Nice. They are running $3-500 used, no new ones, obviously. This drummer is playing brushes on the whole track so he's much softer, playing to a very reverberant room in an a primarily acoustic group. I wish I knew what they were when some radio & tv stations decided to replace them! Worried I'd get one on it's last legs. Thanks you for your help. Greatly appreciated. I'll keep an eye out.
Need advice for improving isolation in miking a string bass live on stage. Jazz mostly
- Thread starter Mr. Moscode
- Start date
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Nice. They are running $3-500 used, no new ones, obviously. This drummer is playing brushes on the whole track so he's much softer, playing to a very reverberant room in an a primarily acoustic group. I wish I knew what they were when some radio & tv stations decided to replace them! Worried I'd get one on it's last legs. Thanks you for your help. Greatly appreciated. I'll keep an eye out.
There is a lot of air moving through the f hole. It's like the tuning port of a bass reflex speaker. A physics prof once blew out a lit match with air thru the f holes of a violin. He damn near lit the fiddle on fire, too.
I'll add that to the list to try if I can borrow the mic easily. BTW, the tailpiece has its own motion while a string vibrates, and because of its mass is slower to start and resonates at a subsonic freq.
Thank you for your suggestion.
I’ve played upright bass since I was young. I always thought the best place to mic it was a couple of feet away at the bridge and f hole. With a gooseneck you could get the mic close to the bridge too. Maybe up through the bridge and under the fingerboard?
S.Samuelsson
Active member
Hi.
I haven't tried it, mainly because I rely on other -more feedback friendly- miking methods on the rare occasions I get to play my beaten up DB with others, but about a decade ago I stumbled upon something over the "dark side" of TB (TalkBass.com) I felt was a novel idea for more natural and controlled DB sound in a live band setting.
For some reason I can't find the thread, but IIRC someone had put a regular ribbon mic (figure 8 as suggested in the early replies) between the top and the strings, with excellent results in a jazz gig setting.
A while later a tb:er BrandonEssex announced that he was launching a special ribbon mic for a DB called Troll Microphone (because trolls live under a bridge
).
http://trollmicrophone.com/
As can be expected the opinions vary, some swear by it, some at it, but that approach is definitely something I'd definitely consider and try, should the need arise.
Being a diyholic, of course I wouldn't dream of buying one.
Regards,
Sam
I haven't tried it, mainly because I rely on other -more feedback friendly- miking methods on the rare occasions I get to play my beaten up DB with others, but about a decade ago I stumbled upon something over the "dark side" of TB (TalkBass.com) I felt was a novel idea for more natural and controlled DB sound in a live band setting.
For some reason I can't find the thread, but IIRC someone had put a regular ribbon mic (figure 8 as suggested in the early replies) between the top and the strings, with excellent results in a jazz gig setting.
A while later a tb:er BrandonEssex announced that he was launching a special ribbon mic for a DB called Troll Microphone (because trolls live under a bridge
).http://trollmicrophone.com/
As can be expected the opinions vary, some swear by it, some at it, but that approach is definitely something I'd definitely consider and try, should the need arise.
Being a diyholic, of course I wouldn't dream of buying one
.Regards,
Sam
k brown
Well-known member
Many have had good results with an ATM35 (current model is ATM350) clipped on so it's dead side is towards the drums. Even though it's a card, it's 2-pole HP filter (ATM35:160Hz; ATM350: 80Hz) is specifically designed to compensate for close micing.
They can also be fitted with omni capsules (even hypercardioid!); I always start with the omni and only switch if not getting enough iso.
http://recordinghacks.com/microphones/Audio-Technica/ATM350
They can also be fitted with omni capsules (even hypercardioid!); I always start with the omni and only switch if not getting enough iso.
http://recordinghacks.com/microphones/Audio-Technica/ATM350
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ubxf
Well-known member
you probably know this already but just in case you might want to look at this pick up
https://www.fullcompass.com/prod/034023-barcus-berry-b3150-bass-piezo-transducer-pre-ampi use the 4000 for piano and it is pretty good.
https://www.fullcompass.com/prod/034023-barcus-berry-b3150-bass-piezo-transducer-pre-ampi use the 4000 for piano and it is pretty good.
Peter Simonsen
Well-known member
Loud drums...ask the drummer to NOT play so loud. Its really as simple as that. Bleed should be your friend. If not fix the problem(s) at the source. Period.
/Peter
5v333
Well-known member
I wanted to try a fig8 mounted on the bridge nulling the horisontal plane (piano, drums and audiance).
But never had the chance.
Plexi between drums and bass is an idea aswell.
But never had the chance.
Plexi between drums and bass is an idea aswell.
k brown
Well-known member
Figure 8 that close is going to have massive proximity effect.
5v333
Well-known member
Good point.
Is it more of a problem than just eqing it out ?
Wouldnt it isolate the lowend between the bass and drums even more?
Is it more of a problem than just eqing it out ?
Wouldnt it isolate the lowend between the bass and drums even more?
soapfoot
Well-known member
I’ve never had great results with plexi.
A soft gobo can work great, but may not be ideal live in front of an audience unless positioned very unobtrusively (but still effectively).
Plexi also looks bad onstage (imo) but has the additional disadvantage of being very splashy and reflective.
A soft gobo can work great, but may not be ideal live in front of an audience unless positioned very unobtrusively (but still effectively).
Plexi also looks bad onstage (imo) but has the additional disadvantage of being very splashy and reflective.
YOU tell him!! If only it was that simple . . . .There are times when playing loud is part of the music. We have different guests each week so the music and vibe changes.
That can be eq'd out but I don't stand perfectly still. I change positions depending on the situation.
I received the mic hood. I'm going to give that a go the next time. I think it will be better if I surround it with something like vinyl.
As always, thank everyone for their collective experience and thought.
Lauten LS-308, 2nd order cardioid pattern. Have been using one onstage with a live music radio broadcast, sometimes with drums as close as 10 feet away. Even in that case, I can almost use it by itself, a DI signal doesn't have to be in there much at all. Bassist loves the sound of it. Had a DPA mounted on the bass previously, that's just a room mic.
Other option in post - Isotope RX10.
Other option in post - Isotope RX10.
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I found a MXL R144 ribbon for $99. Anyone have an opinion about them?Hi.
I haven't tried it, mainly because I rely on other -more feedback friendly- miking methods on the rare occasions I get to play my beaten up DB with others, but about a decade ago I stumbled upon something over the "dark side" of TB (TalkBass.com) I felt was a novel idea for more natural and controlled DB sound in a live band setting.
For some reason I can't find the thread, but IIRC someone had put a regular ribbon mic (figure 8 as suggested in the early replies) between the top and the strings, with excellent results in a jazz gig setting.
A while later a tb:er BrandonEssex announced that he was launching a special ribbon mic for a DB called Troll Microphone (because trolls live under a bridge
http://trollmicrophone.com/
As can be expected the opinions vary, some swear by it, some at it, but that approach is definitely something I'd definitely consider and try, should the need arise.
Being a diyholic, of course I wouldn't dream of buying one
Regards,
Sam
Barry Hufker
Well-known member
This is an expensive solution but possibly a very good one... Xlson audio – A new generation in acoustic instrument microphones
It is a custom made Pearl microphone made specifically for Xlsonaudio.
It is a custom made Pearl microphone made specifically for Xlsonaudio.
Electrobumps
Well-known member
What happens if the drummer gets certain tones from his kit depending on the velocity of hitting the instrument?
What if the drummer refuses/is not skilled enough to play quieter?
What if the spill is more caused by the location of the drummer rather than the volume and it can't be changed?
While certainly a good option to explore. I don't agree this is the definitive answer to solve the problem.
Personally I really dislike bleed and it's not friend. For me it is an acquaintance that I need to tolerate and work with.
Thank you. They're fairly expensive but good to know about
You are correct sir, an expensive solution. Like the other mic, it's $1/2 kilobuck. Trying to get more info.
Graham Nystrom
Transformers and transistors for me please!
I've done live sound for many many years and I can say that when you feed a 58 through the middle two strings below the bridge and then plug it in, that that's a fantastic placement. Take it one step further and use a beta 58 which will have much less bleed from the drums. That way your mic is always pointed directly at the wood, it's very close, and you're using a microphone that's working in your favor to minimize bleed. If you could figure out a way to use a ribbon mic, I'd say go for it. You'll probably have to eq out a ton of bass if you do, though. The beta 58 will be much more forgiving from stage to stage to stage. And much more well-know to engineers you encounter.
Depending on how precious you are about your bass, you can find the right piece of soft foam or other methods of making sure that it's secure and not going to move or cause any damage.
Hope that helps!
Depending on how precious you are about your bass, you can find the right piece of soft foam or other methods of making sure that it's secure and not going to move or cause any damage.
Hope that helps!
I've convinced the drummer to avoid tuning his drums to my open string pitches : E A D G. Actually Ron Carter did.
He's not on my bandstand the next gig.
In my case, where I have the option to record, there is room to adjust, plus rugs.
These are the challenges of recording live. If someone comes up with a pickup that sounds as the bass does I think he will make hundreds of dollars. smile - it's jazz.
Edit: Loud is part of the music. I don't want to step on the drummer's expression too much either. There's a happy medium somewhere.
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