Heiserman HK47 or HK12 in ELAM 251 circuit

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rosewood123

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I need to pull the trigger on one of these to upgrade the capsule in my ELAM 251 circuit. Obviously the HK12 capsule is the better choice but is $125 USD more, and plus I'm in Canada so that ups the price more. I don't really care about patterns other than cardioid as this will primarily be a vocal mic.

I currently have a CK12 capsule in there from Advanced Audio and it actually sounds very good ... but I'm sure I'll see an improvement with Heiserman.

My concern is that the circuit is probably optimized for the HK12 and not the the HK47 and it just wouldn't sound right with the HK47. Hard to know. What do you think? Maybe I should just get the HK12 to be on the safe side. However, I do like the idea of a nicer midrange with the K47 style capsule.
 

Khron

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Ever considered that the circuit probably isn't doing all that much "tone-shaping"? And that whatever differences you hear (or don't hear) will be down to the capsules themselves?

But hey, confirmation bias is a fickle but powerful mistress, so if you're sure you'll see an improvement, and you can afford the upgrade... But what do i know?  :p
 

rosewood123

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Khron said:
Ever considered that the circuit probably isn't doing all that much "tone-shaping"? And that whatever differences you hear (or don't hear) will be down to the capsules themselves?

But hey, confirmation bias is a fickle but powerful mistress, so if you're sure you'll see an improvement, and you can afford the upgrade... But what do i know?  :p

I think you may be misinterpreting my post. I should've mentioned that I'm still new to building circuits and learning. So I don't really know the extent to which this particular circuit is going to change the sound. Yes, I know that the capsule is going to be very important, which is why I'm upgrading regardless. I'm getting either the HK47 or the HK12 and asking for advice about if the circuit is going to cause issues with the HK47.

I know the capsules are different and I do like the sound of a good K47 capsule. So if it works well with the ELAM circuit and the circuit/capsule combo will sound good, I will do that. I've searched to see if anyone is using K47 or M7 capsule in ELAM 251 circuits but I couldn't find anything. I did try a crappy Chinese K47 capsule that I have in the circuit at one point and it sounded fine and balanced except for the fact that the cheap Chinese capsule was crap.

If you're saying that the capsule will be the largest factor and the HK47 will be fine/a lot of the sound will come from it, I'm fine with that.

I appreciate your reply in any case! Thanks.
 

Delta Sigma

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The Beesneez CK12 is just over $400CAD and sounds amazing. They have 25% off deal right now. If that applies to capsules as well, you won't find a better deal.

Ben makes fantastic capsules.
 

rosewood123

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Delta Sigma said:
The Beesneez CK12 is just over $400CAD and sounds amazing. They have 25% off deal right now. If that applies to capsules as well, you won't find a better deal.

Ben makes fantastic capsules.

These ones here? https://beesneezproaudio.com/capsules/ Thanks for the tip. Looks like a good deal. I hope shipping is good to Canada!
 

kingkorg

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If it's exact Elam circuit you have, it probably wont be good match with k47.  Elam circuit should have both low and high end attenuation, and you don't want either of those with k47. 
 

Icantthinkofaname

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It's going to be a pretty big change going from the Advanced Audio "CK12" capsule to the HK-12. The latter is a properly chambered capsule based on the CK12, and the former is a like a K67 capsule that's edge terminated. This really affects the response of non-cardioid patterns.
 

rosewood123

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Apr 30, 2018
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Thanks all for the replies. The circuit is not an exact replica but it is very close. I wish I could remember the differences but I built it some time ago and will have to find the schematic. What I do remember is that caps for high rolloff are in the design. I left both out so there's no rolloff. It's quite bright but doesn't sound bad. It's much smoother than cheaper mics I've had.

Yep, that's why I want to upgrade. I want the real deal. I'm sick of using non-top-grade capsules. I have a Soyuz Bomblet which is very nice. The 251 is brighter but I think I actually like the 251 more. The Bomblet has a bit more saturation and is more creamy, while the 251 is slightly more transparent but has some saturation in the top end. Both are really nice.

Tim, I would LOVE one of your capsules. Maybe send me a PM if you like with a price quote to ship to Ontario, Canada. I really want your capsule but the price has kept me from it (not that it's not worth it as your capsules are obviously the best, but it's more personally that I can't afford it). But I'll see what you say and really consider it as your capsules are insanely good, from what I've heard.
 

Delta Sigma

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rosewood123 said:
Tim, I would LOVE one of your capsules...... I really want your capsule but the price has kept me from it .....

Same boat I was in. I bought the Beesneez CK12 because I got a deal pairing one with a 251 mic body. I do plan on buying a pair of CT12 (Tim's) when I build a pair of C12s but unfortunately that's still far away before I have cash for those builds.

I've had no trouble receiving shipments from Beesneez in Australia to Winnipeg and to a very rural address. Shippping costs were reasonable - probably similar to Tim shipping if he uses post. Capsules aren't very big to ship.

Believe me you won't be disappointed by Ben's CK12; especially for the cost.  I think the quality of the reliable "boutique" capsule manufacturers is very high; higher than some people assume. Once you're in the vein of Theirsch, Beesneez, Tim Campbell, etc you will not be disappointed with the quality. They all have their own nuances that make them different from each other but one is not necessarily "better" than the other.

However, if you're alway going to be wondering if Tim's capsule would've been better for you, just buy it now. Find some random piece of gear and list it on Kijiji to fund the difference!

Another thing to consider, Ben and Veronica have always been great to the DIY community and are very supportive if you have issues. Tim's support though, probably can't be matched. Scroll through the 251 and C12 threads and you'll see what I mean. He's very active on the forum and very helpful. There has to be a value placed on that level of support.
 

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