What if you opened up a Manley Reference C and ...

[bockaudio]

What if you opened up a Manley Reference C and you found that the capsule to tube/FET-cap was a ordinary ceramic one?
What would you think? What do you think was the motivation of the circuit designer?

The designer (Steve Haselton) and the production floor, or manufacturing engineer may be unrelated. What a designer specifies and what a company produces based on that may also have a "loose" relationship. Normal behaviour in manufacturing.

 

[bockaudio]

Has anyone traced this microphones circuit?
Is it a copy of something or is it somewhat different?

Same circuit as has been for years excepting modern RF proof mods. Two stage cascade, xfmr tertiary NFB to first stage. New mics have 12AX7 instead of 6072.

 

[Gus]

I have not had the chance to look at the insides of one.
I was wondering how it was configured.

 

[bockaudio]

Standard mic triode self bias>>>>cascade to triode output>>>cap..xfmr...xfmr tertiary NFB to 1st stage is also -10dB/not switch.

 

[kingkorg]

No filtering in nfb, like in u67?

 

[bockaudio]

No, just an unbalanced winding to a split cathode resistor.
U67 NFB complicated and through the capsule.

 

[kingkorg]

People at Manley seem to be keeping eye on this forum. They removed all the audio examples, and measurements off the ATK site for Reference C.  I guess they didn't like the fact that it measures and sounds exactly like the Sterling mic...

 

[Khron]

Reminds me a bit of Thunderf00t over on YouTube, versus some of his detractors (or rather, companies or concepts he "myth busted")...

 

[bockaudio]

People at Manley seem to be keeping eye on this forum. They removed all the audio examples, and measurements off the ATK site for Reference C.  I guess they didn't like the fact that it measures and sounds exactly like the Sterling mic...

I know for fact Manley builds their own mic, not a rebrand. Unique circuit, have not seen it copied.
I don't know anything about Sterling is there evidence it's not a rebrand, or that the circuit was copied?

 

[kingkorg]

Their circuits are nothing alike, Sterling is a fet mic. However they are both flat circuits, and share the same exact OEM capsule and similar basket shape. Earlier models and some Groove Tubes mics are even closer.

So under normal conditions, normal levels if the tube isn't significantly pushed they sound pretty much the same. Measurements and audio samples were available at ATK site, and are now removed.

 

[bockaudio]

Funny assumption.

 

[Delta Sigma]

I'm wrong more often than I'm right, but I doubt we, at this forum, could have any influence over a company's marketing. I don't think we have enough consumer reach, unlike Gearslutz. It may be a coincidence.

 

[cyrano]

I'm wrong more often than I'm right, but I doubt we, at this forum, could have any influence over a company's marketing. I don't think we have enough consumer reach, unlike Gearslutz. It may be a coincidence.

They don't "watch" this forum, or any other forum.

Companies might have a subscription to a search service that alerts them whenever their brandname appears anywhere. Internet and a list of paper publications. Even hospitals and universities seem vain enough to watch out what their online image is. Of course, sometimes vanity equals money. Sometimes, it's the only way to track their own products.

 

[kingkorg]

Btw, this wasn't mentioned just here. I believe the fact they use Feilo capsules in Ref C was mentioned on REP forums in something like 2008.

So while ATK is among other things meant to help companies promote their mics, it didn't really work in this case.

 

[GeorgeToledo]

some links
http://www.thevalvepage.com/valvetek/microph/microph.htm

https://dalmura.com.au/static/Microphonics%20in%20valves.pdf

FWIW I installed a polystyrene cap instead of a capsule in a microphone the body and grill were installed and the cap worked as a low output level capsule. I could record sound
Others have posted about microphonic parts.

Jakob that sounds like an interesting paper.

A capacitor mic, go figure!

 

[dab0815]

It would be a real shame not to use this body. Looks amazing, great build quality, and a lot of the sound comes from capsule surroundings. It's the body i used in my build, the picture is in some of my previous posts in this thread. You would need to remove a thinner layer of mesh on the inside.

https://m.alibaba.com/product/60830...cacheTime":"1800000","type":"appDetailShare"}

Lol that was exactly the mic body i found and wanted to use. Nice!
Can you tell me what you used as a circuit? Did you use the original st51 fet circuit or did you just use the st51 capsule and copy the ref c tube circuit for your build?

Edit: and do you happen to have these audio files that got deleted. Im curious to hear those..

 

[kingkorg]

I went for cardioid only elam circuit without pF range filter cap. Capsule polarized at backplate, membrane directly to the grid, plate out. I am really not that interested in 12ax7 based circuit which Manley is, especially as the transformer needs a tertiary winding. The capsule i have in mine is actually from MD1b, but it's the same thing.

The last time i was at ATK Cardioid C was back and all the files. So my conspiracy theory goes down the tubes.

 

[dab0815]

Thanks. I might just put the innards incl. Circuit of the st51 in the alibaba ref c copy body then.
Or maybe if id want to go tube id put in the circuit of a used tbone sct800 which is basically a cardoid only apex 460.
You thin that would work out?

 

[kingkorg]

Sct800 would have to be modified in typical Apex460 fashion in order to be usable. St51 is perfectly fine stock. It could be adjusted for minimum thd though. So it comes down to preference and convenience.

If you ask about my very unpopular personal opinion, i still cant hear or measure any difference between tube and fet circuit besides slightly higher, yet inaudible thd of a tube.

 

[dab0815]

Dont you think a tube circuit would react a little different towards transients. Like compressing the signal a bit?