mcfarlane_audio
Well-known member
i think thats what was alluded to earlier (DSP sidechain)
in the discussion of pwm compressors ( crane song trakker is one ex. ??)
in the discussion of pwm compressors ( crane song trakker is one ex. ??)
Cult DIY project: need your input
- Thread starter Igor
- Start date
Help Support GroupDIY Audio Forum:
tommypiper
Well-known member
TomWaterman said:
Check out the Vifa Studio. I saw a kit from Madisound earlier. Haven't built it yet, but have heard from others they are great. There's lots of references to studio monitoring in the design and descriptions of parts on Madisound's site. Try a search. It's all DIY.
There are many, many, high quality, studio-monitor-quality, or better, speaker kits and DIY designs out there. Or design and make your own. There are books about how to do it. It's not hard. Most studios just buy something based on name brand, and most "studio monitors" are in fact mediocre quality. There is not a large market for DIY speakers dedicated for studio use, because as mentioned, studios just buy off the shelf. But that doesn't mean there aren't wonderful studio-monitor type DIY projects out there with better quality than the name brands, they just don't have the "studio monitor" target. A pet peeve of mine: I hate Genelecs; and many other "standard" monitors. But that's another story. Let's not start.
I think this project would be very cool, but they are already available in abundance. And may be somewhat out of Igor's scope in this first cult project, he'll tell us what he thinks... Regarding converters. I'm all for a top quality converter set. Again, this is not something new though. So many good, good quality converters are out there at all price ranges. AES and other special things are easily available. Again, this is really tweaking a standard product line, not something new or revolutionary, ...as much as we'd all love to have the best...
These are projects we should get started here. But because solutions already exist in many forms, may not be the best idea for the "cult" project. IMHO.
bradb said:
This could be great. I have been looking for something like this for a while but havent seen it.
The other thing that could be cool would be a small 4 channel mixer. It would have to be simple but not to simple, this is the trick. Used for blending say 3 mics on a gtr cab down to one and print to DAW or Tape right away. I would love something like this. It would help keep some large console MOJO and be easy to travel with. Its an idea I have been kicking around for awhile.
ryansteele
Well-known member
how about some sort of audio router device? relay based, 48 analog channels, could also route a few spdif or aes channels. controllable via usb and a little app/plugin, or even via ethernet and a webpage. basically a super patchbay, no patch cables required, just a matrix on your screen.
now that i think about it, im sure this exists.
now that i think about it, im sure this exists.
Skylar
Well-known member
ryansteele said:
That does exist:
http://www.violetaudio.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=19
It's $2095 and only gives you 8 channels.
Instead of using relays, they're using Multiplexers.
For a balanced 8 channel unit, you'd need something like 56 DPDT relays—or 64 if you want an "off" position for each channel.
48 channel, and then you're talking about thousands of relays!
Unless there's a better way to do it that I'm not thinking about. ?
jensenmann
Well-known member
You can use multiplexers only upto 7,5V. If the level is higher you get lotsa distortion. In a console that´s fine because internal levels are lower than outside. But If you want to built a 48ch router it means 48 pads, followed by the multiplexers and 48 gain amps to bring the signal back to the outside worlds level. It´s quite a job to solder all that. ;D
My idea of a Cult DIY project (some of it's been mentioned before, but I'll include it anyway):
Small, 8 channel table top mixer with the following:
Channel features:
- line inputs on all 8 channels
- one stereo, pre-fade Cue send with pan
- two switchable pre/post fade, mono aux sends with variable return levels to both Main and Cue busses (let the singer hear themselves with reverb/delay while you monitor dry)
- channels 1 and 2 with selectable line/mic inputs (transformer+DOA)
- channels 3 and 4 with selectable line/DI inputs
- direct outs on these first four channels (go straight into the converters)
- Cue/Aux sends should be able to drive headphones and have send level control
Master section should have:
- separate DAW input with own level control, assignable to Main buss
- ability to monitor several sources (Main buss, Cue buss, Aux1, Aux2, DAW input, CD player, Tape machine, etc.)
- two headphone outputs with level control
Extra features for "Cult" status:
- make the mixers linkable (24, 32 channel summing anyone? Each mixer would have a summed output of the Main, Cue, Aux1 and Aux2 buss on a 7 pin Neutrik connector. There would be provisions for four to five 7 pin input connectors on each box. These could be left blank apart from the "Master" mixer, to which the outputs of the 7 pin connectors of all the other mixers could be connected. We'd then have a sort of "bucket summing" of the Main, Cue and Aux busses per eight channels which would feed the main mixer.)
- D-sub connector along with 1/4" jack input for line inputs for flexibility (have these mixers sit next to each musician for their own foldback monitoring with just a single cable running to each mixer)
- D-sub "feed-through" output for the line inputs (just a direct connection to the line input - if you're recording a live performance you can use your awesome DIY preamps, connect them to this box for monitoring and use the feed through output to send the signal from the mic pre to the Mackie FOH mixer line inputs, no Y-cables necessary)
With these features, this box should be be pretty much everything one needs to have sitting on their table while recording with a DAW, and would find loads of additional uses due to the flexibility afforded by the various functions.
Cheers,
Dan
Small, 8 channel table top mixer with the following:
Channel features:
- line inputs on all 8 channels
- one stereo, pre-fade Cue send with pan
- two switchable pre/post fade, mono aux sends with variable return levels to both Main and Cue busses (let the singer hear themselves with reverb/delay while you monitor dry)
- channels 1 and 2 with selectable line/mic inputs (transformer+DOA)
- channels 3 and 4 with selectable line/DI inputs
- direct outs on these first four channels (go straight into the converters)
- Cue/Aux sends should be able to drive headphones and have send level control
Master section should have:
- separate DAW input with own level control, assignable to Main buss
- ability to monitor several sources (Main buss, Cue buss, Aux1, Aux2, DAW input, CD player, Tape machine, etc.)
- two headphone outputs with level control
Extra features for "Cult" status:
- make the mixers linkable (24, 32 channel summing anyone? Each mixer would have a summed output of the Main, Cue, Aux1 and Aux2 buss on a 7 pin Neutrik connector. There would be provisions for four to five 7 pin input connectors on each box. These could be left blank apart from the "Master" mixer, to which the outputs of the 7 pin connectors of all the other mixers could be connected. We'd then have a sort of "bucket summing" of the Main, Cue and Aux busses per eight channels which would feed the main mixer.)
- D-sub connector along with 1/4" jack input for line inputs for flexibility (have these mixers sit next to each musician for their own foldback monitoring with just a single cable running to each mixer)
- D-sub "feed-through" output for the line inputs (just a direct connection to the line input - if you're recording a live performance you can use your awesome DIY preamps, connect them to this box for monitoring and use the feed through output to send the signal from the mic pre to the Mackie FOH mixer line inputs, no Y-cables necessary)
With these features, this box should be be pretty much everything one needs to have sitting on their table while recording with a DAW, and would find loads of additional uses due to the flexibility afforded by the various functions.
Cheers,
Dan
ryansteele
Well-known member
Skylar said:
yeah, thats a lot to go through just to replace a patchbay. probably be easier to just train a bunch of monkeys to work our patchbays for us.
lofi
Well-known member
all the decent audio gear we clone is old and pretty simple, just very very good at their one little action.
cant we just go for a knockout simple piece rather than some 'look at me, I'm reet hard to make' piece?
then build the next knockout piece thats in perfect balance with it etc.
Iain
cant we just go for a knockout simple piece rather than some 'look at me, I'm reet hard to make' piece?
then build the next knockout piece thats in perfect balance with it etc.
Iain
Baltimore
Well-known member
lofi said:
I agree. I also worry about digitally controlled analog not working properly or becoming obsolete.
I vote for another classic Eq or comp. *cough* 550b *cough*.
iangomes
Well-known member
Baltimore said:
oh baby, I like the way you think!
JW
Well-known member
How about trying to clone the M49? Noyman that is.
M49 clone would be great (not sure though it's the right topic...), not very easy, but Skylar is doing such a fine work with the 47, so it may be possible...
Maybe a top quality channel strip could be very interesting for all ?
Thanks Igor for all your great projects.
All the best.
Eric
Maybe a top quality channel strip could be very interesting for all ?
Thanks Igor for all your great projects.
All the best.
Eric
bradb
Well-known member
how about a great, versitile EQ that can go into that new 11-space 500 rack thats being developed on the forum.
500 series is getting pretty ubiquitious and a good EQ would be great
500 series is getting pretty ubiquitious and a good EQ would be great
inputoutput
Well-known member
what about something like this?
http://www.manleylabs.com/containerpages/backbone.html
http://www.manleylabs.com/containerpages/backbone.html
briomusic
Well-known member
I have to say, I don't really understand the need for a channelstrip?
Surely any slightly DIY savvy fellow can take their favourite mic-pre/eq/comp from the existing projects and put them into one case and figure out a power supply?
Even better: Put them side to side into a 51X box, and pre-patch with xlr leads at the back. Then you can still change your mind later
Most people I know end up changing up their channelstrip and - for example - replace their AVALON or Focusrite channelstrip compressor with a 1176.
In that sense, I vote for more great building blocks being added to the collection. Personally, I would quite like the MCI JH500 EQ, but I also like many of the other suggestions. I also LOVE the WIDE SWITCH in the Neve summing box, so if it's gonna be summing, can you throw that one in for me, pretty please
Surely any slightly DIY savvy fellow can take their favourite mic-pre/eq/comp from the existing projects and put them into one case and figure out a power supply?
Even better: Put them side to side into a 51X box, and pre-patch with xlr leads at the back. Then you can still change your mind later
Most people I know end up changing up their channelstrip and - for example - replace their AVALON or Focusrite channelstrip compressor with a 1176.
In that sense, I vote for more great building blocks being added to the collection. Personally, I would quite like the MCI JH500 EQ, but I also like many of the other suggestions. I also LOVE the WIDE SWITCH in the Neve summing box, so if it's gonna be summing, can you throw that one in for me, pretty please
SIXTYNINER
Well-known member
Igor i post here that i just posted as a thread
vintage console sound very good but also noise level is not low
then why not :
Control a channel input mute of mixing desk or summ unit
(as in some old desk like soundcraft ghost , soundtracs megas , ecc..)
with remote control by midi ,
this channel mute by midi is very good for keep cleaned the master buss of mixing console
from "white/pink" noises and remove load from channels that don't sound alternatively
in some part of song ,
then as in old console the channel mute function can be set by patches/scenes
then stored into a rom memory bank , any bank (A,B,C,D or 1,2,3,4...)
with 100/128 memory locations each.
and simply backupped by midi esclusive beckup/restore command
into a midi sequencer track (as for sound patches of midi sound expanders/keybord)
then remain stored togheter all other s audio/midi tracks
inside any pro tools,logic,cubase song/session
This project require a mute circuit card for any input channel (a relay can do this?)
and a "control center" board for store and recall mute patches/scenes
and drive all input channel circuit cards.
Any info , scheme , picture and suggestion about is wellcome,
thanks in advance to anyone give help or discuss in this thread,
6T9R
vintage console sound very good but also noise level is not low
then why not :
Control a channel input mute of mixing desk or summ unit
(as in some old desk like soundcraft ghost , soundtracs megas , ecc..)
with remote control by midi ,
this channel mute by midi is very good for keep cleaned the master buss of mixing console
from "white/pink" noises and remove load from channels that don't sound alternatively
in some part of song ,
then as in old console the channel mute function can be set by patches/scenes
then stored into a rom memory bank , any bank (A,B,C,D or 1,2,3,4...)
with 100/128 memory locations each.
and simply backupped by midi esclusive beckup/restore command
into a midi sequencer track (as for sound patches of midi sound expanders/keybord)
then remain stored togheter all other s audio/midi tracks
inside any pro tools,logic,cubase song/session
This project require a mute circuit card for any input channel (a relay can do this?)
and a "control center" board for store and recall mute patches/scenes
and drive all input channel circuit cards.
Any info , scheme , picture and suggestion about is wellcome,
thanks in advance to anyone give help or discuss in this thread,
6T9R
This is the exact project I started on before I got sidetracked by my 1084EQ project.
You can do this with microprocessors. The circuits are actually very simple. By the end I just wanted MIDI to trigger a sequence of mute groups.
My console already has the mute circuit and 2 master controls. All I would have to do is plug into that system with better logic control.
The only thing I am not sure of is the timing. No matter how you look at it the switches will go off sequentially. So if there was mute to 48 channels there would be a noticeable lag by the time channel 48 triggers. My thought on this was to have a master controller triggering other microprocessors handling 8 to 16 mutes each so that the cascade would occur much faster.
Life gets so busy though and auto mute right now is not as handy as a NEVE 1084EQ right?
But let me know if you are embarking on that . Maybe I can help.
Jim
You can do this with microprocessors. The circuits are actually very simple. By the end I just wanted MIDI to trigger a sequence of mute groups.
My console already has the mute circuit and 2 master controls. All I would have to do is plug into that system with better logic control.
The only thing I am not sure of is the timing. No matter how you look at it the switches will go off sequentially. So if there was mute to 48 channels there would be a noticeable lag by the time channel 48 triggers. My thought on this was to have a master controller triggering other microprocessors handling 8 to 16 mutes each so that the cascade would occur much faster.
Life gets so busy though and auto mute right now is not as handy as a NEVE 1084EQ right?
But let me know if you are embarking on that . Maybe I can help.
Jim
SIXTYNINER said:
jensenmann
Well-known member
Last week we recieved a TC-electronic EQstation+Remote at work which seriously impressed me. My thought was why not implement this concept into a studio environment? Maybe like this:
A remote to control several EQs with lets say 5band fullparametric + HP + LP filter usersurface for placement between the speakers at the sweetspot. Somewhere else in the racks the rest of the EQs: audioelectronics and control electronics. Maybe a modular concept for the mainframe which lets you choose the type of EQ and the number of EQs which you want to control.
Now the question is how to control the EQ circuits to get total recall. Motorpots (expensive but a lot of different famous EQ circuits could be integrated without any change in the circuit)? VCAs/Multiplexers (cheaper but if you want to recreate some vintage EQs, e.g. Pultec, you will have to change the circuits which would change sound to some degree).
Sounds like a hell of work. Seriously a project for men, not for kiddies
A remote to control several EQs with lets say 5band fullparametric + HP + LP filter usersurface for placement between the speakers at the sweetspot. Somewhere else in the racks the rest of the EQs: audioelectronics and control electronics. Maybe a modular concept for the mainframe which lets you choose the type of EQ and the number of EQs which you want to control.
Now the question is how to control the EQ circuits to get total recall. Motorpots (expensive but a lot of different famous EQ circuits could be integrated without any change in the circuit)? VCAs/Multiplexers (cheaper but if you want to recreate some vintage EQs, e.g. Pultec, you will have to change the circuits which would change sound to some degree).
Sounds like a hell of work. Seriously a project for men, not for kiddies
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