It's been over a year since the Chinese CK12 was released. Any news?

[OneRoomStudio]

I won't link to or rehash the disaster-of-a-thread that the original "New CK12" thread was, but we know that @kingkorg's measurements showed they still had a ways to go before they had a viable CK12 option. It's been over a year since then. Surely they've been working on it. Has anyone heard anything?

 

[Tim Campbell]

I will be at 3U Audio in Nanjing during November so I might have some news then.

 

[soliloqueen]

I won't link to or rehash the disaster-of-a-thread that the original "New CK12" thread was, but we know that @kingkorg's measurements showed they still had a ways to go before they had a viable CK12 option. It's been over a year since then. Surely they've been working on it. Has anyone heard anything?

i know the dude that makes that ck12 and he really doesn't get how the chambers work, so it's gonna be ages before he figures it out

 

[OneRoomStudio]

i know the dude that makes that ck12 and he really doesn't get how the chambers work, so it's gonna be ages before he figures it out

That's a shame. Here's hoping that 3U audio comes through! That, or you produce a CK12 and/or Tim starts selling to DIYers again!

 

[HerbertR]

That's a shame. Here's hoping that 3U audio comes through! That, or you produce a CK12 and/or Tim starts selling to DIYers again!

I can really recommend OPR, Beesneez and Haun. All three are in the top league...there are differences, but to me they all sound as I would expect from a highest quality CK12. The China Xingde C12 sounds good in my opinion, works very well with Siemens Halske ECC801S and 3U OT, but the off-axis speaking direction is really strange. In Cardioid the capsule picks up sound from the side and from the back in an atypical way, picking up far too much content and shrillness. Difficult to explain. The mids are also a bit more present than with all the other boutique C12 capsules I own. I would buy them if I'd get these for 100 bucks or so. Anything more than that would be too expensive.

 

[kingkorg]

I can really recommend OPR, Beesneez and Haun. All three are in the top league...there are differences, but to me they all sound as I would expect from a highest quality CK12. The China Xingde C12 sounds good in my opinion, works very well with Siemens Halske ECC801S and 3U OT, but the off-axis speaking direction is really strange. In Cardioid the capsule picks up sound from the side and from the back in an atypical way, picking up far too much content and shrillness. Difficult to explain. The mids are also a bit more present than with all the other boutique C12 capsules I own. I would buy them if I'd get these for 100 bucks or so. Anything more than that would be too expensive.

You explained it great. You can mess up CK12 in so many weird ways it's almost fun exploring how strange you can get it to behave.

 

[OneRoomStudio]

I can really recommend OPR, Beesneez and Haun. All three are in the top league...there are differences, but to me they all sound as I would expect from a highest quality CK12. The China Xingde C12 sounds good in my opinion, works very well with Siemens Halske ECC801S and 3U OT, but the off-axis speaking direction is really strange. In Cardioid the capsule picks up sound from the side and from the back in an atypical way, picking up far too much content and shrillness. Difficult to explain. The mids are also a bit more present than with all the other boutique C12 capsules I own. I would buy them if I'd get these for 100 bucks or so. Anything more than that would be too expensive.

Thank you for that description! It sounds like it might be fun to play with.

Unfortunately, I’m trying to finish a pair of C414s, and I’d like the to have proper polar patterns. I’m sure the Haun, OPR, and Beesneez CK12’s are wonderful, but at current prices, it would cost me nearly $1,000 US for a pair of any of those. I wish there were a more affordable, but fairly-accurate alternative.

 

[k brown]

You explained it great. You can mess up CK12 in so many weird ways it's almost fun exploring how strange you can get it to behave.

Any idea what AKG were trying to accomplish with such a complex and unusual design?

 

[soliloqueen]

Any idea what AKG were trying to accomplish with such a complex and unusual design?

more correct patterns, mostly. if you get it right, it has really stable patterns.

 

[k brown]

more correct patterns, mostly. if you get it right, it has really stable patterns.

I assume you're referring to patterns remaining similar across the frequency range?

 

[soliloqueen]

I assume you're referring to patterns remaining similar across the frequency range?

yes, the two cardioid capsules have superior all-band rear rejection, so they are better at building patterns

 

[k brown]

yes, the two cardioid capsules have superior all-band rear rejection, so they are better at building patterns

Which is something rather rare in LDCs; so makes sense they would not be simple to make.

 

[soliloqueen]

Which is something rather rare in LDCs; so makes sense they would not be simple to make.

moreso they just did it a difficult way because of manufacturing limitations back then

 

[Paul W]

moreso they just did it a difficult way because of manufacturing limitations back then

I've been wondering what exactly is so difficult about making a CK12-like capsule and if it would be easier/cheaper using modern methods, and/or just doing things somewhat differently.

I would think that the only parts you need extremely fine tolerances for would be the backplates, which you need for simpler capsules, too.

Are the extra chambers or the resistance between halves intrinsically difficult to get right?

 

[kingkorg]

I've been wondering what exactly is so difficult about making a CK12-like capsule and if it would be easier/cheaper using modern methods, and/or just doing things somewhat differently.

Austrian Audio claim they made it. I am not sure, i see it follows the same principle but it is different. AKG tried doing it, and not many know Neumann's k67 is actually inspired by multi chambered design of CK12. Hence the spacer between two halves not present in k47.

 

[OneRoomStudio]

I will be at 3U Audio in Nanjing during November so I might have some news then.

@Tim Campbell any update on this? I’m very curious to hear how the new CK12 is coming along.

 

[Tim Campbell]

I broke my pelvis this summer and although I managed to get to Slovakia to work with FLEA and Finland to work with Nordic Audio labs I realized I had just pushed myself a bit too hard and needed more time to recuperate and so postponed my trip until possibly next year after NAMM. In the meantime a few other new CK12 capsules have come out. FLEA started producing their own and so did Myburg.

 

[OneRoomStudio]

I broke my pelvis this summer and although I managed to get to Slovakia to work with FLEA and Finland to work with Nordic Audio labs I realized I had just pushed myself a bit too hard and needed more time to recuperate and so postponed my trip until possibly next year after NAMM. In the meantime a few other new CK12 capsules have come out. FLEA started producing their own and so did Myburg.

I'm sorry to hear about your injury! I hope you recuperate fully (and quickly)!

I also hope more of these CK12's become available to the DIY community.

 

[SubSpec]

I also hope more of these CK12's become available to the DIY community

Yeah, adding Flea and Myburgh to the mix brings more high end options to the market (where there are already a decent selection of options). With none of them (seemingly) offering them for sale individually it seems no change for the DIY world. Hopefully someone comes along in the future with more attainable options.