So many cool microphones clones and no 1 audio samples / comparison

[Matador]

R2d2, I wish it were so easy. Just TOO many variables for me to make comparisons between originals and copies/inspired builds worthwhile.

Regarding copies (don’t like using “clones”, cause they aren’t) - the capsule, for me, is 90% of the battle, followed by transformer and tube. You get a GREAT capsule, and everything gets easier. I’ve tried all kinds of component swaps, but capsule changes are the most dramatic. Period.

Yes! In fact I would argue it's the talent, in a room, and mike position, making even more difference than the actual microphone used.

 

[mics]

R2d2, I wish it were so easy. Just TOO many variables for me to make comparisons between originals and copies/inspired builds worthwhile.

Regarding copies (don’t like using “clones”, cause they aren’t) - the capsule, for me, is 90% of the battle, followed by transformer and tube. You get a GREAT capsule, and everything gets easier. I’ve tried all kinds of component swaps, but capsule changes are the most dramatic. Period.

You are so right regarding capsules. 

Ive seen and heard so many clones by manufaturers large and small.  What do 99% of them have in common?  Cheap chinese capsules and truly, that lets them down!

Many spend $100’s on transformers and tubes and pair it with a $50 capsule!!! WHY!!!!!!

Here is a reachout I receaved from a GDIY member just a few hours ago and words like his make long days machining worthwhile!

“Thanks so much Ben!

On a side note, last night I did a big shootout with various DIY tube mics with fellow GroupDIY member. We both have used Beesneez mic capsules in our builds and found that though all mics we tested sounded great, there's just something really special about the mics with the beesneez capsules in them. Something more 3D sounding that pops right out of the speakers. I don't know how you do it but just keep it up. Your mics are magic! ”

Thanks Ken for your kind words!

Try this out next time you make a mic!

Buy a great capsule and pair it with a cheap donor circuit before your build.  Hear what ot does!  Imagine what it will do in a quality circuit!

Enjoy.

Cheers

 

[lkipod]

Not caring about gear or sound? Hu?

Could not disagree more!
Why do we clone nuemann and not mxl?
Rare is it that diy people have the ears of a working studio engineer,  I value what I learn from them,  Think your ears and knowledge of mics and the end product, sound files, you know better than  say eddy Cramer? Chris lord ? Who have produced more music than many of us will,  Trying to trash both is very short sighted,  a electronic engineering echo chamber is tubeless, all  solid state, and better ummm on paper anyway,  like the whole tml line.

If you claim to clone, sound file shootouts back up that claim,
It’s very very hard thing to do, and I think the capsule has a great deal to do with it, nuemann has got that down, and charge a ton for it, I have yet to see a capsule plot like a nuemann capsule, even with the crude system I use,  the difference is apparent, granted I have not tried them all, I can not afford to,  so I learn from what others say, look at what they are using, listen to every shootout I can, and then sort through that data, hardly worthless.  Echo chambers and not listening to anyone is indeed worthless! Imho.
I am Gladly still learning and in my mid 60s

Why so aggressive?
I think what TillM meant was that the talk around at GS is often VERY biased by marketing hype, while hear IMHO it is more about getting great sound by ourselves.
Yes of course we want great sound, but does only a Neumann with a 50 year old capsule sound good?
New Neumann capsules are another story, but a lot of these shootouts are done with the old capsules, which vary in sound.

Also I remember a converter shootout at GS where someone collected frequency plots of loopback tests and nulling them with the original to see the artifacts. Some cheap converters came out better than a lot of hyped stuff, the thread was deleted by a mod.
Don't famous engineers get often paid to promote a product?
So in this biased world I think we can safely say that the only way to evaluate if a mic sounds good is to try it in a given situation, if it fits, great! If not often we like to tweak it till it does.
Or even better, build another one
Cheers
Moshe

 

[chipss36]

Why so aggressive?

Care to explain this? What’s aggressive exactly?
That I do do not agree?  And just fall in line with your thinking?

null test work as expected, and have proven a few tests to be what they were said to be.
Like a certain recent U87 shootout.


Thinking all tests are bad because one was flawed ?
What would you call that?
I see a flaw in your thinking here  should I now disregard everything you say? Of course not!

I will still continue to think the best ears in the business are sound engineers that work every day and are pros at what they do,  I value their opinions. I can not complete with the volume of gear they have, nor the great rooms, to compare this to that.  Rare would be a diy guy that could.


As I do the electronic engineers that built the classics...I had the honor of chatting with Rupert neve once,  just as exciting as chatting with with Eddie Cramer,  it’s about balancing the two. 

Wisdom is knowing one would not exist without the other.

My favorite diy mic has been a total flop with every sound engineer that has used it.
I still love it, it tracks and mixes well for me.  My customers hate it.  That’s the danger of burying your head in the sand. And another lesson learned.

My point is I disagree whole heartedly with one or the other way of thinking,
I have learned over many years it’s not this or that. But this...and this....and this........ And the mean of it all.

I have built stuff that runs every day in working studios, that gives me great joy, I also have a bunch of total epic fails as well.  Or what I call learning.  My goal is to build gear that makes music.  Not sit in the pile.

 

[r2d2]

Thanks to all for post ,
overall for who post audio samples links !!!

And (as well) here another interesting comparison :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMiuElvxEFw
peace

ps:
hope that the 22$ mic do not be "single time use" like plastic cup ……
and as you all just know there is not best mic that can "save" bad  singer…..

 

[DerEber]

here another interesting comparison :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMiuElvxEFw
peace

Haha, this one is great!  ;D

 

[r2d2]

Haha, this one is great!  ;D

…and here another interesting comparison about various mic type ( iPhone included )
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgU4xOXMNR8

it is so curious how audio recording-editing-mixing can be done with a computer daw next to ears over the table…
(hi speed funs noise , vibrations , and related….)

 

[e.oelberg]

I have something.
It is a good example to illustrate how tricky it is: It's an Elamoid tub mic, with too many values changed to to be a clone, different tube too with Tim Campbell CT12.  30 cm apart is a AKG 414EB with a Teflon capsule. Both mics are set to omni.
They are about 3 meters from the source, the grand piano. Concerning placement: If I use a pair of my Elamoids instead they sound indistinguishable, so placement is not a concern. You should split the stereo and maybe normalize them, they don't have the same gain

here you are: https://wolke7.grandprixdamour.com/index.php/s/li30TnJSgcHAekX/download