork and let them worry.

Well tbh the discussion has wandered here and there wrt quantities and timescales. 100 off isn't low volume to hand craft somethingg but then turns out over a couple of years.

In some early products in the name of convenience, we used integrated IEC/FuseHolder/Switch/RF Filter. We found the way the included connections were done sucked, had to rebuild each and every unit and had the added inconvenience of a rear-mounted power switch.

It's obviously a problem if the component itself isn't up to scratch on the quality or design front.

Poly Fuses are self resetting and are the best choice.

Yeah - I like the Poly' fuses where appropriate. Neat.

 

[Newmarket]

I've been the Neutik distributor for about 20 years and found out the hard way.
Some markets are more ready to accept innovations than others. Audio, and in particular live sound less so. Understandably. Diverging from long established habits is a risk a live sound enginer thinks twice about before giving in.

"The show must go on" is a daunting injunction.

I could also see a problem if eg a venue insisted on PAT testing cables but uses a tester with an IEC test connection. I guess a DIY adaptor would sort it.

 

[zamproject]

Poly Fuses are self resetting and are the best choice.

For main ?

I used them extensively in a motor driver design, as a slow current limiter and safety cut if too much.
Knowing that today most smps use polyfuse, but for safety I prefer the concept of a real break that mechanically open the main.

 

[cyrano]

Cut off IEC plug, fit powercon Plug, done.

In our case, there are some 2000 cables to do. Do you see us adapting powercon? Even if new devices arrive with a powercon plug on the mains cable?

 

[thor.zmt]

In our case, there are some 2000 cables to do. Do you see us adapting powercon? Even if new devices arrive with a powercon plug on the mains cable?

No.

I see you taking a dremel, dremeling out the Powercon to IEC or alternatively make a short Powercon to IEC Adapter (which I'd include if I was selling gear with powercon).

Thor

 

[abbey road d enfer]

I think it's time to put an end to this agony...