Twitter

[AnalogPackrat]

I am a big dummy, but wouldn't taxing unrealized gains impact anyone with a 401K or similar investment account? Talking about working stiffs here....not the billionaires.

Bri

Of course. And don't forget your home. If your local market is booming you get to pay taxes on those unrealized gains as well, even if you have no plans to move. You might be forced to move, in fact. It is a patently stupid idea.

 

[Tubetec]

https://groupdiy.com/threads/the-argument-clinic.82414/

 

[fallout]

The outrage over the Twitter files seems highly selective and specific, with a Trump white house coordinating closely with favorable news outlets seeming to pass without comment here on GroupDIY.

Apples to oranges (no pun intended.. haha)

How can you compare news outlets to Twitter? You're reaching..

 

[Tubetec]

ever heard the saying
Birds of a feather .......

 

[john12ax7]

I am a big dummy, but wouldn't taxing unrealized gains impact anyone with a 401K or similar investment account? Talking about working stiffs here....not the billionaires.

Bri

It would make no difference to a tax deferred account like a 401k

You can debate taxing unrealized gains in general, it's not the best solution, but also not as big of a deal as some claim.

Basically everything in current tax law goes against the working stiffs. Employees often pay a higher % than those who employ them. It's a rigged system, that for some reason exploitees defend the exploiters.

 

[Tubetec]

Its like Heuston we have a problem
but people are so busy arguing about which side of the fence the problem is on it all turns to noise , thats so called social medial

filtered noise ,with an agenda

 

[Tubetec]

Ever get the feeling you were duped?

its universal, soldier,

 

[JohnRoberts]

Why not? The net effect is a massive distortion in favor of those who already have the most.

Why shouldn't unrealized gains of multi-billionaires be taxed?

If you do that you will need to let them deduct their unrealized losses too. Elon would have a pretty nice write off this year.

JR

 

[john12ax7]

If you do that you will need to let them deduct their unrealized losses too.

Yes, you just use mark to market accounting for everything. Super easy with things like stocks, not so easy with private illiquid assets. That dichotomy is more of the issue. The concept itself is actually fine and even has some benefits, as it would minimize destructive financial bubbles.

 

[cyrano]

Its like Heuston we have a problem
but people are so busy arguing about which side of the fence the problem is on it all turns to noise , thats so called social medial

filtered noise ,with an agenda

Social media are the amplifier, not the source.

JG Ballard once said: "The environment is so full of television, party political broadcasts and advertising campaigns that you hardly need to do anything."

As long as we don't realise we're all in the same boat, the powerful can do as they please. Please stop giving the press, TV and social media their importance. Go outside, meet others. Grab a beer and see what's out there.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Yes, you just use mark to market accounting for everything. Super easy with things like stocks, not so easy with private illiquid assets. That dichotomy is more of the issue. The concept itself is actually fine and even has some benefits, as it would minimize destructive financial bubbles.

Assuming we have reliable market pricing to use. For stocks and bonds the accurate market price is what you just sold or bought it for. For more unrealized asset gains we have house values. I expect this idea to be a non-starter, but they slipped some tax changes (increases, or reduced deductions) in the omnibus bill that will likely affect small business growth.

===

Speaking of income gains, if/when student loan debt gets forgiven, that debt relief is in effect taxable income.

JR

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Yes, you just use mark to market accounting for everything. Super easy with things like stocks, not so easy with private illiquid assets.

Who's doing the accounting? Who pays for it? More complexity is not good and not free. It just grows more government.

That dichotomy is more of the issue. The concept itself is actually fine and even has some benefits, as it would minimize destructive financial bubbles.

It is not "actually fine." How much more tax revenue is needed? Why? Will other taxes be reduced/eliminated (that'll be the day)? Taxes aren't there to control markets.

 

[john12ax7]

Quite a way to end 2022

 

[JohnRoberts]

"be the magic you want to see in the world" and to always treat others with respect, kindness and compassion (Disney).

JR

 

[Matador]

Speaking of income gains, if/when student loan debt gets forgiven, that debt relief is in effect taxable income.

Federal tax free, and state income tax free in 43 states (not Mississippi though...go figure!)

The fact that a student debt forgiveness might be taxable is the EXACT problem being described here.

Whereas an endowment (a great vehicle for passing on wealth) is not only deductible as a charitable contribution, the interest payments can be passed from one generation to the next as part of a trust (and those are deductible too!)

 

[JohnRoberts]

The tax impact of debt forgiveness or cancellation depends on your individual facts and circumstances. Generally, if you borrow money from a commercial lender and the lender later cancels or forgives the debt, you may have to include the cancelled amount in income for tax purposes. The lender is usually required to report the amount of the canceled debt to you and the IRS on a Form 1099-C, Cancellation of Debt. There are several exceptions to the taxability of cancelled debt, such as insolvency or bankruptcy.

It looks like federal taxes are waived in the 2021 "American Rescue Plan?" legislation. A small handful of states resisted forgiving state taxes on the debt relief. (MS, NC, and IN).

Since the votes have already been harvested in Nov, while the debt relief is held up in court this is still to be determined.

I recall reading in the classic "Democracy in America" written by french historian/philosopher Alex de Tocqueville, that democracy will be dead after the politicians figure out that they can bribe voters with our own money.

JR

[edit- don't take tax advice from blowhards on the internet.../edit]

 

[crazydoc]

I've almost never perused twitter before, but reading opinions there tonight about Damar Hamlin's football trauma has shown me that a large fraction of ignorant egotistical morons (probably a reflection of the general population) inhabit that space.

 

[Brian Roth]

@crazydoc...I also gave up wasting time with Twitter, Facebook, etc. a long time ago. After all, the Brewery is "plenty noisy". <g>

However, from 3rd-party reports I've seen from friends who follow that crapola, it seems the "Twitterverse" or whatever it's called is already blaming Damar's collapse because he had his Covid shots.

Bri

 

[cyrano]

I've almost never perused twitter before, but reading opinions there tonight about Damar Hamlin's football trauma has shown me that a large fraction of ignorant egotistical morons (probably a reflection of the general population) inhabit that space.

Twitter, reddit and others were fine when populated with only geeks in the very beginning.

Once the general population discovered them, it turned into the same landscape most of the classic media have become in the 20th century.

The only difference is your newspaper or TV don't talk back. You can swear as much as you like, it doesn't do anything.

 

[JohnRoberts]

I've almost never perused twitter before, but reading opinions there tonight about Damar Hamlin's football trauma has shown me that a large fraction of ignorant egotistical morons (probably a reflection of the general population) inhabit that space.

My twitter account is just like my bitcoin investment , namely non-existant.

One of the few miscreants we ever banned permanently years ago, was consumed by cutting and pasting inflammatory tweets. After being told multiple times to stop, he didn't, so was stopped.

===

Twitter with less censorship will reflect the public sentiment for better and worse. Sadly it is only a tiny fraction with inflated self importance, that have the loudest voices. If these loud inflammatory voices get less amplification (stability compensation), that should be some improvement. Just like compensation does not discriminate what signals it slows down, loud voices from all sides need to be damped. Not boosted but not cancelled.

JR