Donald trump. what is your take on him?

[lassoharp]

Not to change the subject but speaking about Trump, he is threatening to pull out of the (fox) debate tomorrow night. He has a personal problem with a woman moderator.

Yeah I saw that.  He seems to be quite sensitive towards people he believes " . . . won't treat me fairly"

. . . . and my reaction to that has been to wonder if that translates to "Agree with me 100% or I'll take my toys and go home!"

To be in such a rough and tumble game like politics . . . . . why is the skin suddenly so thin? 

 

[Krcwell]

He's shopping/shopped a competing event to networks to rival the fox debate, they already sent out an invite to the venue. Any other network would kill to carry it... He's creating a huge media buzz, the ratings of his counter-event will beat the fox debate ratings, and he wins.

It's a bold move, let's see if it pays off. Credit where credit is due, Trump is good. He seems to be at least two steps ahead of his competition.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Not to change the subject but speaking about Trump, he is threatening to pull out of the (fox) debate tomorrow night. He has a personal problem with a woman moderator.

Yeah I saw that.  He seems to be quite sensitive towards people he believes " . . . won't treat me fairly"

. . . . and my reaction to that has been to wonder if that translates to "Agree with me 100% or I'll take my toys and go home!"

To be in such a rough and tumble game like politics . . . . . why is the skin suddenly so thin?

It sounds weak to me.... Kelly asked him a hard question, and if not her, someone else will ask him more hard questions in the future. Presidential politics is hard ball, IMO he needs to man up, admit she landed a hit and re-engage. 

Calling her a bimbo and incompetent won't play well with women, but so many people hate fox I can't predict the over/under. I thought fox management did the right thing standing behind her. 

IMO It doesn't look presidential, it looks thuggish.  Maybe that's the real Trump.  :

JR

 

[lassoharp]

Trump is good

Yes, at doing things his way and winning.  The bigger irony being that serving the seat of presidency demands a certain level of selflessness and cooperation . . . .and that's where it seems the speeding truck will smack the brick wall, should he make it there. 

I must admit to a guilty pleasure of wanting to see him square off against Congress though.

I don't think he has learned that his way is not the absolute right and only way of doing things. 

 

[Krcwell]

Trump is good

Yes, at doing things his way and winning.  The bigger irony being that serving the seat of presidency demands a certain level of selflessness and cooperation . . . .and that's where it seems the speeding truck will smack the brick wall, should he make it there. 

I must admit to a guilty pleasure of wanting to see him square off against Congress though.

I don't think he has learned that his way is not the absolute right and only way of doing things.

I agree to a certain extent, although funnily enough, I think the description you provide above characterizes President Obama very closely as well. But this is the level that American politics has fallen to, where the zinger or demeaning remark against one's perceived "enemy" is treated in higher regard than the smart policy decision. It seems to be what sways the average voter.

 

[lassoharp]

I agree to a certain extent, although funnily enough, I think the description you provide above characterizes President Obama very closely as well. But this is the level that American politics has fallen to, where the zinger or demeaning remark against one's perceived "enemy" is treated in higher regard than the smart policy decision. It seems to be what sways the average voter.

Yes and if Trump doesn't see that I'd say he's walking into his own furnace.  I don't think he's nearly as pliable and cooperative at his core as Obama, or any other president that I can recall.  I did at one time get the impression that there was some innovative genius swirling around in him somewhere, and there may still be.  But at his current pace he's looking more and more like general Ursus from Beneath the Planet of the Apes. 

 

[rob_gould]

http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/trump-liberal-super-pac/2016/01/23/id/710584/

Eh?!

I've heard the stuff about Salman Rushdie speculating that Trump could be a Manchurian Candidate on behalf of the Democrats, but I hadn't seen quite such a collection of sound bites and opinions that are so completely and utterly contradictory to everything which is coming out of his mouth at the moment.

It's clear that this video has been created to make Trump look bad, but it's still curious just how much he's changed his stance on stuff, and more interestingly how he doesn't think that this will make any difference to what voters think of him in terms of policies or reliability and trustworthiness...

 

[DaveP]

http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/trump-liberal-super-pac/2016/01/23/id/710584/

It's all starting to make a lot more sense now.

He has some Democratic principles but he needs the Republican vote, so he goes in all guns blazing against the usual suspects by being completely outrageous.  He makes them all look tame and colourless and gets a big following.  He makes them look like also rans by boycotting the Fox debate and doing a benefit gig for veterans.  He's bet he is too big to care about Fox news.  I bet he pulls in the girl from the video too http://www.itv.com/news/2016-01-27/nine-year-old-girl-cries-when-she-finds-out-she-is-going-to-see-donald-trump/ and has her on stage.  You have to give him credit for pulling this off so far, it was a river-boat gamble as Lassoharp said.

DaveP

 

[JohnRoberts]

Trump is good

Yes, at doing things his way and winning.  The bigger irony being that serving the seat of presidency demands a certain level of selflessness and cooperation . . . .and that's where it seems the speeding truck will smack the brick wall, should he make it there. 

I must admit to a guilty pleasure of wanting to see him square off against Congress though.

I don't think he has learned that his way is not the absolute right and only way of doing things.

I agree to a certain extent, although funnily enough, I think the description you provide above characterizes President Obama very closely as well. But this is the level that American politics has fallen to, where the zinger or demeaning remark against one's perceived "enemy" is treated in higher regard than the smart policy decision. It seems to be what sways the average voter.

Politics is the classic zero sum game, where every blow landed against a competitor benefits you.

Obama never stopped campaigning (derogating republicans) between elections, and even now after he is a lame duck. His explanation is "Chicago Politics" and Obama seems pretty thin skinned also (IMO).

Trumps political success so far seems more related to his reality TV persona, and his insufferable self promotion. I heard one sound bite when he was asked about Putin's connection to the poisoning victim in GB. Trump responded that Putin wasn't convicted of that, and then veers into how smart Putin said Trump is. Just amazing, but like a big lie as he repeats tales of his prowess so frequently that many apparently believe him.

I've known several wealthy people and the are rarely as smart as they think they are, while most did at least one thing right. I don't hold Trumps wealth against him, but don't swallow his blarney either.

JR

PS: Does "winning" remind anybody else of Charlie Sheen?  8)

 

[DaveP]

I heard one sound bite when he was asked about Putin's connection to the poisoning victim in GB. Trump responded that Putin wasn't convicted of that, and then veers into how smart Putin said Trump is.

If you were convinced you were going to be President and were going to make headlines later by ending the Ukraine stand-off by doing a deal with Putin, that is exactly what you would say.  No point in alienating Putin over the death of one man when the deaths of thousands are at stake.  Its the same logic that the Allies used in WW2 everyday.

DaveP

 

[JohnRoberts]

I heard one sound bite when he was asked about Putin's connection to the poisoning victim in GB. Trump responded that Putin wasn't convicted of that, and then veers into how smart Putin said Trump is.

If you were convinced you were going to be President and were going to make headlines later by ending the Ukraine stand-off by doing a deal with Putin, that is exactly what you would say.  No point in alienating Putin over the death of one man when the deaths of thousands are at stake.  Its the same logic that the Allies used in WW2 everyday.

DaveP

My point was not that he defended Putin, he was asked that question because he had previously announced that Putin was a good leader or something like that. My point was that he turned the gotcha question around to pat himself on the back.

So he is skilled at verbal duels.... not sure why he would duck out of the debate in light of that skill, other than perhaps that polls show him well ahead and he is concerned about losing that lead from some debate mistake. The caucus result is pretty fluid up until the very end so the wisdom of this strategy is questionable.  While he may take a bite out of Fox's ratings, (probably also his intent to reduce their revenue), his near competitors will have freedom to attack him. While they need to be careful how they do it, he has given them enough time to craft a strategy.

IMO it would be clever for him to show up at the last minute, so all their strategy work to attack him in absentia is wasted.
[edit- pulling out of his alternate event at the last minute would look unfair to the veterans or whoever... [/edit]

But I am not a political expert, just an interested observer, so who knows?

JR

 

[DaveP]

My point was not that he defended Putin, he was asked that question because he had previously announced that Putin was a good leader or something like that. My point was that he turned the gotcha question around to pat himself on the back

Yes, you're right he never misses a trick.

I'm basing my thoughts on his pronouncement that he could shoot someone and not dent his ratings, when you think like that, who needs the Fox exposure? It makes the rest look like small fry.  If it works it's another blow against the established way of doing things which seems to appeal to more dissatisfied voters.

DaveP

 

[dmp]

I think he only appears "skilled" to a certain particular Republican voter. As I've said before, I don't see him growing beyond his current base.  I watched his press conference and don't see how his methods would be seen as "skilled" - for example, he berated a reported that brought up a subject he didn't want to talk about or mentioned to voters (abortion) - so continually talked over the reporter and demanded he apologize (?).  He was trying to suppress a question about his past statement in 1999 that he is "very pro choice".  His methods of bullying people might work when one is extremely wealthy but it wouldn't be effective in US government.
It won't be appealing in debate beyond his extreme base. It is interesting to note the connection of him bullying people being appealing to the anti-PC crowd, where anti-bullying has been a noted "PC" subject.

 

[johnheath]

If I may... again

I must confess that I do not know so very much about Trump, but swedish media are reporting about him nearly everyday here in Sweden. Why? Well, just as you guys say... he is very direct and controversial saying everything from his heart and intrests.

In Sweden we have a party called the Sweden democrats. They have one major issue in the  non controlled immigrant politic that has been runned by the last two goverments. Everybody was accusing them for being everthing fron inhuman to nazis and what not.

That being said the other parties did everything they could to place the swedish demcrats in the cold and they also refused to discuss the alarming problems with a frantic rising numbers of refugees coming to Sweden... untill it all collapsed in front of our eyes.

We have now a vast and alarming problem with all the refugees in Sweden. As being a police officer I face this every days I work. Nowadays the goverment is trying to construct anything to cope with this new problem... and are making regulations concerning the immigrant problem with the same proposals that the  Sweden democrats were suggesting two years ago.

That being said it is sometimes crucial to listen to what all citizens in a country are saying and not by stupidity trying to neglect people trying och make a difference because they usually mean well... but we all have different point of views about how to do that.

It proved that today the other politicians tend to listen to what the Sweden democrats say today because they proved to be right about the refugee situation from the beginning.

So... maybe something good might come out of Trumps campaign in the end... possibly not him being the president oh the USA?

Regards

/John

 

[mattiasNYC]

We have now a vast and alarming problem with all the refugees in Sweden. As being a police officer I face this every days I work. Nowadays the goverment is trying to construct anything to cope with this new problem... and are making regulations concerning the immigrant problem with the same proposals that the  Sweden democrats were suggesting two years ago.

That being said it is sometimes crucial to listen to what all citizens in a country are saying and not by stupidity trying to neglect people trying och make a difference because they usually mean well... but we all have different point of views about how to do that.

It proved that today the other politicians tend to listen to what the Sweden democrats say today because they proved to be right about the refugee situation from the beginning.

So... maybe something good might come out of Trumps campaign in the end... possibly not him being the president oh the USA?

Regards

/John

While I think that there's a parliamentary system for a reason, and that politicians should vote according to conviction rather than make deals in the name of "block politics" or whatever one chooses to call it, I think Dave made a good point earlier in that the rate at which immigrants or refugees come to a country makes a difference. So, the criticism of Swede Democrats was legitimate because at the time they got into parliament there was no crisis. One thing doesn't exclude the other, and that party deserved criticism because of its xenophobic views and straight up racist members - AND - care should have been taken to deal with potential refugees and immigrants. And this goes back beyond the past two elections.

So while I agree that policy changes should possibly have been made even decades ago, this party wasn't "right from the beginning" in my opinion, they were right about certain things and not others, in addition to being extremely dangerous.

 

[johnheath]

We have now a vast and alarming problem with all the refugees in Sweden. As being a police officer I face this every days I work. Nowadays the goverment is trying to construct anything to cope with this new problem... and are making regulations concerning the immigrant problem with the same proposals that the  Sweden democrats were suggesting two years ago.

That being said it is sometimes crucial to listen to what all citizens in a country are saying and not by stupidity trying to neglect people trying och make a difference because they usually mean well... but we all have different point of views about how to do that.

It proved that today the other politicians tend to listen to what the Sweden democrats say today because they proved to be right about the refugee situation from the beginning.

So... maybe something good might come out of Trumps campaign in the end... possibly not him being the president oh the USA?

Regards

/John

While I think that there's a parliamentary system for a reason, and that politicians should vote according to conviction rather than make deals in the name of "block politics" or whatever one chooses to call it, I think Dave made a good point earlier in that the rate at which immigrants or refugees come to a country makes a difference. So, the criticism of Swede Democrats was legitimate because at the time they got into parliament there was no crisis. One thing doesn't exclude the other, and that party deserved criticism because of its xenophobic views and straight up racist members - AND - care should have been taken to deal with potential refugees and immigrants. And this goes back beyond the past two elections.

So while I agree that policy changes should possibly have been made even decades ago, this party wasn't "right from the beginning" in my opinion, they were right about certain things and not others, in addition to being extremely dangerous.

Yes, I agree, they weren't right about everything (I am not a fan) what I meant or tried to descirbe was the fact that it is important to have an open attitude while discussing important issues for a nation... decissions should not according to me, be made strictly through "Block policies" and avoidance because that is even more dangerous for the future.

I guess from your name and insight that you for some reason have connections to Sweden but I might be wrong, and I agree with you that the rugugee situation should have been discussed mucg earlier than starting in panic as it is now.

Regards

/John

 

[JohnRoberts]

If I may... again

I must confess that I do not know so very much about Trump, but swedish media are reporting about him nearly everyday here in Sweden. Why? Well, just as you guys say... he is very direct and controversial saying everything from his heart and intrests.

In Sweden we have a party called the Sweden democrats. They have one major issue in the  non controlled immigrant politic that has been runned by the last two goverments. Everybody was accusing them for being everthing fron inhuman to nazis and what not.

That being said the other parties did everything they could to place the swedish demcrats in the cold and they also refused to discuss the alarming problems with a frantic rising numbers of refugees coming to Sweden... untill it all collapsed in front of our eyes.

We have now a vast and alarming problem with all the refugees in Sweden. As being a police officer I face this every days I work. Nowadays the goverment is trying to construct anything to cope with this new problem... and are making regulations concerning the immigrant problem with the same proposals that the  Sweden democrats were suggesting two years ago.

That being said it is sometimes crucial to listen to what all citizens in a country are saying and not by stupidity trying to neglect people trying och make a difference because they usually mean well... but we all have different point of views about how to do that.

It proved that today the other politicians tend to listen to what the Sweden democrats say today because they proved to be right about the refugee situation from the beginning.

So... maybe something good might come out of Trumps campaign in the end... possibly not him being the president oh the USA?

Regards

/John

It is a fairly common fault of legislators to be completely disconnected from reality (like math, or economics, or....). A popular joke was that they would try to repeal gravity if not checked. 

In the US, the immigration debate has several competing interests. The left is interested in increasing potential future democratic voters and curry favor with legal immigrants already here. The right is motivated by business interests to increase the pool of cheap labor.  These are fairly extreme characterizations and many exist on a continuum between these extremes.

Europe and Sweden are known for being very liberal, and many immigrants are in pursuit of the stereotype (and free sh__) .

I really feel bad for all of europe as many countries there are still trying to ignore the reality occurring right before their eyes. 

I don't pretent there is a simple answer for this, but maybe stabilize the middle east a little better so everybody doesn't want to leave, all at the same time.

**News flash*** since Libya has been de-Gaddafi'd, it has become a safe haven for ISIL and al Kaida, and who knows...

I don't expect the typical politicians to figure this out... but some voters can smell the stink...

JR

 

[johnheath]

If I may... again

I must confess that I do not know so very much about Trump, but swedish media are reporting about him nearly everyday here in Sweden. Why? Well, just as you guys say... he is very direct and controversial saying everything from his heart and intrests.

In Sweden we have a party called the Sweden democrats. They have one major issue in the  non controlled immigrant politic that has been runned by the last two goverments. Everybody was accusing them for being everthing fron inhuman to nazis and what not.

That being said the other parties did everything they could to place the swedish demcrats in the cold and they also refused to discuss the alarming problems with a frantic rising numbers of refugees coming to Sweden... untill it all collapsed in front of our eyes.

We have now a vast and alarming problem with all the refugees in Sweden. As being a police officer I face this every days I work. Nowadays the goverment is trying to construct anything to cope with this new problem... and are making regulations concerning the immigrant problem with the same proposals that the  Sweden democrats were suggesting two years ago.

That being said it is sometimes crucial to listen to what all citizens in a country are saying and not by stupidity trying to neglect people trying och make a difference because they usually mean well... but we all have different point of views about how to do that.

It proved that today the other politicians tend to listen to what the Sweden democrats say today because they proved to be right about the refugee situation from the beginning.

So... maybe something good might come out of Trumps campaign in the end... possibly not him being the president oh the USA?

Regards

/John

It is a fairly common fault of legislators to be completely disconnected from reality (like math, or economics, or....). A popular joke was that they would try to repeal gravity if not checked. 

In the US, the immigration debate has several competing interests. The left is interested in increasing potential future democratic voters and curry favor with legal immigrants already here. The right is motivated by business interests to increase the pool of cheap labor.  These are fairly extreme characterizations and many exist on a continuum between these extremes.

Europe and Sweden are known for being very liberal, and many immigrants are in pursuit of the stereotype (and free sh__) .

I really feel bad for all of europe as many countries there are still trying to ignore the reality occurring right before their eyes. 

I don't pretent there is a simple answer for this, but maybe stabilize the middle east a little better so everybody doesn't want to leave, all at the same time.

**News flash*** since Libya has been de-Gaddafi'd, it has become a safe haven for ISIL and al Kaida, and who knows...

I don't expect the typical politicians to figure this out... but some voters can smell the stink...

JR

I hear you and agree. To give some insight in the "swedish" problem might be illustrated by this: http://www.keepeek.com/Digital-Asset-Management/oecd/governance/government-at-a-glance-2015_gov_glance-2015-en#page35

Sweden is in fact into bottom league when it comes down to open minded politicians… it might have something to do with the rest??? But what do I know I am just a simple peasant

Regards

/John

 

[mattiasNYC]

Yes, I agree, they weren't right about everything (I am not a fan) what I meant or tried to descirbe was the fact that it is important to have an open attitude while discussing important issues for a nation... decissions should not according to me, be made strictly through "Block policies" and avoidance because that is even more dangerous for the future.

I guess from your name and insight that you for some reason have connections to Sweden but I might be wrong, and I agree with you that the rugugee situation should have been discussed mucg earlier than starting in panic as it is now.

Regards

/John

I agree. And 'yes', I'm a Swede in NY. A brown Swede actually.

 

[johnheath]

Yes, I agree, they weren't right about everything (I am not a fan) what I meant or tried to descirbe was the fact that it is important to have an open attitude while discussing important issues for a nation... decissions should not according to me, be made strictly through "Block policies" and avoidance because that is even more dangerous for the future.

I guess from your name and insight that you for some reason have connections to Sweden but I might be wrong, and I agree with you that the rugugee situation should have been discussed mucg earlier than starting in panic as it is now.

Regards

/John

I agree. And 'yes', I'm a Swede in NY. A brown Swede actually.

Nice, well I am white and I guess my color doesn't matter and neither do yours

My opinion is that people who wants to live together somewhere on earth and interact with each other on fairly the same social structure can call themselves "people, nation, country or whatever and they will connect with each other on equal terms… so, a swede is swede on these terms… color doesn't matter. All my friend have different ethnic background like Chile, Bosnia, Uruguay and Uganda for example.