covid politics

[boji]

On leaders under any emergency: The personality cult can also take the form of an anti-personality cult.  Drumpf was a voted-in symptom of a much bigger problem, which is the loss of the American mythos that we produce excellent and extraordinary people, and those excellent people naturally rise into positions of leadership by virtue of those qualities.  It's a natural evolution of unrestricted capitalism that those with the capital eventually buy their way into positions they are unqualified for.
Tulsi had a lot of positive leadership traits, and she got pushed out for not having the money to buy the blessings of the dnc.  It's not the personalities at the top we should be obsessed about,  it's the payola system of restricting people's choice of candidates that should be the focus of our ridicule/memes/attempts to influence future positive outcomes.

 

[john12ax7]

Tulsi had a lot of positive leadership traits, and she got pushed out for not having the money to buy the blessings of the dnc.

Imo it was more she was pushed aside because both sides of  the political establishment didn't want her bringing up unpleasant truths that threatened the status quo.

The fact that most of the political elite didn't like her indicates she was probably on to something.

I think she was good candidate.

 

[boji]

I agree with you 12AX, however "she was pushed aside because..." 

Oh you're willing to donate 10m to the NDC, CPC and, ESSC?  How generous of you Tulsi! I'll  pass the word on to our family of congressional organization heads. I'm sure I can get them to reconsider, given the importance of your 'commitments' should you maintain a presence in the caucus.

 

[JohnRoberts]

I love it when politicians say they follow the science.... reminds me of George Orwells "newspeak".

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Not to get into local politics for other locals but https://nypost.com/2020/02/11/former-cnbc-anchor-michelle-caruso-cabrera-to-take-on-aoc-in-primary/  A well know former CNBC (business news) anchor has announced she is challenging AOC.  Michelle already has a 3 letter nickname (MCC) so will be the contest between AOC and MCC.....

I worry she is probably too conservative to get elected in NYC, but it would be refreshing to have a candidate who understands business and economics, and most importantly how to count. (Sorry probably wishful thinking, but maybe after AOC pursues upgrading to a senate seat).  MCC is not the only person pursuing AOCs seat.

JR

 

[john12ax7]

I agree with you 12AX, however "she was pushed aside because..." 

Oh you're willing to donate 10m to the NDC, CPC and, ESSC?  How generous of you Tulsi! I'll  pass the word on to our family of congressional organization heads. I'm sure I can get them to reconsider, given the importance of your 'commitments' should you maintain a presence in the caucus.

True,  you generally need to pay to play.  But in doing so it also degrades the integrity of your campaign.  Hard for principled people to advance in politics.

 

[hodad]

I love it when politicians say they follow the science....

So much better when they follow "hunches."

 

[hodad]

"Azar tapped a trusted aide with minimal public health experience to lead the agency’s day-to-day response to COVID-19. The aide, Brian Harrison, had joined the department after running a dog-breeding business for six years. "

This is one of Trump's "people" who are supposed to handle the details while Trump blathers on in self-aggrandizing semi-coherence.  I dare say all that conservative optimism is rather misplaced.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-usa-hhschief-speci/special-report-hhs-chief-azar-had-aide-former-dog-breeder-steer-pandemic-task-force-idUSKCN2243CE

 

[hodad]

A peer reviewed study is far less of a "hunch" than that new grasp imo.......

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0924857920300996

regardless of any reasons for not wanting to pay attention to it.....

It was a study of 28 patients--less than a tenth of the VA study.  The other evidence I've seen from a New Orleans ER doctor, purely anecdotal, but he wrote that in his ER there was no evidence that hydroxychloroquine was doing any good at all. 

At this point I'd think it's fair to say it's not going to be the wonder drug it was touted as.  It may be of benefit in a limited number of cases, or at a certain point in the disease, but it has serious risks.  And as of this point,  the cautious, thorough science that would help to figure this out is not there, and HQ shouldn't have been touted as a wonder drug by a certain authority figure. 

 

[hodad]

No, still a hunch.  Trustworthy scientists and medical professionals were saying that from the first--while there may be some anecdotal evidence of it having beneficial effects, it needs to be studied.  As some here like to point out in other contexts, correlation is not causation.  If one or two patients improve dramatically (while many others don't), it's not time to start spouting off about it being a wonder drug (as some idiot did.)  It's a good time to study its usefulness, certainly.  But it really doesn't appear to do much good.  Another study: 
https://groupdiy.com/index.php?action=post;topic=74718.320;last_msg=949452

"I think it's going to be great," Trump said at a White House briefing on March 19.

That is a hunch.  Plain and simple.

 

[volker]

His latest stroke of genius: injecting disinfectant  ;D ;D.

How he comes up with more stupid ideas by the day is really quite the feat.

 

[Script]

. In Gangelt, people who had no or only mild symptoms

Wasn't that study result debated hotly because the testing was non-specific? Meaning, so-and-so many people had some immunity against a coronavirus, as in one amomg the many there are, but nobody knows which coronavirus exactly ?

 

[Script]

Last sentence in that article the most interesting :

Questions remain about whether antibodies for COVID-19 in people who've survived the illness provide immunity.

Answer: they don't know yet. And with that, down the drain goes the entire herd-inmunity discourse. For now, it's nothing but assumption.

And while pure assumption is hardly ever the smart way, building a political strategies around that...

 

[Script]

millions of people could be walking around with this thing.

No proof yet, but that's what I strongly believe too... And hence the social distancing.

 

[Scodiddly]

His latest stroke of genius: injecting disinfectant  ;D ;D.

How he comes up with more stupid ideas by the day is really quite the feat.

And today we find out that he doesn't understand how "sarcasm" works either.

So the politics of COVID-19 are that the President of the United States is an idiot, but still has to be taken seriously. 

 

[kambo]

looks like a lot of idiots  dont understand "sarcasm"

 

[Script]

And the infection fatality rate??

What about it? Some hospitals are (still) so hopelessly overwhelmed that the fatality rate there is quite high / too high. What more do we need to know?

Which phase are we in, hope or denial ?

 

[Script]

The 2017/2018 influenza season, yeah. Wasn't that the year they had fucked up one of the two vaccination cocktails? Worldwide phenomenon, as far as I remember.
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Sorry to hear about you dad in law. COPD, yes, then you know what's going on in hospitals around the world.

What I want to hear and read about is NOT trigger-happy 'herd immunity' arguments that pop up seconds after a study has surfaced that might or might not contain something hopeful, but nobody can possibly tell because samples were too small, test methods not standard, etc etc. It's all still too early for that.

What I'd rather like to read more about is...
(1)
detailed studies about the health conditions of those who needed to be hospitalized and got released. How are they doing? Truly fully recovered? If not, what and how severe the damage? What GOLD stage? II or III or IV ? Curable ?  Chronic ? 
(2)
More reliable tests results on immunity. Life-long? Very unlikely. But if immune to some degree, for how long ? Still too early to tell.
(3)
Proponents of herd-immunity stop disussing the concept by blowing hot air and instead go test it out by either voluntering as hospital staff for example or deliberately getting exposed to the virus several times to proof to us that they are indeed immune. Honestly, especially this second to  last one (volunteering where staff is dearly needed) is what I want to read about.

 

[JohnRoberts]

The 2017/2018 influenza season, yeah. Wasn't that the year they had f**ked up one of the two vaccination cocktails? Worldwide phenomenon, as far as I remember.
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Sorry to hear about you dad in law. COPD, yes, then you know what's going on in hospitals around the world.

What I want to hear and read about is NOT trigger-happy 'herd immunity' arguments that pop up seconds after a study has surfaced that might or might not contain something hopeful, but nobody can possibly tell because samples were too small, test methods not standard, etc etc. It's all still too early for that.

What I'd rather like to read more about is...
(1)
detailed studies about the health conditions of those who needed to be hospitalized and got released. How are they doing? Truly fully recovered? If not, what and how severe the damage? What GOLD stage? II or III or IV ? Curable ?  Chronic ? 
(2)
More reliable tests results on immunity. Life-long? Very unlikely. But if immune to some degree, for how long ? Still too early to tell.
(3)
Proponents of herd-immunity stop disussing the concept by blowing hot air and instead go test it out by either voluntering as hospital staff for example or deliberately getting exposed to the virus several times to proof to us that they are indeed immune. Honestly, especially this second to  last one (volunteering where staff is dearly needed) is what I want to read about.

+1

It is hard to parse out useful data from the breathless media, rewarded by scaring viewers into watching,,, but.

It appears in the US at least a high incidence of dense localized deaths occurred in senior care facilities. In hindsight this is logical and a potential lesson we can apply to better protect the fragile among us. Since this is far from over and will come around again.

The fraction of patients who recover after being put on ventilators is not great, but unclear what exactly this is telling us?  We have much to learn still.

JR

PS: I am not a huge fan of flu shots and did not get one last year. The year before I let my former doctor talk me into two different flu(?) shots. Maybe this year it might be sensible to try flu vaccine again (I'm old). Apparently there are multiple flus going around and vaccines only protect against their best guess of which ones will be dominant.

 

[hodad]

Cuomo's response to Mitch McConnell's latest idiocy:  "Let me just go back to my self-proclaimed Grim Reaper, Senator McConnell, for another second. He represents the state of Kentucky. Okay? When it comes to fairness, New York state puts much more money into the federal pot than it takes out. Okay? At the end of the year, we put into that federal pot $116 billion more than we take out. Okay? His state, the state of Kentucky, takes out 148 billion more than they put in. Okay? So he’s a federal legislator. He’s distributing the federal pot of money. New York puts in more money to the federal pot than it takes out. His state takes out more than it puts in. Senator McConnell, who’s getting bailed out here? It’s your state that is living on the money that we generate. Your state is getting bailed out. Not my state."

The truth that conservative red-staters can't handle is that they are the real welfare queens that Reagan so famously talked about.  They are the takers, feet propped up and hands out, crying, "Gimme!  Gimme!  Gimme!" 

 

[JohnRoberts]

Cuomo's response to Mitch McConnell's latest idiocy:  "Let me just go back to my self-proclaimed Grim Reaper, Senator McConnell, for another second. He represents the state of Kentucky. Okay? When it comes to fairness, New York state puts much more money into the federal pot than it takes out. Okay? At the end of the year, we put into that federal pot $116 billion more than we take out. Okay? His state, the state of Kentucky, takes out 148 billion more than they put in. Okay? So he’s a federal legislator. He’s distributing the federal pot of money. New York puts in more money to the federal pot than it takes out. His state takes out more than it puts in. Senator McConnell, who’s getting bailed out here? It’s your state that is living on the money that we generate. Your state is getting bailed out. Not my state."

The truth that conservative red-staters can't handle is that they are the real welfare queens that Reagan so famously talked about.  They are the takers, feet propped up and hands out, crying, "Gimme!  Gimme!  Gimme!"

When exchanges sink to name calling that is usually a sign that the arguments have no real merit.

====
Only a small minority of states pay more to the fed than they get back (around 10 of them). I just checked and GA is also sucking on that same government teat. Does that mean they are all "welfare queens" too?

If Cuomo is trying to win friends and influence people to secure the federal aid to states legislation in play, this does not seem like a productive negotiating strategy.  : Cuomo is also using his new found public platform to push back against the Salt tax law change, unpopular with legislators from the high tax northeast.


JR

PS: Now even Bill Maher is pushing back against helicopter money deficit spending... (a blind squirrel finds the occasional nut). This makes two unexpected pearls of wisdom from him. He recently criticized the opposition media for making President Trump look correct when claiming fake news.