covid politics
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crazydoc
Well-known member
Well, look at that. No one has died of covid in Florida for the last week. That's wonderful.Great job, Ron!
https://www.bing.com/covid/local/florida_unitedstates
Gee whiz - and I was so stoked.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/f...in-pandemic-history/ar-AANMJG2?ocid=bingcovid
Duh!
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/poli...-cases-were-surging/ar-AANWGvU?ocid=bingcovid
pucho812
Well-known member
why is i when they fudge the numbers by either party , if it's the party you support it's not a big deal or some other excuse, but when it's the opposition it becomes a talking point to further your parties talking points?
crazydoc
Well-known member
You got some evidence to support that accusation?
pucho812
Well-known member
wasn't accusing anyone so much as making a general statement and comment on the state of affairs.
for example I am in California and watching our governor face a recall. I bet you if newsroom said no masks tomorrow those who support the recall effort would then say he wants you to not wear a mask he doesn't care about you. those that support him would be saying how crazy people are for wearing masks.
Here's the study (a preprint, not peer-reviewed, etc.):Oh and.... Every study is contradicted by another study. Oh and.... That's my point.
Do you have any idea? I suspect not.
You've better.. blah blah blah.
Man.. Liberals have the lousiest attitudes.
Oh, and Maybe a "MSN" link is more to your liking and will make you feel better.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/a...nt-to-get-vaccinated-against-covid/ar-AANjRHh
That's possible but did you even read the study? Oh, and you'd be better served if... oh never mind
The shitty attitudes are remarkable. Is that a side effect of being vaccinated?
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.20.21260795v1.full.pdf
Dense reading, and not a full reporting of their findings. Though the sample size is quite large, I'm not sure the methodology is going to give the best results. Most highly educated is certainly debatable for PhDs--a category that generally doesn't include medical doctors, lawyers, and a lot of other highly educated folks--categories with far lower rates of vaccine hesitancy. And I've known more than my fair share of PhDs--they may have gone to school for a long time, but not all of them are all that smart.
So if I'm reading it right, in the initial survey, the most hesitant were the least educated groups. As time went on, those groups became less hesitant. The group that did not become less hesitant is PhDs--their recalcitrance remained more or less stable. Interesting, but as the study says, Further investigation into hesitancy among those with a PhD is warranted.
EDIT:
The study employs a novel sampling method with a soft ask and low
response rate, the effect of which has not yet been fully studied. Or so says the study.
They also note it's not a representative sampling. My own non-representative sampling of PhDs in my friend/family circle would indicate a 100% vaccination rate. But maybe I just hang out with a better class of PhDs.
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scott2000
Well-known member
Looking at FL demographics, it's not clear how they are calculating the total state vaccination rate. Seems there are around a half a million undocumented sections of the population if looking at the "others" and "unknowns" which may account for the 300% vavccination rates etc... This could mean less of the documented population of FL is actually vaccinated? IDK...
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scott2000
Well-known member
It's unclear what this means. Obviously weird thing happen when reporting changes. It's happened in the past like with the probable deaths etc...
Confusing. Reporting a bunch of deaths and then making that number smaller as things are properly placed in the timeline vs the opposite I guess? Even the CDC tracking of deaths is confusing and the numbers change across the timeline constantly because of the way things are reported or delayed.
Seems it would be best to use the daily hospital reports as a metric but it's not clear what those mean anyway so maybe not.
fallout
Well-known member
I work with PhDs EVERY DAY have to agree with this statement 100%!
I disagree with this somewhat as most doctors and healthcare workers that I know didn't get vaccinated until it was mandated that they do. Obviously some got vaccinated voluntarily but many didn't until their employment was in jeopardy. I'm not opposed to vaccinations but forcing people is beyond ridiculous especially since some of these people already had Covid.
It's bizarre that natural immunity isn't talked about more. I've already lost count of how many people I know both personally and professionally that got Covid (myself included) and don't know a single person who was reinfected. I'm sure there are exceptions but they are RARE. I don't see any reason to force someone who was previously infected to get vaccinated, at least not at this point in time. FWIW, I was infected back in November and get tested for antibodies regularly and at almost a year later, there's no sign that my natural immunity is waning.
Again, my concern is not the vaccines. I'm opposed to mandates, vaccine passports and that sort of BS.
Natural immunity is actually talked about quite a bit. At this point, they think protection from Delta provided by prior infection is not as significant as protection provided by the vaccines. The science is certainly preliminary.
Anecdotally: I know at least one person who had COVID & was recently reinfected. Also, all the doctors I know didn't hesitate to get vaccinated.
fallout
Well-known member
It's obvious you'll refute everything I say but 'they' (whoever that might be, I'll assume virologists/scientists?) also say that natural immunity is more effective than vaccines against the delta. So who's right?
Shall we play a round of 'the link game'? Is your link better than my link? Do you have more links? Is your link bigger?
I thought anything anecdotal is considered bullshit here? Isn't that the way this game works? Oh right.. Only when it supports a viewpoint. Got it.
I have 25 doctor friends who say.............
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fallout
Well-known member
A rhetorical question (re: MANDATES)
If the vaccinated can still contract and transmit the virus, why require only the unvaccinated employees to be Covid tested on a weekly basis?
If the vaccinated can still contract and transmit the virus, why require only the unvaccinated employees to be Covid tested on a weekly basis?
PermO
Well-known member
Please don't make too much sense, you might break the scam 
crazydoc
Well-known member
Evidence? Data?
fallout
Well-known member
I promised not to play 'the link game' but..
https://www.science.org/content/art...er-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital
https://fortune.com/2021/08/27/covid-natural-immunity-vaccine-delta-variant-pfizer-protection/
..and again, since it seems anecdotal bullshit is allowed. I live in an area where the 'delta' is supposedly running rampant. I don't know a single soul that had Covid get re-infected (vaccinated or not). However, I do know quite a few folks who were not previously infected with Covid and were vaccinated who wound up getting Covid, some mild cases and some not so mild. This seems to be age dependent (as was the original round of Covid / pre-vaccine availability). That said, I'll make my own health decisions guided by advice from my doctor. Thanks.
Again, my argument is not/has not been whether one should get vaccinated or not. There's merit in both opinions. I personally don't care if someone chooses to get vaccinated. I do have a problem with forced vaccinations.
I've yet to hear a compelling argument for mandates.
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john12ax7
Well-known member
Who thinks that? That is contrary to how immunology generally works based on a century of evidence. The data suggests otherwise as well.
https://www.science.org/content/art...er-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital
Edit : I see the link was also posted above in response.
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fallout
Well-known member
scott2000
Well-known member
A scam? To rid the world of gesundheits and replace them with dirty looks?Please don't make too much sense, you might break the scam
Did you read the link? I'm willing to admit that new findings indicate that what I had previously read was wrong. But did you read it? Sez right there that even a single dose of Pfizer on top of prior infection offers significantly better protection than just an infection. And yet here you are bragging about all the protection from your prior infection. If you followed the science, you'd get a shot. (Also, this study focuses on Pfizer. I just saw this story that Moderna creates twice as many antibodies as Pfizer, so Moderna might measure up differently. Moderna makes twice as many antibodies as Pfizer, study says )
Of course, my anecdotal "bullshit" was prefaced with a note to say it was anecdotal. Unlike your anecdotal comments I responded to where you noted nothing of the sort.
To quote:
Do you even pay attention to what you're writing?
EDIT: The authors of the study STRONGLY recommend against getting COVID for that extra immunity. So if you weren't "lucky" enough to have gotten covid in an earlier wave, better get vaxxed.
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fallout
Well-known member
LMFAO.. You've got to be kidding me? I don't remotely care what a single dose of "Pfizer" does for someone who was previously infected. Are you arguing just for the sake of arguing? Also, who the hell is bragging about anything?
It appears some of the vax'ed become extremely defensive about their decision.
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