team politics talking points.

[fallout]

Well, that was certainly evasive. I was waiting to see if you'd address any possible reasons for the discrepancy in homicide rates, or even answer why you're so concerned about NYC when so many other places have higher crime rates. Oh, and in case you were wondering, large percentages of the guns that illegally flow into NY come from Republican-run, "gun freedumb" states like the one I live in--so there's a really excellent chance NYC's homicide rate would be even lower if it weren't for pro-gun extremist governors in states like Georgia and Texas.

But go ahead--pick on NYC. Then maybe you can switch over & pick on SF for a while. It is the Republican way, after all.

I posted the article because I've worked in, lived in and near NYC my entire life. Sadly, it's back into the shit hole I remember in the 80s. Might as well bring the peep shows in Times Square back for nostalgia. The junkies now littering the streets again are a nice touch.

I'd welcome Bloomberg back at this point..

Democrats sure know how to run a city into the ground. I'll give them that..

On a positive note.. The exodus of folks fleeing the city has done wonders for my real estate value across the river. Even the hipsters in Brooklyn are fleeing.. hahaha

 

[JohnRoberts]

I posted the article because I've worked in, lived in and near NYC my entire life. Sadly, it's back into the shit hole I remember in the 80s. Might as well bring the peep shows in Times Square back.

pass

I'd welcome Bloomberg back at this point..

before Bloomberg, Rudy Giuliani cleaned up a lot of the organized crime in NYC, I recall trade shows in NYC were always a hassle dealing with the unions before him.

Democrats sure know how to run a city into the ground. I'll give them that..

the people who voted them in bear some responsibility.

On a positive note.. The exodus of folks fleeing the city has done wonders for my real estate value across the river. Even the hipsters in Brooklyn are fleeing.. hahaha

I have a friend who owned about 7 acres in Bergen county, he had a a roadside stand (old hook farms) selling vegetables some grown on his farm. I bet that land has appreciated even more than last time I saw him. But that's another story...

JR

 

[fallout]

before Bloomberg, Rudy Giuliani cleaned up a lot of the organized crime in NYC, I recall trade shows in NYC were always a hassle dealing with the unions before him.

I lived in the city when Rudy was mayor.. What a different place it was. I didn't appreciate him at the time (ahhhhhh, to be young and carefree).

the people who voted them in bear some responsibility.

Of course. Those same people are the ones fleeing. Reap what you sow.

I have a friend who owned about 7 acres in Bergen county, he had a a roadside stand (old hook farms) selling vegetables some grown on his farm. I bet that land has appreciated even more than last time I saw him. But that's another story...

7 acres in Bergen county? Nice! I'm sure he'll do well..

 

[JohnRoberts]

I lived in the city when Rudy was mayor.. What a different place it was. I didn't appreciate him at the time (ahhhhhh, to be young and carefree).

Of course. Those same people are the ones fleeing. Reap what you sow.

7 acres in Bergen county? Nice! I'm sure he'll do well..

When Peavey was purchasing Crest Audio, I was on the team sent up there to kick the tires. After we decided to purchase Crest, I ended up spending some time working in the NJ Crest office and living in the Peavey company apartment in Hackensack (town I happened to be born in).

I managed to get back to my old home town (Emerson) once for dinner, and even dropped in on Bruce's roadside farm stand (old Hook Farms) one weekend. It was nice to reconnect with Bruce and Mary after several decades, we were childhood friends. He was smart enough to get the property classified as farm land to keep the taxes low (Bergen County ).

I have more stories but thats enough for now...

JR

 

[Dan Kennedy]

I traveled to NYC multiple times in the early 70's as a footloose teen. Hitch-hiking, probably a death sentence now, a 20ish hour trip back then. Truly an education for a naive Minnesotan. Traveled again in the early 90's for AES tradeshows. Amazing difference. FJB and his minions.

 

[Brian Roth]

Hmmmm....NYC memories.....

I have always lived in the Southwest and now Midwest. Back in the early 1980's, the manager of the studio where I worked (I was chief engineer) and I attended an AES show in NYC. It was a serious shock. Graffiti on everything (I recall seeing Wonder Bread delivery trucks with spray painted words on the side that I would NEVER say to my Mom) as well on the facia of the hotel. Stacks of garbage on the streets and dodging rats the size of an opossum.

Several years later, NYC was almost a place I wanted to visit again. I think Gulliana (sp?) was mayor.

Bri

 

[crazydoc]

1964-65, lived in the projects in south Bronx, then to the East Village, worked near times square sorting junk mail, weed, acid, no plans, no responsibilities. Those were the good old days.

 

[JohnRoberts]

For another positive note, SF voters recall progressive DA Boudin with 61%, compared to 39%.

JR

 

[fallout]

I'm a little younger than you folks and started visiting NYC in my early teens (late 80s). I grew up 3 PATH train stops away, across the river in Jersey City. Even with all the shit, piss and puke, it was a fun place for a youngster, wasn't the safest and easy to get in trouble. This was during the end of the Koch and the Dinkins administrations. The place was still a mess littered with hookers, junkies and criminals but I loved hitting every record shop humanly possible, brown bagging a beer (in my early teens), smoking pot and wandering for hours.

Then Rudy became mayor and made NYC a place you'd actually want to live in and I did just that. Playing in bands, partying, girls, everything a young man could want in a vibrant and SAFE city. To quote @crazydoc, those were the good old days for me. I wouldn't trade them for anything. I was lucky to be there at the time.

9/11 was the turning point, not only in NYC but the world in general, I suppose (thanks to the idiot Bush Jr., talk about voter remorse). Bloomberg was a bit of a tool but NYC was still a decent place but you could feel the shift. I wisely moved to the burbs across the river and never looked back. Still had to go into the city for work and seeing the decline on a daily basis validated my decision to leave. DeBlasio ran the city into the ground and Adams is following course. It's a shame and I do hope it has another renaissance although I'm reaching the age that there's not much appeal for me either way.

 

[hodad]

I am not aware of a "republican" solution...

That's because there isn't one.

There's an old episode of the Simpsons that is essentially the Ned Flanders origin story. Ned is an incorrigible child with ultra-permissive beatnik parents. They finally take incorrigible Ned to a specialist, who asks about their parenting techniques. Ned's beatnik mom says, "We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas."

Add in some thoughts and prayers, and that sums up the GOP on gun violence. Inaction (or worse) is their only move. Trying to do something that might reduce the number of children slaughtered in school classrooms is beyond them. They've tried nothing, and where possible they try to keep others from trying something.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Good luck demonizing all republicans in time for Nov vote. In case I haven't mentioned it I am a republican voter.

It looks like ABC is doing a big production of a prime time broadcast of the Jan 6 congressional hearing. We'll have to see how gullible the public is to be force fed blatant partisan posturing.

Justice is supposed to be applied blindly but there are remarkable differences between this protest event and all others. Law breakers need to be prosecuted but DAs don't have the authority to punish one group severely while letting others walk.

I can't predict the future but your team is fully invested in playing up this Jan 6th protest to reframe the mid term election. Good luck with that, I expect voters to be more consumed by inflation and energy prices.

I will DVR this political theater, as well as POTUS appearing on the Jimmy Kimmel show. I'm sure that will be an "inciteful" interview.

JR

 

[hodad]

Good luck demonizing all republicans in time for Nov vote.

Nice deflection. Ignore Republicans' absolute unwillingness to do anything about gun violence, and claim that anyone who criticizes their pathetic inaction is "demonizing" them. How very.....Republican of you.

 

[JohnRoberts]

How very democrat of you....

I recall multiple bipartisan legislative attempts that were thwarted. It looks like the democratic leadership is trying to make this a nov campaign issue.

My search engine has turned more democrat that usual but I recall Tim Scott senator from SC leading multiple legislative attempts that were blocked by democrats.

JR

 

[JohnRoberts]

About a month ago the senate passed a SCOTUS family security bill to provide better security to SCOTUS jurists and their family (after the Roe v Wade leak). The speaker of the house and majority leader have not expressed any support and declined to bring it to a vote.

I won't try to read their minds.

The CA man arrested outside Justice Kavanaugh's home with a knife, gun, and burglary tools shared with police that he intended harm to Justice Kavanaugh.

JR

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Nice deflection. Ignore Republicans' absolute unwillingness to do anything about gun violence, and claim that anyone who criticizes their pathetic inaction is "demonizing" them. How very.....Republican of you.

Have you bothered to review the data? The problem is largely driven by inner city gang violence, drug trafficking, etc. A tiny fraction of gun owners are responsible for the vast majority of gun crime. Hint: they aren't NRA members and most acquired their weapons illegally. Many are already "prohibited" by law from possessing, much less buying firearms because they are convicted felons.

Now, which party keeps releasing violent repeat offenders? Which party failed to prosecute straw purchasers? Which party's terrible social policies over the past five plus decades have destroyed traditional family values and enabled the breakdown of society, particularly in cities they have controlled for decades?

 

[JohnRoberts]

It looks like ABC is doing a big production of a prime time broadcast of the Jan 6 congressional hearing. We'll have to see how gullible the public is to be force fed blatant partisan posturing.

I just set my DVR to record tonights prime time dog and pony show.

Justice is supposed to be applied blindly but there are remarkable differences between this protest event and all others. Law breakers need to be prosecuted but DAs don't have the authority to punish one group severely while letting others walk.

I heard a joke going around the internets that congress should outlaw all the weapons used by the Jan 6 protestors. IIRC The only guns used were by police/security who shot and killed one unarmed protestor.

I can't predict the future but your team is fully invested in playing up this Jan 6th protest to reframe the mid term election. Good luck with that, I expect voters to be more consumed by inflation and energy prices.

I will DVR this political theater, as well as POTUS appearing on the Jimmy Kimmel show. I'm sure that will be an "inciteful" interview.

JR

I just finished watching last nights Kimmel show, besides POTUS repeating all of his familiar disinformation he came up with a few new ones. Remarkably he claimed that the US economy is the fastest growing economy in the world, world, world.... Reality is that the US economy contracted 1.4% during the first quarter (one more quarter of contraction and we are officially in a recession). For comparison China's economy is growing 8% so more than a little faster than our economy. While China's numbers are not that trustworthy they are likely growing not shrinking like us.

I had to stop myself from hitting the FF button multiple times, I have no kind way to speculate about how POTUS could possibly make those erroneous statements.

JR

 

[cyrano]

I am not aware of a "republican" solution... I don't think that way.

You don't think that way? I'm flabbergasted. You continually blame the other side, but you fail completely to be constructive. Yet, you're a smart fellow. How shall I take that, John?

There is bipartisan legislation tangled up in the congress for years... Shooting events like this (these?) last one turn into campaign fundraising trigger events. Biden's prime time speech was exactly that (send money).

These? That stuff goes back over a century. From the Tulsa massacre on. there's probably earlier ones, but that's the oldest one I remember. In case you've missed that one:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_massacre

I have been wrestling about this stuff elsewhere for the last few days... Off the top of my head the short list for potential improvements is 1) Harden schools (we can hire all the ex-cops who resigned due to defunding and bad DAs).

So, the answer is even more guns.

2) Don't arm suicidal, mentally ill young men... Red flag laws and wider use of background checks, might catch a few...

A few really isn't enough, John.

It seems the FBI knows too many of these shooters before the act... we are apparently not connecting all the dots in a timely fashion. I don't pretend that this is easy, but it seems important.

The FBI knows a lot. They're getting sued for a billion, I've heard. And it looks like they'll have to pay.

EDIT: link added
https://www.cbsnews.com/boston/news/simone-biles-aly-raisman-gymnasts-larry-nassar-fbi-lawsuit/
Have you ever asked yourself why?

That's a start... don't get overly focussed on magazine size and types of weapons that may only make a difference in the margin... We need to deal with the people among us who are lost and need mental health assistance.

JR

While that's true, it's not gonna solve the problem. Only a fraction of the shooters were known before and since there's no universal healthcare in the US it's not going to work.

Hec, we have universal healthcare and some people with mental problems still fall through the cracks, for the simple reason they don't go to see the MD.

Have you ever seen the numbers for the UK?

Since the abolishment of gun ownership, deaths by firearms have dropped tremendously. Up to the point that UK police don't even carry guns. Sure, there are armed police units, but that doesn't apply to the average policeman in the street.

There rally is no reason to stick to 200 year old mantra. Even if it is in the constitution.

And, yeah, I know, it won't solve the problem in a short term. That's the hard part.

In the same context, US police have been getting some training to shoot not to kill. From Israeli police. In one county in Georgia...

Same problem, same mindset.

 

[cyrano]

As opposed to the alternative:

-Ignore actual data
-Ignore facts and reasoning
-Appeal to pure, raw emotion
-Apply ad hominem attacks to anyone who points out the above three
-Pretend you know how to solve a problem you don't even understand

So, that's the only alternative?

 

[crazydoc]

The CA man arrested outside Justice Kavanaugh's home with a knife, gun, and burglary tools shared with police that he intended harm to Justice Kavanaugh.

JR

Just another crazy guy in a "well regulated militia" with a gun, probably bought legally. 330 million people with 400 million guns - what could go wrong? Looks like we'll just have to lie in the bed we made.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Just another crazy guy in a "well regulated militia" with a gun, probably bought legally. 330 million people with 400 million guns - what could go wrong? Looks like we'll just have to lie in the bed we made.

There is a lot we can and should do, but not while in an emotional frenzy.

I have long said that words have consequences and we have seen the partisan rhetoric ratchet up significantly over the last several years. The constant demonizing of opposition by both sides does not encourage thoughtful debate, instead if you believe the opposition is truly evil the righteous thing to do is not talk.
===
You are old enough to remember when mental health problem patients were institutionalized for their own safety and the community's. Now that is only an option for the very wealthy. Instead we force the mentally unstable to fend for themselves on the sidewalks of cities. Maybe we need new better antipsychotic drugs, patients don't usually continue taking their prescriptions without supervision because they don't like the side effects. Privacy laws restrict our ability to share status of compromised individuals.

This is probably an oversimplification, but this problem has been festering for decades.

JR