how to record like Joe meek

[pucho812]

been on a meek kick this week. Anyway i found this flow chart which demonstrates a typical meek session setup

 

[Whoops]

Nice one,
you reminded me I need to buy this book:

http://www.barrycleveland.com/meek.htm

 

[gato]

what is the "cooker?"

 

[Whoops]

what is the "cooker?"

I was curious about the "cooker" that also.

And I think something is probably wrong in the layout,
Shouldn't the "homemade 4 channel mixer" output go into the combining amplifier  to be mixed with the tape delay and them from there to the echo chamber?

Also is quite strange that all the mix was sent to speakers in echo chamber.
And why was the Echo chamber being recorded with a Stereo tape recorder if then in the end will be mixed to mono?

 

[pucho812]

I have seen the word cooker used before and it was referring to a tube mic pre. I can only assume  that his cooker is exactly that. So on the lead vocal you have a mic going into a  tube mic pre going into a compressor and so on and so on.
I would say  that meek was ahead of his time in wanting both stereo and mono versions of songs.  The only real cost would be an extra reel of tape.  But more importantly, you may know this, but EMI standards at the time were pop music in mono classical music in stereo and even then consumers probably still had mono vinyl players.  I would assume meek was following those practices. as well.

Have you heard some meeks best work, it's swimming in echo chamber.... I can't say this chart is 100% accurate but I would say it is close based on the meek productions I have listened too over the years.

Here are some examples

(the outlaws "Crazy drums" 1961

This was 1961 and check this out. It' starts with some sort of synth bleep acting as metronome then continues into this crazy bashing on drums of different sounds and pitches only to have the whole band come in and it really goes crazy being all distorted and massive amounts of delay and echo chamber

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwhiXTNw5r0&list=RDxwhiXTNw5r0

Here is another one that was recorded in 1960

Joe meek and the blue men. Listen to all going on and picture this being done in 1960  with no digital processors or daw's or anything else  other then analog machinery and acoustic chambers to create this unique stuff

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xPU88t6LieA

Then of course his most famous production telstar recorded in 1962

Here is a demo with joe meek singing the melody as he didn't play any instruments

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ujtILe4BeY

And of course the version that I thought was the release, but I maybe incorrect  on that matter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4B7ypA1fSwU

 

[ruffrecords]

That last link is not the released version I remember. The start was quite different and the guitar break was definitely different.

Cheers

Ian

 

[pucho812]

That last link is not the released version I remember. The start was quite different and the guitar break was definitely different.

Cheers

Ian

Interesting, I edited that it might not be the official release.  I wonder which one is then... I have heard a few variations on it.

I found this. Is this more like it Ian?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft2aScF3M04

 

[ruffrecords]

That last link is not the released version I remember. The start was quite different and the guitar break was definitely different.

Cheers

Ian

Interesting, I edited that it might not be the official release.  I wonder which one is then... I have heard a few variations on it.

I found this. Is this more like it Ian?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ft2aScF3M04

That's much more like I remember it. The keyboard and guitar sound are correct as is the percussion. The beginning still does not sound quite right. Sounds like someone has looped part of the intro to extend it. This was about the third single I ever bought. I was about eleven years old and very into science so Telstar was something incredible to me.

Cheers

Ian

 

[ruffrecords]

This one sounds like the original to me:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxpZ5rOMH4U

Cheers

Ian

 

[Whoops]

COOKER

“The vocal mic goes through a little ‘cooker’ I’ve made, that has got bass, top and middle lift in it. It was originally a small amplifier. It has three channels, so I can mix in a vocal group with it, and possibly a front-line instrument. It’s quite handy, I can mix without having to walk around the control room too much.”[36]

The ‘Cooker’ (an old RCA pre-amp) was used as both a vocal equaliser and as a sub mixer for backline instruments and backing vocals.

http://arpjournal.com/take-the-last-train-from-meeksville-joe-meeks%E2%80%99s-holloway-road-recording-studio-1963-7/


"Meek also had several preamplifiers with multiple inputs that he used as auxiliary mixers. Included was a modified RCA Orthophonic hi-fi preamp/filter unit that he referred to as his cooker. The Orthophonic provided three inputs, had simple tone controls, and could be easily overdriven into a smooth and musical distortion. The device was most often used to fatten up lead vocals, but it also served as a backing vocal submixer "

http://www.emusician.com/interviews/1379/british-recording-iconoclast-joe-meek-heard-a-new-world/46154

 

[Seeker]

I've read about Joe Meek, seen designs based on his ideas, but never actually listened to any of his work... Until now    thanks for sharing pucho!

 

[ruffrecords]

Probably one of his best known recordings is of Status Quo and Pictures o Matchstick Men. If you listen carefully you can hear the hum on the guitsr ibtro.

Cheers

Ian

 

[pucho812]

meek did pictures of matchstick men?

 

[barclaycon]

I don't think Joe Meek engineered Pictures Of Matchstick Men.
I worked with John Schroeder (the producer) a few times and he said the track was done at Pye - never mentioned Meek being involved.

 

[Kingston]

Also is quite strange that all the mix was sent to speakers in echo chamber.

This was pretty common in the day. You have to keep in mind those echo chambers sounded absolutely great, for example full "studio B" acoustically treated room used just for the purpose, or even a dedicated room in a bigger complex.

A full wet mix would simply come out more lively.

 

[Whoops]

This was pretty common in the day. You have to keep in mind those echo chambers sounded absolutely great, for example full "studio B" acoustically treated room used just for the purpose, or even a dedicated room in a bigger complex.

A full wet mix would simply come out more lively.

Sorry to disagree,  speakers were quite awfull, even if the echo chamber sounded good for echo the speakers that produced sound inside the room were not great for sure. It doesn't make much sense

I still doubt the layout is correct and I doubt the full mix was sent to the echo chamber, but I would have to read more to be sure, something that I didnt have time .

but saying this, maybe he did and maybe it worked fine for the time

 

[Kingston]

Sorry to disagree,  speakers were quite awfull, even if the echo chamber sounded good for echo the speakers that produced sound inside the room were not great for sure. It doesn't make much sense

I still doubt the layout is correct and I doubt the full mix was sent to the echo chamber, but I would have to read more to be sure, something that I didnt have time .

This isn't the Beatles. We are not talking about golden commercial studio classics. He was a psychedelic punk rocker time traveler who landed a several decades off and got stuck there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvkc7ZLDy7k

 

[Walrus]

Sorry to disagree,  speakers were quite awfull, even if the echo chamber sounded good for echo the speakers that produced sound inside the room were not great for sure. It doesn't make much sense

The speakers in the 4 echo chambers at CBS Studios London were Tannoy corner units, possibly York or Lancaster, driven by a Quad 50E, and the mics were an AKG dynamic and a Neumann U67!
When I joined in 1987, the chambers weren't in use apart from storing old tapes.  ;D

 

[barclaycon]

Some of the most iconic 'reverbs' of all time have been produced by a speaker in a live room picked up by a microphone.

Take for example, Gold Star studios - home of the 'wall of sound'. That was a relatively small trapezoidal room designed by Dave Gold which had an 8" speaker fed from the console, picked up by an inexpensive mic.
People used to marvel at the fact that such an enormous sound could come from a fairly small studio.

Power Station. That 'live' sound heard on things like Springsteen was from a speaker/mic setup on the fire escape stairs.

There's lots more examples. It's definitely something that can't be just be derided as 'not making sense'.

 

[fazer]

Gold Star studios - home of the 'wall of sound

Neil Young talked about the Gold star chamber as being a refrigeration metal box that could be moved and offers for sale to him.  He says he passed on buying it in his book.  The trapezoid room info I have not heard before but have not research either.