SB4000 Support Thread

[Lordward]

I find it interesting that I cannot find, with the GDIY search or Google, any information about what the 50k trim pots on the VCA boards are for.  I did find a few people asking the same question- unanswered.  I've tried turning them just to hear the difference but I hear nothing. 

Any insight would be greatly appreciated!

Wild guessing, all of your questions have been answered numerous times in this thread. (For your last request, maybe read my replies from FI. pg.62, there are more....)

Cheers, got it all figured out now.  Unit is working great and sounds stellar. 
Actually it's kind of taken over for my TK Audio BC1.  More "vibe" and better glue.  Not bad at all.

 

[Blahpstick]

Hello there!  I've been browsing this thread for nearly a week now trying to discern some answers for my particular problem:

I've got a Rev 4.0 board and the full kit that I purchased directly from Serpent Audio just a few weeks ago.
I've managed to get my build up to calibration step 4 and that's where I begin experiencing issues.

I have pretrimmed my meter and ratio VRs according to the schematic.  I'm exporting a +4dBu 1KHz tone into my unit and importing a signal back into my DAW.  I attempt to adjust the threshold pot, but nothing happens on the GR meter, bargraph, or in my DAW, however when I turn up the makeup gain my unit's output turns down on the bargraph and in my DAW.

Threshold pot measures 7.08 VDC across the two outer pins in CCW and 6.48 VDC on the outer two pins when fully CW
Makeup pot measures 5.58 VDC across the two outer pins in CCW and 5.35 VDC on the outer two pins when fully CW

I tested the 20 pin header on the main pcb for shorts between any of the pins' neighbors and found none.
I tested the 20 pin header on the control board pcb for shorts and found that pins 1&2 and 8&10 were shorting.  I'm not sure if this was by design but since there were no shorts on the main pcb header i found it possibly worth noting (especially since I saw on the schematic that pins 1 and 10 feed threshold and gain respectively)

Any and all help would be greatly appreciated!

 

[pundit]

Hi,

I'm in Melbourne, Australia and am helping a friend build an SB4000.

It appears getting hold a Sifam AL19 VU meter is like trying to find rocking horse poo.

Canford in England appears to be the only place we could find that sells a Sifam AL19  but has quoted a two month lead time as it is considered  'special order'.

Does anyone have any other suggestions?

TIA

 

[ronnniiieee]

Just finished the build, but having problems.  Did the quad VCA board and was a bit confused on what to populate on the main board.  So far used jmp8 and 9 and did all the main board changes as indicated on the quad VCA bom.  U2 on the quad boards get super hot and I get no voltage on TP10 no matter what.  Tried using JMP1 and 4 and added R83/R125 (120) and R77/R121 (1k) and still end up with super hot 5532 U2.  Really stumped, hopefully someone can chime in and help!  Also, the output gain knob is not reducing signal

 

[Bowie]

Hi,

I'm in Melbourne, Australia and am helping a friend build an SB4000.

It appears getting hold a Sifam AL19 VU meter is like trying to find rocking horse poo.

Canford in England appears to be the only place we could find that sells a Sifam AL19  but has quoted a two month lead time as it is considered  'special order'.

Does anyone have any other suggestions?

TIA

Is your faceplace from Serpent?  If so, I've built 2 SB4ks and Hairball Audio has meters that fit.

Just finished the build, but having problems.  Did the quad VCA board and was a bit confused on what to populate on the main board.  So far used jmp8 and 9 and did all the main board changes as indicated on the quad VCA bom.  U2 on the quad boards get super hot and I get no voltage on TP10 no matter what.  Tried using JMP1 and 4 and added R83/R125 (120) and R77/R121 (1k) and still end up with super hot 5532 U2.  Really stumped, hopefully someone can chime in and help!  Also, the output gain knob is not reducing signal

Did you follow the chart on the schematic?  I don't have any solutions but wanted to mention the chart since a lot of people seem  to miss that part when building.

 

[ronnniiieee]

yes, followed the chart but confused.  I originally stuffed the mainboard as if I would be using just one 2181B.  Then decided to do the quad boards.  Thought I read somewhere to remove all components from mainboard in the VCA section if installing the quad boards.  Seemed to make sense being that with those components the quad boards wouldn't fit.  removed all but left JMP1,4 and 8,9 and still super hot op amps on quad board with no compression on output (but meter shows compression) and nothing on TP10 in turbo mode.  Completely stumped, went through the boards a few times and found no errors.  I think I may be populating something wrong for using the quad boards. 

 

[Harpo]

...and still end up with super hot 5532 U2...

sorry, but there is NO 5532 (dual opamp) on the quad-VCA board. Pcb-layout is for a 5534 (single opamp).
Expect the 5532 to be blown. This might have killed the VCAs on the quad board as well.

 

[ronnniiieee]

...and still end up with super hot 5532 U2...

sorry, but there is NO 5532 (dual opamp) on the quad-VCA board. Pcb-layout is for a 5534 (single opamp).
Expect the 5532 to be blown. This might have killed the VCAs on the quad board as well.

you the man, should have posted for help a week ago!  had the pair of 5532 in the quad board and the 5534 in another spot.  Serves me right for pulling an all nighter during assembly.  Switched them out and its working out.  Ordered new chips for the sidechain, since the 5532s were toast.  Thanks again!

 

[ronnniiieee]

reporting that everything is up and running!  I also want to reiterate  Reply #1019 on pg 52 I believe.  I was also getting some distortion due to using the inside pin when installing the tants.  Made jumpers and all is well.  Same issue with C125 on mainboard and one additional C128 on control board not mentioned in post 1019.  Comp calibrated well and is sounding sweet!  Thanks again for this project and for all the help on the build thread!

 

[EmptyMusicBox1]

hello !

Do you think it's possible to add a dual 50k pot for the VCA THD level when you use a dbx202c for adjust the Harmonics and add a sound coloration ?

It's dangerous for the VCA dbx202c ?

(inspiration : http://www.funkyjunk.fr/product_info.php?cPath=64&products_id=966 )

 

[Blackdawg]

Hello!

Im just getting into DIY and this will be my 8th build or so. Id love to have this for my passive mixing setup for the main bus. Espeically since ive used an SSL Dulaity at my school and like using small amounts of the bus comp on it.

I have some questions though:

1)Where do i get the rack case/encourse for this?

2) What about the power transformer?

3) Or any of the parts that aren't included from Sperants site for that matter? The Metter, VCAs, and the like. All the kits i have done up to this point have had everything included. Is there a favorite place to go? Im in the US if that matters.

Im sure these questions have been asked so sorry for the noob questions. I really like how this looks though and from what i have read sounds great!

Hoping this will be a stepping stone to get the SA-3A kit done next.

Thank you all,

Monte

 

[Bowie]

Hello!

Im just getting into DIY and this will be my 8th build or so. Id love to have this for my passive mixing setup for the main bus. Espeically since ive used an SSL Dulaity at my school and like using small amounts of the bus comp on it.

I have some questions though:

1)Where do i get the rack case/encourse for this?

2) What about the power transformer?

3) Or any of the parts that aren't included from Sperants site for that matter? The Metter, VCAs, and the like. All the kits i have done up to this point have had everything included. Is there a favorite place to go? Im in the US if that matters.

Im sure these questions have been asked so sorry for the noob questions. I really like how this looks though and from what i have read sounds great!

Hoping this will be a stepping stone to get the SA-3A kit done next.

Thank you all,

Monte

Yea, it's a fantastic, classic buss comp.
1) You can get the faceplate from Serpent and the enclosure from Dan D @ Collectivecases.vom.
2) I believe I bought one or both of mine from Allied but Mouser, Digikey, and Newark likely have them too.
3) Hairball sells meters that fit well and work great.  It's really not hard to source the extra parts for this build.  Absolute breeze compared to some of the ground-up sourcing I've done.

  The build itself is very easy in a sense because there's little guesswork since everything is well documented and works perfect when put together correct.  What you need to do is check everything 2 or 3 times when installing as there are so many parts that you can go wrong if you rush.  I had 1 resistor wrong in my first one, the 2nd was flawless because I was patient.

 

[Blackdawg]

Hello!

Im just getting into DIY and this will be my 8th build or so. Id love to have this for my passive mixing setup for the main bus. Espeically since ive used an SSL Dulaity at my school and like using small amounts of the bus comp on it.

I have some questions though:

1)Where do i get the rack case/encourse for this?

2) What about the power transformer?

3) Or any of the parts that aren't included from Sperants site for that matter? The Metter, VCAs, and the like. All the kits i have done up to this point have had everything included. Is there a favorite place to go? Im in the US if that matters.

Im sure these questions have been asked so sorry for the noob questions. I really like how this looks though and from what i have read sounds great!

Hoping this will be a stepping stone to get the SA-3A kit done next.

Thank you all,

Monte

Yea, it's a fantastic, classic buss comp.
1) You can get the faceplate from Serpent and the enclosure from Dan D @ Collectivecases.vom.
2) I believe I bought one or both of mine from Allied but Mouser, Digikey, and Newark likely have them too.
3) Hairball sells meters that fit well and work great.  It's really not hard to source the extra parts for this build.  Absolute breeze compared to some of the ground-up sourcing I've done.

  The build itself is very easy in a sense because there's little guesswork since everything is well documented and works perfect when put together correct.  What you need to do is check everything 2 or 3 times when installing as there are so many parts that you can go wrong if you rush.  I had 1 resistor wrong in my first one, the 2nd was flawless because I was patient.

Hey thank you for the reply!

I was looking at the Sa-3A BOM and saw the case place! Pretty cool!

I'm still confused on the PSU and transformer though. What do I need to get exactly? That's really the part of the build I just am not grasping. How do I pick one? What makes one better than the other??

Hairball! Of course. Really want a 500 1176 from them too. Saw they did the Sa 3a transformer bundle too.

I just am not super set on doing the PSU part on gear like this. All I've done is 500 series kits or similar.

Would the five fish audio one work? http://www.fivefishaudio.com/diy/psu2448/

 

[Bowie]

Hello!

Im just getting into DIY and this will be my 8th build or so. Id love to have this for my passive mixing setup for the main bus. Espeically since ive used an SSL Dulaity at my school and like using small amounts of the bus comp on it.

I have some questions though:

1)Wh
ere do i get the rack case/encourse for this?

2) What about the power transformer?

3) Or any of the parts that aren't included from Sperants site for that matter? The Metter, VCAs, and the like. All the kits i have done up to this point have had everything included. Is there a favorite place to go? Im in the US if that matters.

Im sure these questions have been asked so sorry for the noob questions. I really like how this looks though and from what i have read sounds great!

Hoping this will be a stepping stone to get the SA-3A kit done next.

Thank you all,

Monte

Yea, it's a fantastic, classic buss comp.
1) You can get the faceplate from Serpent and the enclosure from Dan D @ Collectivecases.vom.
2) I believe I bought one or both of mine from Allied but Mouser, Digikey, and Newark likely have them too.
3) Hairball sells meters that fit well and work great.  It's really not hard to source the extra parts for this build.  Absolute breeze compared to some of the ground-up sourcing I've done.

  The build itself is very easy in a sense because there's little guesswork since everything is well documented and works perfect when put together correct.  What you need to do is check everything 2 or 3 times when installing as there are so many parts that you can go wrong if you rush.  I had 1 resistor wrong in my first one, the 2nd was flawless because I was patient.

Hey thank you for the reply!

I was looking at the Sa-3A BOM and saw the case place! Pretty cool!

I'm still confused on the PSU and transformer though. What do I need to get exactly? That's really the part of the build I just am not grasping. How do I pick one? What makes one better than the other??

Hairball! Of course. Really want a 500 1176 from them too. Saw they did the Sa 3a transformer bundle too.

I just am not super set on doing the PSU part on gear like this. All I've done is 500 series kits or similar.

Would the five fish audio one work? http://www.fivefishaudio.com/diy/psu2448/

It sounds like you haven't checked out the BOM on the first page of this thread yet.  That should clear up your confusion.  Lists all the extra parts you need incl model numbers.  If you still have questions, feel free to ask.

 

[Blackdawg]

Hello!

Im just getting into DIY and this will be my 8th build or so. Id love to have this for my passive mixing setup for the main bus. Espeically since ive used an SSL Dulaity at my school and like using small amounts of the bus comp on it.

I have some questions though:
1)Wh
ere do i get the rack case/encourse for this?

2) What about the power transformer?

3) Or any of the parts that aren't included from Sperants site for that matter? The Metter, VCAs, and the like. All the kits i have done up to this point have had everything included. Is there a favorite place to go? Im in the US if that matters.

Im sure these questions have been asked so sorry for the noob questions. I really like how this looks though and from what i have read sounds great!

Hoping this will be a stepping stone to get the SA-3A kit done next.

Thank you all,

Monte

Yea, it's a fantastic, classic buss comp.
1) You can get the faceplate from Serpent and the enclosure from Dan D @ Collectivecases.vom.
2) I believe I bought one or both of mine from Allied but Mouser, Digikey, and Newark likely have them too.
3) Hairball sells meters that fit well and work great.  It's really not hard to source the extra parts for this build.  Absolute breeze compared to some of the ground-up sourcing I've done.

  The build itself is very easy in a sense because there's little guesswork since everything is well documented and works perfect when put together correct.  What you need to do is check everything 2 or 3 times when installing as there are so many parts that you can go wrong if you rush.  I had 1 resistor wrong in my first one, the 2nd was flawless because I was patient.

Hey thank you for the reply!

I was looking at the Sa-3A BOM and saw the case place! Pretty cool!

I'm still confused on the PSU and transformer though. What do I need to get exactly? That's really the part of the build I just am not grasping. How do I pick one? What makes one better than the other??

Hairball! Of course. Really want a 500 1176 from them too. Saw they did the Sa 3a transformer bundle too.

I just am not super set on doing the PSU part on gear like this. All I've done is 500 series kits or similar.

Would the five fish audio one work? http://www.fivefishaudio.com/diy/psu2448/

It sounds like you haven't checked out the BOM on the first page of this thread yet.  That should clear up your confusion.  Lists all the extra parts you need incl model numbers.  If you still have questions, feel free to ask.

I guess my biggest question is where do you all source some of the parts? Are the favorite places? Some of the ones i find are in Europe and shipping is crazy!

And will the Five Fish PSU work?

Edit: Just went back through the BOM. Google'd the PSU PN. Mouser a good place?


Okay so here is my only question at this point:

Can you explain the difference between this power transformer kit:

http://www.fivefishstudios.com/diy/powertrafo/

Which i believe will work yes?

and this PSU:

http://www.fivefishstudios.com/diy/psu2448/

I just don't understand the difference and if one is better then the other.

 

[Blackdawg]

ha! I figured it out.

So the TRANSFORMER is for knocking down the input voltage of 110v to 18v or there abouts for the PSU. The PSU is what distributes the power to the comp.

right?

ANd i don't need a psu because one is included with the kit and pcb! I just need the transformer. Right?

I like the five fish one, will that work? I like that it comes with the AC socket.

Sorry for my silly ignorance. Making progress!

 

[Bowie]

ha! I figured it out.

So the TRANSFORMER is for knocking down the input voltage of 110v to 18v or there abouts for the PSU. The PSU is what distributes the power to the comp.

right?

ANd i don't need a psu because one is included with the kit and pcb! I just need the transformer. Right?

I like the five fish one, will that work? I like that it comes with the AC socket.

Sorry for my silly ignorance. Making progress!

I wouldn't try to simplify it so much.  Getting a kit to save yourself from buying a separate IEC socket is not the way to go because things like shipping add up when you're using multiple vendors.  That IEC will end up costing you $20 in the long-run instead of $2. 
  Shopping for parts is a good thing.  It educates you as to the options and aspects that go into the build and makes you mare capable of doing bigger things in the future.  After looking at the BOM again I remembered that last year I skipped the parts kit and ordered every item on my own, picking my favorite brands of resistors, caps, etc.  I did have to re-order a few things to get the sizes correct and such but I learned a TON about component selection and it helped my builds after that become even better.  not that you're ready to go to that level but at least put together a cart with the few items at the end of the BOM.  For things like switches, I sometimes prefer RadioShack as I can see and feel the actual switches, which is nice when you're not familiar with the actual part #.

In the power section; the PCB set comes with a PSU PCB.  You populate it with parts from the parts kit and simply add the power transformer to it.  The reason the kit doesn't come with certain power components is that they vary from country to country.

 

[Blackdawg]

ha! I figured it out.

So the TRANSFORMER is for knocking down the input voltage of 110v to 18v or there abouts for the PSU. The PSU is what distributes the power to the comp.

right?

ANd i don't need a psu because one is included with the kit and pcb! I just need the transformer. Right?

I like the five fish one, will that work? I like that it comes with the AC socket.

Sorry for my silly ignorance. Making progress!

I wouldn't try to simplify it so much.  Getting a kit to save yourself from buying a separate IEC socket is not the way to go because things like shipping add up when you're using multiple vendors.  That IEC will end up costing you $20 in the long-run instead of $2. 
  Shopping for parts is a good thing.  It educates you as to the options and aspects that go into the build and makes you mare capable of doing bigger things in the future.  After looking at the BOM again I remembered that last year I skipped the parts kit and ordered every item on my own, picking my favorite brands of resistors, caps, etc.  I did have to re-order a few things to get the sizes correct and such but I learned a TON about component selection and it helped my builds after that become even better.  not that you're ready to go to that level but at least put together a cart with the few items at the end of the BOM.  For things like switches, I sometimes prefer RadioShack as I can see and feel the actual switches, which is nice when you're not familiar with the actual part #.

In the power section; the PCB set comes with a PSU PCB.  You populate it with parts from the parts kit and simply add the power transformer to it.  The reason the kit doesn't come with certain power components is that they vary from country to country.

Thanks for the reply!

I know I don't feel I'm quiet up to ordering all my own parts yet. Mostly because I don't know the different brands and how they translate audio wise. Is there somewhere you could point me too that would give decent descriptions of different brands and how they sound? I get that the tolerance levels make a difference. And I should use everything below 1%. Does jumping to 0.1% make a big difference to the sound?

I did just by a full kit from someone on here that's never been opened with the quad vca upgrade. I will start populating the boards first before buying the other parts, mostly due to fund limitations.

Was shocked to find the case itself is 140! Oh well. Gonna be worth it!

I also found someone that put small adjustable resistors in the PSU to really give you the ability to dial in the output voltages. But he didn't say how he did it. Has anyone in here done that? Seems like a great idea to me.

 

[Bowie]

ha! I figured it out.

So the TRANSFORMER is for knocking down the input voltage of 110v to 18v or there abouts for the PSU. The PSU is what distributes the power to the comp.

right?

ANd i don't need a psu because one is included with the kit and pcb! I just need the transformer. Right?

I like the five fish one, will that work? I like that it comes with the AC socket.

Sorry for my silly ignorance. Making progress!

I wouldn't try to simplify it so much.  Getting a kit to save yourself from buying a separate IEC socket is not the way to go because things like shipping add up when you're using multiple vendors.  That IEC will end up costing you $20 in the long-run instead of $2. 
  Shopping for parts is a good thing.  It educates you as to the options and aspects that go into the build and makes you mare capable of doing bigger things in the future.  After looking at the BOM again I remembered that last year I skipped the parts kit and ordered every item on my own, picking my favorite brands of resistors, caps, etc.  I did have to re-order a few things to get the sizes correct and such but I learned a TON about component selection and it helped my builds after that become even better.  not that you're ready to go to that level but at least put together a cart with the few items at the end of the BOM.  For things like switches, I sometimes prefer RadioShack as I can see and feel the actual switches, which is nice when you're not familiar with the actual part #.

In the power section; the PCB set comes with a PSU PCB.  You populate it with parts from the parts kit and simply add the power transformer to it.  The reason the kit doesn't come with certain power components is that they vary from country to country.

Thanks for the reply!

I know I don't feel I'm quiet up to ordering all my own parts yet. Mostly because I don't know the different brands and how they translate audio wise. Is there somewhere you could point me too that would give decent descriptions of different brands and how they sound? I get that the tolerance levels make a difference. And I should use everything below 1%. Does jumping to 0.1% make a big difference to the sound?

I did just by a full kit from someone on here that's never been opened with the quad vca upgrade. I will start populating the boards first before buying the other parts, mostly due to fund limitations.

Was shocked to find the case itself is 140! Oh well. Gonna be worth it!

I also found someone that put small adjustable resistors in the PSU to really give you the ability to dial in the output voltages. But he didn't say how he did it. Has anyone in here done that? Seems like a great idea to me.

It's less about brands and more about certain series that give desirable performance specs.  Just keep reading and experimenting and you'll find your own faves.  There is no right or wrong way to go, everyone has their own preferences.
I don't expect you'll hear any benefit to .1% resistors. We're talking 1970s technology and some of us feel that the old DBX cans actually give a much more desirable vibe.  It's all about your goals and tastes. 
Regarding additional trimmer resistors, I don't see the point but if you need it fills a need, go for it.
I highly recommend reading through this whole thread before proceeding.

 

[Blackdawg]

ha! I figured it out.

So the TRANSFORMER is for knocking down the input voltage of 110v to 18v or there abouts for the PSU. The PSU is what distributes the power to the comp.

right?

ANd i don't need a psu because one is included with the kit and pcb! I just need the transformer. Right?

I like the five fish one, will that work? I like that it comes with the AC socket.

Sorry for my silly ignorance. Making progress!

I wouldn't try to simplify it so much.  Getting a kit to save yourself from buying a separate IEC socket is not the way to go because things like shipping add up when you're using multiple vendors.  That IEC will end up costing you $20 in the long-run instead of $2. 
  Shopping for parts is a good thing.  It educates you as to the options and aspects that go into the build and makes you mare capable of doing bigger things in the future.  After looking at the BOM again I remembered that last year I skipped the parts kit and ordered every item on my own, picking my favorite brands of resistors, caps, etc.  I did have to re-order a few things to get the sizes correct and such but I learned a TON about component selection and it helped my builds after that become even better.  not that you're ready to go to that level but at least put together a cart with the few items at the end of the BOM.  For things like switches, I sometimes prefer RadioShack as I can see and feel the actual switches, which is nice when you're not familiar with the actual part #.

In the power section; the PCB set comes with a PSU PCB.  You populate it with parts from the parts kit and simply add the power transformer to it.  The reason the kit doesn't come with certain power components is that they vary from country to country.

Thanks for the reply!

I know I don't feel I'm quiet up to ordering all my own parts yet. Mostly because I don't know the different brands and how they translate audio wise. Is there somewhere you could point me too that would give decent descriptions of different brands and how they sound? I get that the tolerance levels make a difference. And I should use everything below 1%. Does jumping to 0.1% make a big difference to the sound?

I did just by a full kit from someone on here that's never been opened with the quad vca upgrade. I will start populating the boards first before buying the other parts, mostly due to fund limitations.

Was shocked to find the case itself is 140! Oh well. Gonna be worth it!

I also found someone that put small adjustable resistors in the PSU to really give you the ability to dial in the output voltages. But he didn't say how he did it. Has anyone in here done that? Seems like a great idea to me.

It's less about brands and more about certain series that give desirable performance specs.  Just keep reading and experimenting and you'll find your own faves.  There is no right or wrong way to go, everyone has their own preferences.
I don't expect you'll hear any benefit to .1% resistors. We're talking 1970s technology and some of us feel that the old DBX cans actually give a much more desirable vibe.  It's all about your goals and tastes. 
Regarding additional trimmer resistors, I don't see the point but if you need it fills a need, go for it.
I highly recommend reading through this whole thread before proceeding.

The kit comes with the THAT VCAs right? I'm all about vibe. I'll have to try both.

Woof, 70 pages. Late night reading here I come!

Thanks again! Hopefully have one of these up and running myself in a few weeks.