the new "only" Covid thread

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With the general information overflow today commercials on top would truly drive me nuts.
It's sometimes difficult to follow the logic of understanding there are crazy things going on related to the pharma industry, and being excited for them finding new ways to help us at the same time. Like patting your head and rubbing your belly at the same time..or wait...

if we accept that lot's of people will die and if we're prepared to deal with long-term consequences for many who didn't die but got chronic illnesses from it.
Sounds like it could be the mission statement from many businesses. Food,etc....
There is such an obvious disdain for life that permeates so many things these days I for one would probably elect to take my chances moving on as opposed to keeping me on some pharmaceutical life support for who knows how long.
 
I for one would probably elect to take my chances moving on as opposed to keeping me on some pharmaceutical life support for who knows how long.
Assuming the drugs would have a reasonable chance of returing you to an acceptable quality of life, it may be worth it to be on life support for awhile. That's for each individual to determine for him/her self, and why many of us have advance directives, especially as we age and are more likely to need them.
 
"Forced on everyone", hmm, that's not the case in Japan, and also not in many EU countries, as far as I know. Is that a US-specific thing ?

(Aside: Didn't they introduce some legislation recently in the US that makes abortion difficult for women ? Is that part of one and the the same culturally specific pattern or a different story ?)
 
Aside: Didn't they introduce some legislation recently in the US that makes abortion difficult for women ? Is that part of one and the the same culturally specific pattern or a different story ?
Yes. "Bodily autonomy" only applies to men: you should only be "forced" to do things if you are capable of being pregnant.
 
"Forced on everyone", hmm, that's not the case in Japan, and also not in many EU countries, as far as I know. Is that a US-specific thing ?
Hardly a US only thing. Also many countries have vaccine requirements for entry from abroad.

https://www.reuters.com/business/he...aking-covid-19-vaccines-mandatory-2021-08-16/
(Aside: Didn't they introduce some legislation recently in the US that makes abortion difficult for women ? Is that part of one and the the same culturally specific pattern or a different story ?)
No. An unconstitutional decision made by our Supreme Court 49 years ago was overturned. Abortion regulation is returned to individual states. The central issue with abortion is at what point does a fetus become a person with the same rights as anyone else. It isn't the same as vaccine mandates because at some point other lives are affected.
 
Well, in Japan vaccination had always been entirely voluntary right from the start. Pretty high uptake though, despite of that or maybe because of it.

Right now, anyone who wants to visit Japan needs to be vaccinated (Sinovac is fine too), test negative in PCR within 72 hours prior to entry, and have travel health insurance that covers Covid. Makes sense -- for now. But sooner than later it will change to negative PCR only.

Oh, and despite 32C plus in the shade, mask wearing is at 98%. Masks are mandatory anywhere indoors and wherever there are many people around. One reason people do this voluntarily is because not everybody can afford unpaid COVID infection holidays and nobody wants to force such holidays on others. Makes sense ?
 
If nearly everyone is vaccinated, why wear masks and why worry about outsiders bringing the defeated virus into Japan? Oh. Right. Everyone is getting it regardless of shots or not. My wife is a nurse and must wear N95, face mask, etc. at work. She got it anyway and so did I. Half the staff also has had it regardless of shot or not.
 
Again, sounds like a very US-specific thing (thinking ?).

As for Japan, I'd assume they don't want to be in a position again where they cannot treat everybody the way they otherwise could. Seems to me they care a lot about their elderly people (one of the oldest countries demographically, all core voters BTW) and they also care about their low-income earners and irregularly employed people (of which there are a lot in Japan). This has little to do with foreigners visiting or not. But if foreigners visit and catch the virus here, requiring hospitalisation, it would mean one bed less for their own kin. Quite protective indeed.
 
My great-great grandfather read about vaccination sceptics in the newspapers around the turn of the second-to-last century. Not that new at all indeed. Seems that arguments too haven't changed that much either
 
Terrible article.

"The vaccine was not studied in an unethical, impossible randomized-controlled trial of a million children."

Straw man. No one is arguing that. The Covid vaccines were never fully and tested through normal standards with ADULTS. No long term risk data exist. They were given EUA in the US (and presumably most other places) based on fear. The risk of death from Covid for children is miniscule.

"Though it is rare and nearly always mild, the vaccine can cause myocarditis in adolescents, not younger children."

It isn't always mild and has killed adolescents and young, healthy adults. What does the 7th point of the Nuremberg Code say?

"These doctors are right that many children have contracted COVID. In an ideal world, they’d reflect on how their failed predictions of “herd immunity by April” and relentless vaccine fear-mongering helped create this widespread “natural immunity” with all its consequences."

When you lock down and do all the other fear-dancing, you don't get herd immunity. Hiding in the basement until ineffective and still experimental "vaccines" are available didn't work out, either.

Horrible fear-mongering here.
"So far, COVID has killed over 500 children under 5 years. That’s a tragically large number, and it’s higher every time I check it."

First of all, of course the cumulative number will never decrease. Duh. So the logic here is that we should vaccinate millions (over 20M kids in the US are 5 or younger) of healthy children and expose them all to the unknown longer term risks of these new experimental vaccines to maybe save 250 per year? Over a two year period. The Covid fatality rate for this age group is 1/80,000. The graph trying to compare to measles shows measles cases, not deaths. The measles fatality rate prior to the (properly tested and actually effective) vaccine ranged from 8/100,000 to 18/100,000. Much higher than Covid in the 0-5 age group (or even 0-30).

http://skepchick.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/G14.7-US-Measles-RM-1900-1987.png
"The argument boils down to- the vaccine won’t help that many children. I think that’s a horrible argument. I think doctors should strive to have zero children suffer or die for lack of a vaccine. This shouldn’t be controversial."

Well, you cannot simply ignore the known and unknown risks of the vaccine in this ridiculous "analysis." First do no harm. Risk/reward must be evaluated at the least.
 
[Reall an aside]

As for the referendum: interesting result. Looks like some Kansas women are wiser than some men in charge. [/aside]
When does the fetus become a person with rights like everyone else? Once some compromise answer to that question is made the rest of the decisions are simple. Trying to equate mandated experimental "vaccines" with limited efficacy to abortion, where at some point one or more lives other than the mother are involved is ridiculous.
 
When does the fetus become a person with rights like everyone else?
That is the central question... Unlike electronics there is not a simple objective answer to when an unborn's rights equal or supersede the mother's rights. I do not know the answer to that.

Modern science has learned a lot about the unborn at different lengths of gestation but the relative rights tradeoff is still subjective.

[edit] for another data point about how subjective the age of when right to life begins, honor killings suggest that some think it is OK to kill their fully grown children if they dishonor the family. :rolleyes: [/edit]

Good luck with that, glad it's not my job.

JR
 
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