Sunset sound

[living sounds]

I can read and am very familiar with the numbers. I note you failed to address the issue of sales tax, gas tax, and other consumption taxes which burden the lower income people disproportionately.

I also see you haven't said boo about people on the dole for life. Social safety nets should be short term mechanisms, not a lifestyle. How much of the taxes collected go to these programs? Over 30% (and that is excluding Social Security, which if properly managed should be mostly self-funded).

Typical leftist view which is to take more money from the hard-working people, launder it through a giant inefficient bureaucracy or three, and then give it away like candy. Better to reduce spending and waste so that everyone's tax burden can be lowered.


LOL. You are clueless. Do you think only billionaires here are going to be paying for unrealized gains (and just taking the L "for the good of society" or somesuch bs)? Next you'll reveal that you want unrealized gains on real estate or other personal property to be taxed. Oh, and let's eliminate the IRA and 401(k) tax shelters, too, right? Wouldn't want to encourage people to save, plan ahead, and be financially independent in retirement.

Please stop putting words in my mouth. Thank you.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Please stop putting words in my mouth. Thank you.

I didn't. I observed what you failed to address. And noted the obvious flaws in your "thinking." Stop playing victim when someone responds to your bad ideas with a different take.

I'll be direct since you can't take a hint or afraid to reveal your position. Where do you stand on taxation of IRAs, 401(k) plans, and unrealized gains in those financial instruments?

 

[living sounds]

I'll be direct since you can't take a hint or afraid to reveal your position. Where do you stand on taxation of IRAs, 401(k) plans, and unrealized gains in those financial instruments?

I hope for the sake of your health that you don't go to bars and talk to people with different opinions than yours the way you write here...

 

[AnalogPackrat]

So why continue to support the .01% paying less than middle class working people?

Flat tax.

Mark to market accounting is trivial to implement.

Please. And you claim to be for simplifying the tax system? On what (artificial) time increment should these unrealized gains be measured? I'm sure that won't be gamed <sarcasm>

And who keeps it overly complicated? An army of CPA lobbyists.

That's only part of the problem. You've also got big gov lefties looking for one more untapped tax revenue stream, clueless idealists who think life can be made fair by government fiat, and wealthy people looking for loopholes (the later closing of which usually introduces more complexity to exploited in the next round).

 

[AnalogPackrat]

I hope for the sake of your health that you don't go to bars and talk to people with different opinions than yours the way you write here...

What concern is that to you? Your non-answer of the IRA/401(k) question is noted.

 

[living sounds]

What concern is that to you? Your non-answer of the IRA/401(k) question is noted.

Great. Write it down in your little book of grievances. Make sure you talk about it next Festivus.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Great. Write it down in your little book of grievances. Make sure you talk about it next Festivus.

I guess you can't make a coherent argument supporting your position.

 

[living sounds]

I guess you can't make a coherent argument supporting your position.

Since you are doing such a great job imagining positions I am supposedly holding, there is really no point in it. And I've got real work to do.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Lets talk more about things less about people.

JR

 

[crazydoc]

I didn't. I observed what you failed to address. And noted the obvious flaws in your "thinking." Stop playing victim when someone responds to your bad ideas with a different take.

I guess you can't make a coherent argument supporting your position.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Since you are doing such a great job imagining positions I am supposedly holding, there is really no point in it. And I've got real work to do.

You can clear it up by stating them. Pretty simple.

 

[living sounds]

You can clear it up by stating them. Pretty simple.

I wasn't making any policy statements. Just the fact how deficit spending for the ultra rich works. The rest was in your own head.

 

[JohnRoberts]

lets try not to make this personal

JR

 

[AnalogPackrat]

I wasn't making any policy statements. Just the fact how deficit spending for the ultra rich works. The rest was in your own head.

Just advocating for taxing unrealized gains. Deficit spending, as the name implies, is primarily a spending problem.

 

[living sounds]

Just advocating for taxing unrealized gains. Deficit spending, as the name implies, is primarily a spending problem.

I was pointing out the problem. How best to address it is an entirely different question. And yes, very rich people getting constantly and quickly richer from their wealth and them not having to pay taxes for it is related to other problems. I am pointing out big picture problems, you adress a singular question that I didn't ask. There is no point in continuing that.

 

[AnalogPackrat]

I was pointing out the problem. How best to address it is an entirely different question. And yes, very rich people getting constantly and quickly richer from their wealth and them not having to pay taxes for it is related to other problems. I am pointing out big picture problems, you adress a singular question that I didn't ask. There is no point in continuing that.

Yet they are, in fact, paying taxes. A majority of collected income taxes is paid by the top couple of percent. Capital gains are taxed. Consumption is taxed by various means (sales tax, personal property tax, fuel tax, hotel tax, etc.). Your notion of the causes of problems is nonsensical. Your "big picture" is constructed from a mosaic of falsehoods and assumptions.

 

[JohnRoberts]

I was pointing out the problem. How best to address it is an entirely different question. And yes, very rich people getting constantly and quickly richer from their wealth and them not having to pay taxes for it is related to other problems. I am pointing out big picture problems, you adress a singular question that I didn't ask. There is no point in continuing that.

Sadly that is an all too popular class warfare screed... used for centuries because a) there are fewer really wealthy people and b) a vast majority population who are not wealthy, or as wealthy. The wealthy do not have numbers on their side.

Taxing income is well established, taxing wealth or assets is problematic. As the saying goes if you want less of something tax it... more wealth is good. We could benefit from more wealthy people, not less. I have never been hired to work for a business operated by a poor person.

Prosperity and property rights are inextricably linked. The importance of having well-defined and strongly protected property rights is now widely recognized among economists and policymakers. A private property system gives individuals the exclusive right to use their resources as they see fit. That dominion over what is theirs leads property users to take full account of all the benefits and costs of employing those resources in a particular manner. The process of weighing costs and benefits produces what economists call efficient outcomes.

https://www.libertarianism.org/publications/essays/property-rights-key-economic-development

class and class struggle were fundamental to Marx’s conception of history. His claims are affirmed as it is shown that upper-class demands for surplus and lower-class resistance have driven the evolution of society from the Bronze Age to the present and were critical to the passage from the tributary mode of production to the capitalist mode of production. Class struggle exists in all class-based societies but was particularly acute in China and the West. In Classical Antiquity class antagonism mainly took the form of peasant/landlord struggle but also expressed itself in conflict between slave and master. In modern times the bourgeoisie engaged in a two-sided struggle against both the landlord class and against the working class. Its struggle against the latter is ongoing. The state, culture, and ideology are key components of class struggle.

This is getting a little repetitive.

JR

 

[living sounds]

Again, have a look at the facts in the link I provided. It shows that the overall system is regressive, and this does not even include the "use wealth as collateral to avoid taxable events" option truly wealthy people have.

 

[JohnRoberts]

Those damn wealthy people..... luckily there isn't that many of them... maybe we can make it so there are less of them.

JR

 

[AnalogPackrat]

Again, have a look at the facts in the link I provided. It shows that the overall system is regressive, and this does not even include the "use wealth as collateral to avoid taxable events" option truly wealthy people have.

Maybe work hard to make your own wealth instead of being jealous of, or offended by, that of others. Life simply isn't "fair" the way you think it should be. Wanting to control others (including what they do with their wealth) is a sure sign of authoritarianism.