Vinyl Lovers? Advice?

[matta]

Ok...

I grew up in home with little to no music and when I got into music cassette tapes were all the rage...

I've often marveled at Vinyl which to me seems like a 'dark art' and a fellow engineer is an avid collector or both new and old pressings and we often get together and listen back to the 'originals' and the new CD 'remasters' and I'm constantly floored by the details and definition in the vinyl counterparts.

As an unexpected Xmas gift he imported a copy of BECK's latest offering 'Modern Guilt', in the hope I'd start getting into Vinyl and develop my own collection.... problem is, I don't own or have never owned a record player/turntable!

I'm now looking through the classifieds of the local papers to see if I can hunt one down and really don't have a CLUE as to what to look for, any ideas from your guys?

I don't plan on 'scratching' on it or whatever DJ's call it thee days, just a simple, listening device to play back the record and in time records.

From what I understand records are in PHONO so need some sort of PHONO converter is needed to interface with modern amplifiers, I'm hoping to build/buy one and then route it by my monitoring unit to my powered monitors at the studio.

I know alot of guys have valve amps and drive nice speakers and maybe in time I'd go that route but for now I'm hoping to start off with the basics.

Cheers

Matt

 

[owel]

You need a phono preamp. (Think of it as a mic preamp.)

Output of the phono preamp goes to the line input of your stereo... or to a line level preamp, then to amp.

Technics is a very good turntable.  You want direct-drive, high-torque kind.

 

[NewYorkDave]

Matt, Google "RIAA preamp" and you'll find out all you need to know (and more!) about the preamplifier requirements.

For turntables, Technics direct-drive models are workhorses.

 

[matta]

Thanks Guys!

SO it seems the muched loved Technics-SL1200 is both great for consumer and DJ applications, great, so if I ever need to strut my stuff at a party I can bring the beats, LOL!

Thanks for the heads up.

Matt

 

[NewYorkDave]

Matt, I recently did a blue LED conversion on a couple of 1200s for a local DJ. I thought it was kind of a silly request at first; but once the job was done, I have to admit that it looked pretty badassed

The 1200 is a good table, but even their "consumer" direct-drive models can be pretty good. I have a SL-QD33 here that has served very well in over twenty years of daily use.

 

[radiance]

 

[Arno]

It's quite important to learn how to adjust the counterweight on your needle

You can ruin your records if you don't do it (properly)

-arno

 

[jackies]

check the local craigslist - record players come up quite often
good yet inexpensive choices would be rega, thorens
though you can get started with anything
websites to read: vinylengine, audiogon
then you have to buy a quality cartridge/needle which normally is more expensive than a used turntable
check goodwill stores often, sometimes people dump whole record collections, in like, unused condition!
vinyl is a great fun!
then, of course diy turntables is a whole other dimension

now, that i see your location, my advice on craigslist/goodwill might be useless...
anyway vinyl is super cool!

 

[clintrubber]

Can understand you want to listen to that record asap, but stores closed, no 2nd hand turntable nearby, no friend who has one...

Got a flatbed scanner ? THIS might be your solution then:

http://www.cs.huji.ac.il/~springer/

8)

 

[NewYorkDave]

I agree with Arno. Every turntable owner should own a stylus force gauge, such as the common and inexpensive Shure SFG-2.

You should also have some means to clean your discs. The good ol' Discwasher always did the job for me.

 

[Nele]

the technics sl-1200 is not highly regarded in the 'hi-fi' world, but at least it's great for dj-ing. I myself have one and also a belt-driven Thorens, and the Thorens does sound better.
Good new turntables are made by Pro-ject. Even their cheap models are very good...

 

[NewYorkDave]

It's true that the "audiophile world" does not approve of direct-drive turntables as a rule. But the Technics tables have always done right by me. They're very reliable and low-maintenance. 

 

[Rob Flinn]

In my experiences the technics SL12XX is a great turntable but the arm leaves quite a lot to be desired.   I believe that they do a replacement arm board so that you can fit a decent arm, but is it worth the bother.

I started life with Rega planar III (still in production), which has a glass platter & is belt driven by a ac (I think ) motor.  this sounded pretty good & I gave it to my brother when I replace it.   The original deck had an OEM Japanese armthat was OK, but Rega have come a long way in manufacturing their own arms & now have a really good arm.  http://www.rega.co.uk/

I am now running a vintage Garrard 401 turntable with a Rega arm, all in a home made plinth, made out of a whole 8` x 4` sheet of mdf laminated that I finished with ebony veneer.  It weighs a ton & looks really sexy . I really like this turntable it sounds great (to me).   http://www.hi-fiworld.co.uk/hfw/featureshtml/garrard401revived.html

Back in the day turntables by Thorens, Garrard, EMT were the broadcast choice in the UK

Probably the best known arm manufacturer is SME, who are 20 miles down the road from me, & have been the standard by which all other arms are measured for maybe 40 years.

The other thing you need to consider is the stylus. when you get away from the sewing needles that dj's use on the SL1200's you start getting loads more detail.
There are basically 2 types moving coil, & moving magnet.  MM are more robust & much cheaper than MC.  MC prices start where MM stops.   MC require an extra 10x (approx) gain, because they have a small output, & companies like beyer & Sowter actually do step up transformers for them.

The RIAA phono preamp is a necessity, since when a record is cut they apply an eq curve to cut the bass & boost th e treble which needs to be reversed on playback.  Originally all the record companies like RCA, Columbia, Decca, EMI etc etc had their own curves & it was a bit of a mine field when playing back, however this was standardised to the RIAA curve.     I used to own a valve QUAD II (not quad as in pro audio quad 8 ) hifi, & that had 3 buttons on the preamp, with a card of combinations for the different record companies eq curves !!

If you really want to treat yourself look at this  http://www.michell-engineering.co.uk/

 

[matta]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for all the input, so much to learn!!! Seems like DIY: replacement arms, styli, MC, MM, RIAA, all new to me! I think I want to start off on a budget here and in time spend a bit more. Sadly I missed a Thoren TD 160 that went for around $200USD, the Tehcnic SL-1200 are a dime a dozen here with all the DJ's, but still pricey, even 2nd hand they fetch around $350USD. Will keep my eyes and ears open!

RE listening to the current record, BECK did a cool thing in that when you buy the album inside is a coupon to go on-line and download the record transfers from the Vinyl master as 320KBPS MP3's, sadly I can't get it because I don't live in the USA and it is only open to USA customers... anyone want to download it for me Stateside?

Thanks again!

Matt

 

[Rob Flinn]

Matt,

SHame about the thorens, they're supposed to be good.   I think I wouls be rather wary of a 2nd hand SL12XX, since they can be quite abused if owned prviously for DJing purposes, especially the arm bearings, which aren't brilliant in the first place. especially when people have been blue tacking coins to the headshells to stop a club sound system bouncing the needle around !!!

Like I said I thnk the Rega is good sounding, cool looking, well enginnered, & cost effective for a modern turntable.

However most people who get into vinyl hifi like to look at well engineered stuff that's one of the reasons I like my Garrard.  Garrard are jewellers to Queen amongst other things !!
The Mitchell stuff is jaw dropping if you like looking at engineering, & if you stick an SME series V on it, well .............
http://www.sme.ltd.uk/content/Series-V-1330.shtml

 

[clintrubber]

RE listening to the current record, BECK did a cool thing in that when you buy the album inside is a coupon to go on-line and download the record transfers from the Vinyl master as 320KBPS MP3's,

I like moves like that 

For instance Steve Albini's band Shellac directly throws in an unmarked CD in the sleeve/box for free when you buy their vinyl.

 

[bcarso]

Regas are said to be good and fairly affordable.

The direct drives have a possibly deserved bad rep for inducing some higher frequency energy into the rotation of the fairly low mass platter due to the discontinuous nature of the direct drive motor.  That's why belt drives are generally preferred.  I lived happily with a Technics DD for years though, until I was persuaded to invest in a fancy tonearm.  This is now on a Heybrook, an old UK-made table with a crystal-controlled power supply driving a motor coupled with a belt.  The mid-line moving-iron Grado cartridge is fairly low output but not down to where an MC preamp is needed.

I listened to some vinyl last night in fact, including a rarely-played Sheffield direct-to-disc, the third in the series that Lincoln Mayorga and Doug Sax did.  Good players, and pretty spectacular fidelity.  Musically not exactly to my taste, but still fun.

Budget as soon as possible for a record cleaner, the ones that you wash with a special solution and then vacuum that off.  It makes a huge difference---many times vinyl is not so much worn as just dirty.

 

[clintrubber]

Budget as soon as possible for a record cleaner, the ones that you wash with a special solution and then vacuum that off.  It makes a huge difference---many times vinyl is not so much worn as just dirty.

I only learned about these recently. I joined a friend to a HiFi-show and learned that these unassuming boxes
can set you back a few hundred or more 

I succesfully tried to forget what the one he bought costed....

 

[Rob Flinn]

Just found this
http://www.teresaudio.com/haven/cleaner/cleaner.html

 

[jpuhhuh]

I've wanted to try this out maybe its right for you: http://www.altmann.haan.de/turntable/
Also I have a Grado cartridge which was an inexpensive giant killer back in the day: www.gradolabs.com
Finally give this a try to download us content http://lifehacker.com/394410/access-us+only-web-content-with-hotspot-shield
JP